I was fuming when we signed him. Couldn't understand why we paid 100m for a player i didnt know 12 months earlier.

Wouldn't be at all surprised if Blue Co cocked the sale up. He definitely wants and needs to go. We should get shot ASAP to release funds for a replacement but this lot will want to hold out for a high price. They might even leave it too late and put him in the bomb squad.

If it was up to me I'd sell him during the world Cup to disrupt his and Argentina's tournament.

(Yes I'm bitter and twisted)

This is just going to be the really annoying story all summer now and will drift into the start of the PL season.

Id love to sell him for £100-120m. Id be slightly annoyed if we let him go for less.

But the reality is, he's not as good as he thinks he is. I don't think any club seriously wants him.

Not too worried about replacing his goals. We've been too reliant on his box crashing and Alonso will figure out how we score.

5 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

This is just going to be the really annoying story all summer now and will drift into the start of the PL season.

Id love to sell him for £100-120m. Id be slightly annoyed if we let him go for less.

But the reality is, he's not as good as he thinks he is. I don't think any club seriously wants him.

Not too worried about replacing his goals. We've been too reliant on his box crashing and Alonso will figure out how we score.

I think the club needs to be more focused on the replacement. If the right player comes along they should be more flexible in Fernandez's value in order to close a deal on his replacement. They faffed around with Jackson and Disasi and too many others last year and look at the dross they bought in the end.

7 minutes ago, Andy North said:

I think the club needs to be more focused on the replacement. If the right player comes along they should be more flexible in Fernandez's value in order to close a deal on his replacement. They faffed around with Jackson and Disasi and too many others last year and look at the dross they bought in the end.

None of the dross that we signed last season is connected with Jackson deal.

Jackson "replacement" last season was Xavi Simmons.

Edited May 28May 28 by Bob stark

14 hours ago, Sconnie Blue said:

Even in a standard 4231 or 442, Enzo doesn't fit. He's too slow and doesn't have the ball carrying capabilities to play in the pivot or at CAM. Especially in the Premier League.

Waiting to see Ornstein or Law follow up on this. Atletico always seemed more likely considering the Argentine influence and that Griezmann is gone.

Honestly. You put a £120m price tag on a player like Enzo. You might as well say £500m 'cos no-one is going to pay it.

A £50m player at best if ever there was one.

Looks like we're stuck with him.

Henry Winter posted this which I thought was spot on. Basically calling him out:

“Enzo Fernandez is an exceptional, box-crashing player when in the mood. He’s a world champion. His numbers at Chelsea are decent, 10 goals and four assists in the Premier League this season. But if Fernandez is keen on a move because Chelsea's aren’t in Europe, as is being claimed, then maybe he also needs to look at himself as one of the reasons why Chelsea are not in Europe.

When Chelsea cried out for somebody to take control of a game, as against Brighton and Sunderland, he failed. In the 3-0 loss to Brighton, Fernandez made one tackle in the 90 minutes and lost out. He lost 4/6 duels. Only 1/4 passes was forward. He didn’t have an attempt on goal. However out of his depth Liam Rosenior may have been, he wasn’t helped by Fernandez.

In the 2-1 final-day defeat to Sunderland, Fernandez was given the joint lowest mark on the match report on the Sky Sports website, 3/10. He made one tackle and failed to win the ball. He made three fouls and was booked once. Chelsea lost 2-1. However out of his depth interim Calum McFarlane may have been (understandably), he wasn’t helped by Fernandez.

The 25-year-old Argentine is a very good No 8 on his day, not a 6 btw, and there will be interest in him whatever the reservations about his character. Neither Real Madrid nor PS-G have a need for his specific skill-set but Manchester City do, Atletico Madrid do. If Chelsea can get anywhere close to the £106m they paid for him, it will be a major result. #CFC”

If he goes to Madrid he will go back to playing as a 6, in the same mold as Kroos. I'm still not sure why people on here keep repeating that he doesn't want to play as a 6, he has never said or implied this anywhere. Correct me if I am wrong.

As for the Kroos comparison, neither were blessed with great speed but paired up with someone to do the hard work defensively it worked out fine.

46 minutes ago, Remodez said:

If he goes to Madrid he will go back to playing as a 6, in the same mold as Kroos. I'm still not sure why people on here keep repeating that he doesn't want to play as a 6, he has never said or implied this anywhere. Correct me if I am wrong.

As for the Kroos comparison, neither were blessed with great speed but paired up with someone to do the hard work defensively it worked out fine.

These were the exact quotes:

Enzo Fernandez: "Now I am playing further forward [at Chelsea], but it is not a problem because as a boy I played as a five and of eight."

"I don't have a problem but it is a big difference: you have to stay with the defenders more as a five, while you have to let go more and help the forwards as an eight."

Kroos was very intelligent in the way he orchestrated tempo. I've never seen anything from Enzo bar the World Cup where I thought he could replicate that role. Obviously Real Madrid were never a club that cared about defending, so I wouldn't be surprised if they did force Enzo to play as that #6

"I don't have a problem but it is a big difference: you have to stay with the defenders more as a five, while you have to let go more and help the forwards as an eight."

Might have helped Caicedo if Enzo had actually tried doing that once in a f**king while...

2 hours ago, JM7 said:

Henry Winter posted this which I thought was spot on. Basically calling him out:

“Enzo Fernandez is an exceptional...

Basically - there is a financial cost to keeping him and one to sell him. I'll be amazed if we make any money on him and I would suggest breaking even is the way out of this situation. We have qualified once for the Champions League since he's been here and as talismen go, he isnt one. He was supposed to help us return to the top flight and that hasnt happened. The club need to cut its losses unless Alonso thinks he can get the best out of him... Depressingly, I see him here next season as I dont think any club will want to pay the clubs asking price.

15 minutes ago, bluelightening said:

Basically - there is a financial cost to keeping him and one to sell him. I'll be amazed if we make any money on him and I would suggest breaking even is the way out of this situation. We have qualified once for the Champions League since he's been here and as talismen go, he isnt one. He was supposed to help us return to the top flight and that hasnt happened. The club need to cut its losses unless Alonso thinks he can get the best out of him... Depressingly, I see him here next season as I dont think any club will want to pay the clubs asking price.

Or anything remotely near it.

His book value is around £80m isn’t it? I reckon city will pay £100m for him. Maresca is that stupid.

1 hour ago, Sconnie Blue said:

These were the exact quotes:

Kroos was very intelligent in the way he orchestrated tempo. I've never seen anything from Enzo bar the World Cup where I thought he could replicate that role. Obviously Real Madrid were never a club that cared about defending, so I wouldn't be surprised if they did force Enzo to play as that #6

I don't see that quote as him saying he doesn't want to play as a 6, quite the opposite in fact as he later laments basically having to do two jobs.

I still believe Enzo's best role is in that Kroos mold, as shown at Benfica, world cup, under Potter and Lampard briefly so I don't see it as "forcing" him in that role, it's just where he should be. I would argue this box crashing role he most likely wouldn't play at any other top club is us forcing him in.

3 minutes ago, Remodez said:

I don't see that quote as him saying he doesn't want to play as a 6, quite the opposite in fact as he later laments basically having to do two jobs.

I still believe Enzo's best role is in that Kroos mold, as shown at Benfica, world cup, under Potter and Lampard briefly so I don't see it as "forcing" him in that role, it's just where he should be. I would argue this box crashing role he most likely wouldn't play at any other top club is us forcing him in.

I disagree.

At the World Cup he was much better at moving the ball than Paredes which is why Scaloni put him there. Although he did well, he was still the most dribbled past player in the tournament. Since the World Cup, Scaloni has used Enzo further and further up the pitch. At Benfica, I always thought it was Florentino Luis who held the midfield which allowed Enzo to roam further forward.

Under Potter he looked fine but I still am willing to wager that as soon as the opposition knew to press him he became a liability playing that deep. Like I said, Real don't care about defending so I wouldn't be surprised if they did play him there.

2 hours ago, Remodez said:

If he goes to Madrid he will go back to playing as a 6, in the same mold as Kroos. I'm still not sure why people on here keep repeating that he doesn't want to play as a 6, he has never said or implied this anywhere. Correct me if I am wrong.

As for the Kroos comparison, neither were blessed with great speed but paired up with someone to do the hard work defensively it worked out fine.

There're quotes from his dad in https://metro.co.uk/2023/06/16/enzo-fernandez-will-ask-mauricio-pochettino-to-play-in-a-new-position-at-chelsea-18961633/

Described as ‘the future of the club’ by interim boss Frank Lampard, Fernandez was asked to play in a deep-lying role by Graham Potter’s temporary replacement, but, according to his father, he will ask Pochettino to play in a more advanced role next season.

‘Enzo is comfortable, happy, and adjusting to London,’ said Raul Fernandez. ‘He was happy about the arrival of Pochettino.

‘Next season? My son wants to be a champion.

Enzo Fernandez showed glimpses of potential following his January transfer to Chelsea (Picture: Getty)

I think [we will see Enzo play further forward]! He was going to ask [Pochettino] to play further advanced.’

14 minutes ago, Sconnie Blue said:

I disagree.

At the World Cup he was much better at moving the ball than Paredes which is why Scaloni put him there. Although he did well, he was still the most dribbled past player in the tournament. Since the World Cup, Scaloni has used Enzo further and further up the pitch. At Benfica, I always thought it was Florentino Luis who held the midfield which allowed Enzo to roam further forward.

Under Potter he looked fine but I still am willing to wager that as soon as the opposition knew to press him he became a liability playing that deep. Like I said, Real don't care about defending so I wouldn't be surprised if they did play him there.

He's used further forward as he is the best option for that role at the moment, with emergency of players like Paz verdict is still out on if that will be his long term role.

At Benfica, Luis did the Casemiro role and Enzo had the Kroos role. Kroos didn't sit either he would roam around.

I think Potter went a bit too extreme having him being the sole defender like some sort of regista, he needs a proper DM doing the hard work besides him if he's going to be doing that Kroos or even Fabregas like role.

14 hours ago, Nibs said:

Honestly. You put a £120m price tag on a player like Enzo. You might as well say £500m 'cos no-one is going to pay it.

A £50m player at best if ever there was one.

Looks like we're stuck with him.

Yep, nobody is paying that.

Let's just hope it's the first wacky part of the negotiations.

We should accept his book value of £80m take the money and re-invest it on Wharton before Liverpool go in for him.

7 hours ago, RMH said:

There're quotes from his dad in https://metro.co.uk/2023/06/16/enzo-fernandez-will-ask-mauricio-pochettino-to-play-in-a-new-position-at-chelsea-18961633/

Described as ‘the future of the club’ by interim boss Frank Lampard, Fernandez was asked to play in a deep-lying role by Graham Potter’s temporary replacement, but, according to his father, he will ask Pochettino to play in a more advanced role next season.

‘Enzo is comfortable, happy, and adjusting to London,’ said Raul Fernandez. ‘He was happy about the arrival of Pochettino.

‘Next season? My son wants to be a champion.

Enzo Fernandez showed glimpses of potential following his January transfer to Chelsea (Picture: Getty)

I think [we will see Enzo play further forward]! He was going to ask [Pochettino] to play further advanced.’

Heh he may ask for whatever he wants; it matters little if he's not good enough for the role at this level. So, he will have to drop a tier or embrace a B2B role, because he ain't the kind of player to ask for a free role or CAM position.
His best contributions lately have come from arriving late as a B2B — again he’s the one CM at Chelsea who isn't allergic to the opposition goal. But scoring from deep doesn't make you an elite 10. (Coming from someone who rates him as a very good footballer).

If we can get a good fee for him I won’t be sad to see the back of him, will we miss his goals / assists? Yes but the balance of the side just isn’t there when he plays, he’s not mobile enough, not a particularly great passer either. The board actually replacing him with suitable quality is another thing though, Barco is not who should be replacing him with nor Andrey Santos.

Blueco aren't stupid. We can afford to lower the asking price for Enzo because it will be offset by the £60 million we are going to get for Jackson and the £40 million someone is going to give us, (rumoured to be The Carpet Warehouse in Romford), for Garnacho.

38 minutes ago, dan_cfc said:

If we can get a good fee for him I won’t be sad to see the back of him, will we miss his goals / assists? Yes but the balance of the side just isn’t there when he plays, he’s not mobile enough, not a particularly great passer either. The board actually replacing him with suitable quality is another thing though, Barco is not who should be replacing him with nor Andrey Santos.

I'm not so sure the source of the imbalance is Enzo. I also see that sometimes the team is unbalanced when Enzo is pairing Caicedo as a CM, but that only suggests that the fit isn't there.

I'm old enough to have seen teams literally fielding 4 or 5 dedicated midfield players: two DMs and two CMs in front, plus a CAM or a winger. I'm pretty sure modern football didn't magically go from needing 4-5 CMs down to just 2. 😅

The way I see the game is that every team at all times still has a minimum of 5 players in that midfield zone; teams just accomplish that in a number of different ways now. Sometimes it's CBs playing the ball and pushing forward (City does that a lot). Sometimes it's wingers cutting inside. Sometimes even a super mobile forward also joins in and helps, like Alvarez does. Don't think our roster provides a lot of options.

15 hours ago, Bob stark said:

None of the dross that we signed last season is connected with Jackson deal.

Jackson "replacement" last season was Xavi Simmons.

15 hours ago, Bob stark said:

None of the dross that we signed last season is connected with Jackson deal.

Jackson "replacement" last season was Xavi Simmons.

My point is that we didn't get the funds from a Jackson sale etc. If we had we may well have been able to sign better players.

Instead we went early in the bargain basement and signed Delap.

Overall my thoughts are that we just need to improve our recruitment.

20 minutes ago, acaeus said:

I'm not so sure the source of the imbalance is Enzo.

It's clear as day it is.

Enzo's immobility in midfield and inability to carry the ball is what hinders the team, especially the attack. His only real quality is box crashing, which by definition makes him a luxury footballer. If we want to go into praising his output, we may as well start praising Neto too as he has 20 G/A in all competitions.

44 minutes ago, Sconnie Blue said:

It's clear as day it is.

Enzo's immobility in midfield and inability to carry the ball is what hinders the team, especially the attack. His only real quality is box crashing, which by definition makes him a luxury footballer. If we want to go into praising his output, we may as well start praising Neto too as he has 20 G/A in all competitions.

I think the team has enough ball carriers as-is.
Anyway we will find out soon enough. I'd bet that the imbalance will remain there and it has more to do with the defense line and fitting Cole than Enzo.