17 minutes ago, enigma said:

So many people talking about Potter being mediocre is a bit ridiculous. He obviously isn't a bad manager, just maybe come into a club like Chelsea at a bad time. Again, 30+ players in the squad, coming in without pre-season, constant injuries to key players throughout the season so no settled side etc, it's not an ideal time to have come into a club like chelsea at the best of times, let alone with all the upheaval of the club the past 8 months or so.

I don't think many managers, regardless of their success, would have done that much better tbh. It's a bit different since January as we did strengthen a fair bit so we needed to see more improvement than we have, but we've also had injuries throughout the season. Missing Kante was big for us this season and he hasn't played at all under Potter this season until yesterday.

I know it's easy to put all the blame on the coach, but it's not simple when going through situations. People will point to the likes of De Zerbi or Brentford, Fulham etc, but they have zero pressure on them to succeed, we do as a big club. Arsenal are the same this season, zero pressure to achieve what they have, it helps massively. But again, I think he's a decent manager just come at the wrong time. Maybe there would never have been a good time for him to coach us, but I don't agree that he's all of a sudden a poor coach because of this season. 

Look at our CL campaign. Tuchel started off poorly in the CL, Potter came in and we went on an undefeated run, beating AC Milan (who are now quarter finalists) twice and making it look pretty easy. Going down at Dortmund at then beating Dortmund to advance in the next leg. If people are going to criticise the negatives about his coaching, at least give him credit for the positives we have had this season. 

Well, when Emery came in at Villa they were near the relegation places. Now he's scored the 3rd highest points since and gone above us and scored more goals than us. He too didn't have a pre-season and neither does he have a squad as good as ours. Every manager in the PL is facing huge pressure with 3-4 losing their jobs every season. Doesn't matter whether you coach Chelsea or Villa or Fulham, the pressure is the same. Potter may not be a mediocre coach but at the moment he is simply not good enough for a team with title ambitions. Every decent manager can get occasional good results and beat top teams from time to time. That doesn't mean that they all are good enough to manage the top teams.

4 hours ago, Tubbs Tattsyrup said:

Todd should just hold his hands up and say, yep, I screwed up completely with the Potter appointment (just look at Potter’s CV to remind yourselves how two half decent seasons at Brighton was never enough to justify him coming to SW6). If it means he is bulleted after the Liverpool game (and frankly how he is still in the job is beyond me), I would happily see us tonked 3 nil by the vermin. The season is over so bring in anyone on a temp basis until May and then hope Todd gets the next appointment right (although I wouldn’t bank on that). He has waltzed in here in arrogant American fashion, sacked everyone in sight, spent a fortune on new players when he didn’t actually need to……and he is now reaping what he has sown. What a circus.

You wanted us to lose to Spurs and now this you ain't a Chelsea fan you've been banned countless times just give it up mate .

3 minutes ago, OriginalS said:

Of course you think that when you genuinely thought we had one or two shots a game for several months under him. But then a guy thankfully responded with the factual truth and you were of course way off.

You looked at Tuchel in the most negative way possible but at Potter with the biggest rose tinted glasses in the world. There isn't improvement in any way shape or form. We create some decent chances offensively simply because we have some top class players there now in Enzo & Felix but there is still no structure to us, there is still no coherent pressing, there are still no goals, and there is still a pathetic mentality from the manager every single time he opens his mouth. Mr.Excuses is what he should be called and you may be the only supporters left who's bought what he's selling.

Cheers mate saved me a reply to Potters mate

4 minutes ago, OriginalS said:

Of course you think that when you genuinely thought we had one or two shots a game for several months under him. But then a guy thankfully responded with the factual truth and you were of course way off.

You looked at Tuchel in the most negative way possible but at Potter with the biggest rose tinted glasses in the world. There isn't improvement in any way shape or form. We create some decent chances offensively simply because we have some top class players there now in Enzo & Felix but there is still no structure to us, there is still no coherent pressing, there are still no goals, and there is still a pathetic mentality from the manager every single time he opens his mouth. Mr.Excuses is what he should be called and you may be the only supporters left who's bought what he's selling.

Go back and read the match threads during the end of the Tuchel reign.  Then come back and tell me we were playing better then. There was 1 game when we didnt even manage a single shot on target ffs!

8 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

You not been watching the performances? the creating multiple opportunities? the uptick in attacking football?

All huge signs of improvement on what we were seeing at the end of tuchels reign.

not yet translating into consistent wins....but again...long term. 

There has been a lot of positive indicators.

Some of your points can't be argued with but at the end of the day we are in a results based business.

The horizon scan, forecast or sales performance of a Manager at a big chain like Waitrose will attract different pressures under the same economic conditions as a Manager of your local corner shop. 

That I think is the key thing, I'm firmly on the side of stability and long term but my argument is that GP is not the one to oversee that mission. 

He can't give what he doesn't have. Anyone can set up a good group of players to pass slick, fast, nice but at the end of day the tactical input should show us what the team is trying to do and the end results too. 

It's quite common to hear people in the game say at the end of the day get the win or points on the board however badly you play. 

What good is it when you play good 100% of the time and lose or rather not win in near 70% of the time. 

I have no agenda against anyone here or GP, my agenda is 100% about Chelsea being where we should be. We might not win the league or cups and that itself is not such a big deal for me as I don't see one single club having the right to trophies in the way some might do but what we shouldn't let fester is mediocrity because it has a knock on effect on nearly all aspects of the clubs future, moreso, off the pitch. 

3 minutes ago, OneTommyLangley said:

Cheers mate saved me a reply to Potters mate

I am potters mate because I dont want us to lose, and because I think that this rebuild will take time??? Riiiggghhhhtttt.....

...No wonder the world is in a mess when small boys like you are allowed to vote.

7 minutes ago, Nick05 said:

Well, when Emery came in at Villa they were near the relegation places. Now he's scored the 3rd highest points since and gone above us and scored more goals than us. He too didn't have a pre-season and neither does he have a squad as good as ours. Every manager in the PL is facing huge pressure with 3-4 losing their jobs every season. Doesn't matter whether you coach Chelsea or Villa or Fulham, the pressure is the same. Potter may not be a mediocre coach but at the moment he is simply not good enough for a team with title ambitions. Every decent manager can get occasional good results and beat top teams from time to time. That doesn't mean that they all are good enough to manage the top teams.

Emery is just another manager that is better than Potter, it's that simple.

5 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

Go back and read the match threads during the end of the Tuchel reign.  Then come back and tell me we were playing better then. There was 1 game when we didnt even manage a single shot on target ffs!

Don't need too thanks. I and everyone else knows we were much, much better.

I think you've been a good poster historically but you are making a bit of a fool of yourselves with these excuses for Potter in my opinion.

 

7 minutes ago, Nick05 said:

Well, when Emery came in at Villa they were near the relegation places. Now he's scored the 3rd highest points since and gone above us and scored more goals than us.

When I evaluated our chances GP appointment I said there were clearly 7 or 8 managers better than him so we should be coming ariund 8th or 9th. I revised that to 9th or 10thh when Emery was appointed and actually said yo watch Villa move up the table and get past us. 

Look people can say whatever they want to say about patience and time but the simple truth is you can't give what you don't have. GP didn't start managing today, he's been in football management for over a decade and there has been no wow factor that appeals to any big team. And yes I support nobodies (in terms of achievement) being given a chance but it isn't an experiment that should be prolonged because I will always rationally argue for more time for a manager that has done it before over one that hasn't. 

18 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

@Mod

You are welcome. 

Now on ignore. Twat

Haha. Thanks for the favour as I don't know how to do it myself on a mobile. 

You qualified for an ignore long ago. 

A fair and logical take from Mark Goldbridge on Potter and Chelsea this season. Pretty much echoes what I think. 

 

 

14 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

I am potters mate because I dont want us to lose, and because I think that this rebuild will take time??? Riiiggghhhhtttt.....

...No wonder the world is in a mess when small boys like you are allowed to vote.

Jim you are having a bit of a rant and that's fine. I don't think Potter is of any value to our club and the sooner he is removed the better.

suggest you have a nice cup of tea and step away from the keyboard. 😂

Edited April 2, 20233 yr by OneTommyLangley

1 minute ago, OriginalS said:

Don't need too thanks. I and everyone else knows we were much, much better.

I think you've been a good poster historically but you are making a bit of a fool of yourselves with these excuses for Potter in my opinion.

 

For the 500th time they are not excuses for Potter! I have consistently said he has not been good enough and that I am not convinced he is the answer for us!

My position is clear.

- I think the club has been broken for years. I think it was broken under the last 4-5 managers, and we have been going through a constant cycle of putting plasters over gaping wounds.

- In my opinion, the club needed a hard reset, both with the players and the culture. Moving away from the short term thinking of mend and make do. It looks like Todd and Co are trying to do that.

- I think this will take time to do. Rome wasnt built in a day. New Chelsea wont be built in 6 months, or probably even 12 months.

- I think anyone expecting such a change of direction to happen instantaneously, without ups and downs is unrealistic (at best) or delusional/stupid (at worst).

- I was bored of the football Sarri played. I was bored of the sh*t served up at the end of Franks time. I was bored sh*tless at the dirge served up at the end of Tuchels Reign. So far, I have been bored under potter - but over the past 5-6 games, have seen improvements in our chance creation and attacking intent. 

So...for the 501st time. I am not excusing Potter. He has been underwhelming and mostly poor both in the results he has delivered, the stylistic changes he has tried to implement and his public messaging. But .....he is the bloke chosen to oversee the hard reset that I believe we needed, so I will be patient and put up with the slog, which I believe it will be.

 

Just to be clear 502nd time....I agree....Potter not good enough. But patience is a virtue and I prefer to stick with the reset that I think we need, rather than revert to short term fixes.

 

 

39 minutes ago, Chelsbear said:

Not buying that.

I'd wager most top ranked managers would have us playing better and not dropping points left right and centre.

This has been the worst tenure of any manager in my lifetime.

I think people underestimate how important Kante, James and Chilwell have been to us the previous two seasons. Tuchel struggled without Kante in midfield, let alone the other two. You take out the 3 most key players we have and of course it will take a big hit to our form. James was brilliant under Tuchel in the CL, along with Kante and Chilwell. Without them you seriously think we would have got close to the CL trophy or top four? I don't. Missing Kante for a whole season is a massive miss. You don't think Kante has been our anchor in midfield since we signed him? We all know how much we missed Kante in midfield last season and before that. 

4 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

Just to be clear 502nd time....I agree....Potter not good enough. But patience is a virtue and I prefer to stick with the reset that I think we need, rather than revert to short term fixes.

 

Please someone remind me of that idiom or saying about doing something over and over and expecting a different result. 

I forget lol

4 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

Just to be clear 502nd time....I agree....Potter not good enough. But patience is a virtue and I prefer to stick with the reset that I think we need, rather than revert to short term fixes.

 

Then let's sack him. Backing someone who's not good enough is pointless.

The general vision does not have to change because the manager changes. That can stay in place and we can get a competent manager in. It's not either or.

1 minute ago, OriginalS said:

Then let's sack him. Backing someone who's not good enough is pointless.

The general vision does not have to change because the manager changes. That can stay in place and we can get a competent manager in. It's not either or.

Well that depends on who would come in. Sacking for the sack of sacking, only to bring in a short term manager, then that is 2 steps back in my opinion.

I said on another thread that if they want to sack and continue the rebuild, then Nagelsmann being available is an interesting proposition that might allow the rebuild to continue to happen.

But the same caveats will apply to whoever comes in. The rebuild/reset will still be painful with lots of ups and downs. I dont believe that Nagelsmann sitting on the bench yesterday would have stopped Cucu with his brain fart, would have made Mcginns shot saveable or turned our attackers into lethal finishers.

So, in my mind it is not about who is on the bench. It is about the need to reset the culture of the club. Revert to short term thinking that might see us pick up wins and continue as we have been over the past x years. Or choose a manager to rebuild the foundations, which will be painful and long with whoever is in charge.

31 minutes ago, Nick05 said:

Well, when Emery came in at Villa they were near the relegation places. Now he's scored the 3rd highest points since and gone above us and scored more goals than us. He too didn't have a pre-season and neither does he have a squad as good as ours. Every manager in the PL is facing huge pressure with 3-4 losing their jobs every season. Doesn't matter whether you coach Chelsea or Villa or Fulham, the pressure is the same. Potter may not be a mediocre coach but at the moment he is simply not good enough for a team with title ambitions. Every decent manager can get occasional good results and beat top teams from time to time. That doesn't mean that they all are good enough to manage the top teams.

Emery is a good manager, but he's managed better clubs. He pretty much failed at Arsenal, whereas Arteta has succeeded. He took a pretty good Arsenal side and finished 5th. They had an in form, 20+ goal a season striker in Aubameyang too. He had a decent team at Arsenal. We don't even have a 20 goal a season striker which would make so much difference. There's always context to how successful a manager can be. You have to remember there's way less pressure on these smaller clubs you mention than at Chelsea. On top of that pressure we haven't had a consistent first 11 up until a few weeks ago, along with missing Kante (our most influential CM the last few seasons) all season. 

Despite the results, I think it's important not to lose sight of the improvements that Graham Potter has brought to the side, such as:

 

 

 

 

 

 

There is no redeeming factor of having Potter remain as manager. There are issues with the squad, such as a lack of any real centre forward, but this is getting embarrassing now we are getting turned over at least every other week.

We have always been known to remove managers who have gone through bad times and lost the players, but you can't argue that we've ALWAYS been successful while doing this. As much as everyone would like to see a long term manager succeed at the club, I feel like the fans don't really like Potter or his football, and it's never going to work in this scenario, or at least has a very slim chance of changing positively.

We have some really good players, there isn't a huge excuse to be where we are, fighting for a place in the top half of the table. 

 

1 hour ago, Chelsbear said:

I'd wager most top ranked managers would have us playing better and not dropping points left right and centre.

They were saying that about Tuchel at the end, some of the same people who are now saying similar about Potter, they got what you deserve.

48 minutes ago, enigma said:

A fair and logical take from Mark Goldbridge on Potter and Chelsea this season. Pretty much echoes what I think. 

 

 

The same guy that was calling for Ole's head when they were finishing 2nd under him, the double standards for Potter are insane 😂

Jim, just a hunch but would I be right in thinking that, politically, you sit to the left of centre ? Probably, I am thinking, very far to the left lol.

4 minutes ago, coco said:

They were saying that about Tuchel at the end, some of the same people who are now saying similar about Potter, they got what you deserve.

The standards that Tuchel was held to are astronomically different to the standards that Potter has been held to. 

2 hours ago, nonotnowjim said:

Everyone is so impatient these days. What part of long term rebuild/project don't people get?

 

And why exactly does this long term rebuild have to be with Potter? A man who finished 10th in the Championship with Swansea (Steve Cooper came 3rd the season after), and 16th, 16th and 9th with Brighton?

 

I'n starting to think some people would genuinely prefer finishing 10th-14th with Potter because he's a nice bloke than top 4 with someone actually competent