8 hours ago, Barrettinator said:

How does asking for a player who's clearly w**k and has been before Sarri to be binned relate to somehow being impatient with Sarri himself? The state of some of you lot on here sometimes is mind buggling. 

Was he 'clearly w**k' when he first arrived at the club and was scoring for fun? He had injuries, came back probably too early because we didn't have anyone else, and then hit a lean patch and didn't recover his confidence. The lad has tons of talent, and just needs to be supported while he learns Sarri's new system which should hopefully fit his abilities very well.

Frankly I'm sick of watching people calling our players w**k after 1 season, which a few years ago would have meant us binning the likes of Drogba amongst others. Morata has 15 goals last year and falls over too easily. Drog got 16 and spent as much time on the floor as Morata does. Obviously I'm not saying Morata is going to be Drog levels of amazing, but considering his potential we'd be fecking stupid to kick him out after 1 season.  

12 minutes ago, Warner11 said:

A couple of lucky goals at the start of the season to put his head right should do the trick. Fingers crossed

We thought that last season. Couple of lucky goals at the start and he just got worse.

1 hour ago, Tea Bar Boy said:

as said above Morata's biggest problem is Moarta ... technically a very very good footballer 

 

.....but if you haven't got and fire in your belly , passion and desire ...you are never going to full achieve your potential ... this to me is where he comes up short 

Agree with you there. It's a mental challenge. He seems a nice guy. Similar to Torres he just doesn't posses that will and confidence to bounce back. He seems to spiral when something goes wrong. Lots of people face it in all forms of life, sadly it is very hard to fix and requires a lot of work. Which is partially why I'm not holding out hope for him here.

We're in trouble if we go into the new season with Morata as our main striker again. 

He's too much of a powder puff... He has absolutely no mental strength whatsoever and just flakes out ridiculously quickly. He was going down clutching his ankles within the first ten minutes of a pre-season friendly yesterday over a nothing challenge. He isn't going to change, it's who he is as a player. 

Higuain isn't looking like such a bad idea right now. 

11 minutes ago, Kentonio said:

Was he 'clearly w**k' when he first arrived at the club and was scoring for fun? He had injuries, came back probably too early because we didn't have anyone else, and then hit a lean patch and didn't recover his confidence. The lad has tons of talent, and just needs to be supported while he learns Sarri's new system which should hopefully fit his abilities very well.

Frankly I'm sick of watching people calling our players w**k after 1 season, which a few years ago would have meant us binning the likes of Drogba amongst others. Morata has 15 goals last year and falls over too easily. Drog got 16 and spent as much time on the floor as Morata does. Obviously I'm not saying Morata is going to be Drog levels of amazing, but considering his potential we'd be fecking stupid to kick him out after 1 season.  

Scoring for fun with nothing but his head. The lads a footballer and is absolute dross with his feet. We saw what kind of football Sarri wants to play and thats quick passing, everything that went into Morata just bounced off him. What abilities do you think are going to fit Sarri's system exactly? It can't be his first time passing because thats poor, it can't be his finishing because that is atrocious. His heading? Do you really see Sarri playing hoofball into the box?

Frankly i'm sick of posters trying to make the sun shine out of every players arse and make posters look like bad people for pointing out that a player is sh*t. Everyone points out Bakayoko is sh*t, why can't we say the same about Morata without being lambasted? A hat trick against Stoke in which he probably should have scored about 6 against no recognisable defenders and a nice header* against Utd & Spurs and somehow this amounts to unparalleled levels of potential. The bloke is 26 next season and hasn't been able to nail down a starting spot at any team he's been at. I think its obvious to see why.

 

*All he's capable of.

5 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Scoring for fun with nothing but his head. The lads a footballer and is absolute dross with his feet. We saw what kind of football Sarri wants to play and thats quick passing, everything that went into Morata just bounced off him. What abilities do you think are going to fit Sarri's system exactly? It can't be his first time passing because thats poor, it can't be his finishing because that is atrocious. His heading? Do you really see Sarri playing hoofball into the box?

Frankly i'm sick of posters trying to make the sun shine out of every players arse and make posters look like bad people for pointing out that a player is sh*t. Everyone points out Bakayoko is sh*t, why can't we say the same about Morata without being lambasted? A hat trick against Stoke in which he probably should have scored about 6 against no recognisable defenders and a nice header* against Utd & Spurs and somehow this amounts to unparalleled levels of potential. The bloke is 26 next season and hasn't been able to nail down a starting spot at any team he's been at. I think its obvious to see why.

 

*All he's capable of.

He's not at all 'absolute dross' with his feet, that's complete bollocks. It's the first game of pre-season and he's trying to adapt to a complete new style of play ffs. Last year he was having serious finishing problems, but some of his play was extremely good, and he was connecting well with Haz and Willian. If he'd have been finishing his chances better and had finished on 25 instead of 15 goals, we wouldn't have been hearing any of this crap about how terrible he is at everything.

Maybe he won't fit the system or maybe he is mentally weak and won't be able to get his confidence back up. Both of those are perfectly possible, but I don't think its unreasonable to ask people to give the lad more than one season (which included a bad injury) before they start calling for his head.

2 minutes ago, Kentonio said:

*He's not at all 'absolute dross' with his feet, that's complete bollocks. It's the first game of pre-season and he's trying to adapt to a complete new style of play ffs. Last year he was having serious finishing problems, but some of his play was extremely good, and he was connecting well with Haz and Willian.

**If he'd have been finishing his chances better and had finished on 25 instead of 15 goals, we wouldn't have been hearing any of this crap about how terrible he is at everything.

***Maybe he won't fit the system or maybe he is mentally weak and won't be able to get his confidence back up. Both of those are perfectly possible, but I don't think its unreasonable to ask people to give the lad more than one season (which included a bad injury) before they start calling for his head.

*Yes he is. Show me him consistently controlling a ball or playing a first time pass that is zipped into him or even scoring a couple of goals with his feet. His entire career he has been having serious finishing problems. Madrid and Juve fans warned us before we signed him that he panicked in front of goal and would miss the easier chances. Clearly this isn't something that is going to change is its been happening his entire career. 

**Christ what a horrific argument. If i had scored 50 goals at Sunday league maybe i could have made it pro. If Tammy had hit 18 goals instead 8 last season maybe he could start for us this season. If Terry hadn't slipped and Anelka missed his penalty maybe we would have won the Champions league sooner. All of these things didn't happen, much like Morata not scoring 25 goals last season because he is bambi on ice with his feet. 

***As said before, these issues have been prominent throughout his whole career. His career is littered with goal droughts, missing easy chances and being sent off and costing his team for immature things.

If we go into next season with him and we have the same again, which is likely, its going to cost us a place in the Champions league, which will most definitely cost us Hazard. 

Just now, RIP Mourinho said:

*Yes he is. Show me him consistently controlling a ball or playing a first time pass that is zipped into him or even scoring a couple of goals with his feet. His entire career he has been having serious finishing problems. Madrid and Juve fans warned us before we signed him that he panicked in front of goal and would miss the easier chances. Clearly this isn't something that is going to change is its been happening his entire career. 

**Christ what a horrific argument. If i had scored 50 goals at Sunday league maybe i could have made it pro. If Tammy had hit 18 goals instead 8 last season maybe he could start for us this season. If Terry hadn't slipped and Anelka missed his penalty maybe we would have won the Champions league sooner. All of these things didn't happen, much like Morata not scoring 25 goals last season because he is bambi on ice with his feet. 

***As said before, these issues have been prominent throughout his whole career. His career is littered with goal droughts, missing easy chances and being sent off and costing his team for immature things.

If we go into next season with him and we have the same again, which is likely, its going to cost us a place in the Champions league, which will most definitely cost us Hazard. 

* Sure. Focus particularly on goals 4 and 5, especially 5.

** No its not a horrific argument, because Morata actually had those chances and didn't take them not due to any lack of passing or ball control ability. He just missed them, and purely because his confidence was shot to sh*t.

*** True, which points for me to a lack of mental strength. If it was a lack of talent, you'd hardly have seen his career trajectory include Real Madrid, Juventus and Chelsea. Especially if he also wasn't scoring big numbers.

I'm not saying by any means we should go into the season relying on just Morata. That would be reckless after what happened last season. I'm just saying don't write the lad off just yet, I think he may just come to surprise people.

46 minutes ago, Spiller86 said:

 He seems a nice guy.

Doesn't seem to me - whole bunch of yellow cards for replicating the refs, few sends off for diving or again, challenging the refs, lot of diving stuff and almost 0 assists for the season.

2 minutes ago, Kentonio said:

* Sure. Focus particularly on goals 4 and 5, especially 5.

** No its not a horrific argument, because Morata actually had those chances and didn't take them not due to any lack of passing or ball control ability. He just missed them, and purely because his confidence was shot to sh*t.

*** True, which points for me to a lack of mental strength. If it was a lack of talent, you'd hardly have seen his career trajectory include Real Madrid, Juventus and Chelsea. Especially if he also wasn't scoring big numbers.

I'm not saying by any means we should go into the season relying on just Morata. That would be reckless after what happened last season. I'm just saying don't write the lad off just yet, I think he may just come to surprise people.

*2 goals out of an entire season against no recognised defenders. Kinda proves my point here.

**Purely because he is absolutely horrific at finishing with his feet. There were so many chances before his confidence dropped that he missed and everyone ignored because he'd score a header at some point.

***Agree about a lack of mental strength, which i'd argue is even harder to overcome than a lack of natural talent. If he hadn't come through Castilla do you honestly believe his CV would have such teams on it? He's still yet to have a season scoring a goal every other game. No surpise really that his best goal scoring season was when he was coming off the bench against drained teams. 

 

7 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

*2 goals out of an entire season against no recognised defenders. Kinda proves my point here.

**Purely because he is absolutely horrific at finishing with his feet. There were so many chances before his confidence dropped that he missed and everyone ignored because he'd score a header at some point.

***Agree about a lack of mental strength, which i'd argue is even harder to overcome than a lack of natural talent. If he hadn't come through Castilla do you honestly believe his CV would have such teams on it? He's still yet to have a season scoring a goal every other game. No surpise really that his best goal scoring season was when he was coming off the bench against drained teams.

Well, if he stays we'll soon find out I guess. Personally I think he could be outstanding this year now he's gotten used to linking up with Eden.

As much as I would love to say we should give him another year, I can only see it going one way if we do. 

I have absolutely no confidence in him being able to regain confidence and turn things around. 

I don't think his attributes suit the style of football which Sarri will want to play, which is only going to make the task at hand harder. 

His default setting is to fall over when the ball is played to his feet whilst he is under any sort of pressure from an opposing player. That's just not going to work. 

It's going to be a painful season ahead should we go into it with him as our first choice striker, I'm certain of that. 

 

 

I didn't see the game yesterday but you'd hope over the summer he'd have a word with himself and come out with a point to prove. If he hasn't done that he needs to go. He needs to stop being such a victim and he needs to start showing some balls. Petulant, weak, mentally and physically. He's good when everything's going his way, when it's not he lacks the character to change things. Hopefully Sarri can get inside his head if he stays.

From the highlights I saw it did look as though he had learned nothing from last season and it was much of the same. I know it was first pre-season action but it was against some second-rate Aussie team where you would hope he would at least cause them some problems. Would love him to come good as he DOES look the part, but looking and being are two completely different things and we cannot pin our hopes on a striker who is too easily dominated by physical defenders. If yesterday is what we are to expect for this season, I would honestly rather see Batshuayi be given the No.9.

 

He's not a center forward though, that's the genuine problem. He would probably do ok on the left of a 2 or 3 pronged attack, but that's Hazards position. Morata hates drifting right, i was constantly checking his heat maps last season, he barely ever drifts right, all his headers come from the right to him on the left, it's all too predictable for defenders to read. With Giroud being predominantly left footed were crying out for a right sided attacker/poacher, it's just not balanced as it is, even Willian cuts back in from the right. 

Throw Hudson into the equation on that left side, and we are overloaded with left sided players.

I just don't see where Morata fits in, and i still think he's off to Italy.

 

12 minutes ago, coco said:

all his headers come from the right to him on the left, it's all too predictable for defenders to read.

Atletico away if I recall correctly? Hazard's cross from the left, Morata header to equalize.

10 minutes ago, Amputechture said:

Atletico away if I recall correctly? Hazard's cross from the left, Morata header to equalize.

Yes your'e right, but that's it.

 

I was all for giving morata another season, but the striker position is what worries me the most. 

I would like a right winger, but Willian could stay, and he and pedro could have a good year under sarri.

I'm not sold on Barkley or RLC in that attacking midfield position, I would love fekir, but again I think we could still have a decent season with what we have.

Neither Morata, Batshuayi, or Giroud, fill me with confidence. 

There aren't many options available though either, we have been linked to martial and higuian, but both transfers look unlikely to happen. 

I'm surprised there hasnt been any links with Werner. 

17 hours ago, Giordano_Bruno said:

France played with average 39 percents possession for the eliminations - that was counter-attacking style. He won't score many goals in this system. Yet, it was impressive how he adapted to this style and opened the game for Griezman and Mbappe.

Against mid and low table opponents, he will score goals.

I don't see him scoring a lot but if he can help with lets say more than 10 goals in the league it will be good, last season he played over 10 games and had maybe 3-4 goals...My point is someone needs to score 20 goals or otherwise we would need multiple players capable of scoring.

Out of curiousity who do people demanding he’s chucked think we should replace him with? Higuain?! You’ve got to be having a f***ing laugh. 

 

You're right that he won’t get knocked over easily because he probably weighs about 20 stone. For a professional athlete the way he looks after himself is proven to be poor, now he’s over 30 he will be declining at the very top level. 

There is no other top class striker you could definitively say we could go out and get.

1 hour ago, EdinburghBlue said:

Out of curiousity who do people demanding he’s chucked think we should replace him with? Higuain?! You’ve got to be having a f***ing laugh. 

 

You're right that he won’t get knocked over easily because he probably weighs about 20 stone. For a professional athlete the way he looks after himself is proven to be poor, now he’s over 30 he will be declining at the very top level. 

There is no other top class striker you could definitively say we could go out and get.

We have a multi-million pound scouting network scattered through almost every major league. If they can't find a suitable replacement then what is the point of having them.

Off the top of my head i'd rather see Batshuayi, Icardi, Werner, Mariano, B.Traore, Volland given a shot than try with Morata again. As i said, i'm not a scout paid hundreds of thousands of pounds though with access to the best data bases and footage available. There are people available if we want. 

9 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

We have a multi-million pound scouting network scattered through almost every major league. If they can't find a suitable replacement then what is the point of having them.

Off the top of my head i'd rather see Batshuayi, Icardi, Werner, Mariano, B.Traore, Volland given a shot than try with Morata again. As i said, i'm not a scout paid hundreds of thousands of pounds though with access to the best data bases and footage available. There are people available if we want. 

Who says the clubs Icardi, Werner etc play for will just sell to us because we want their player? That’s not really how it works. 

 

The only ones you could guarantee we could get would be Batshuayi & Tralee (I think, terminating the loan & a buyback clause). One of which, I think we’re looking at through tinted specs. Bats all round game was poor whenever he started for us. Traore hardly lit Ligue 1 on fire with similar stats to Morata despite it supposedly being a poorer standard of league that the PL.

 

Can you confirm we have suitors for Morata because those players won’t be cheap so I assume he’d have to go as well.

 

Scouting isn’t the only problem, the negotiations to get them through the door is as well, and who’s to say they don’t have a mediocre first season, we’ll be shipping them off next summer as well.

1 minute ago, EdinburghBlue said:

Who says the clubs Icardi, Werner etc play for will just sell to us because we want their player? That’s not really how it works. 

 

The only ones you could guarantee we could get would be Batshuayi & Tralee (I think, terminating the loan & a buyback clause). One of which, I think we’re looking at through tinted specs. Bats all round game was poor whenever he started for us. Traore hardly lit Ligue 1 on fire with similar stats to Morata despite it supposedly being a poorer standard of league that the PL.

 

Can you confirm we have suitors for Morata because those players won’t be cheap so I assume he’d have to go as well.

 

Scouting isn’t the only problem, the negotiations to get them through the door is as well, and who’s to say they don’t have a mediocre first season, we’ll be shipping them off next summer as well.

Icardi has a buyout clause if we're serious about him. 

German clubs often sell their best talent as there is so much floating about in that league that Volland/Werner probably would be sold for the right price. Werner would obvs cost more but still possible. He's rumoured to be going Madrid for 60m Euros so could have offered more if needed.

Lyon always sell their best talents so Mariano should be attainable and B.Traore played most of last season on the RW. When played up top at the end of the season he hit 6 goals and 2 assists in the 7 games. Much better than Morata's stats in the same position. 

Batshuayi's overall game is no worse than Morata's. His movement may not be as good outside the box but he has better 1 touch play. Worth a shot. 

Just now, RIP Mourinho said:

Lyon always sell their best talents so Mariano should be attainable and B.Traore played most of last season on the RW. When played up top at the end of the season he hit 6 goals and 2 assists in the 7 games. Much better than Morata's stats in the same position.

Under no circumstances should we ever even consider buying Mariano. I watched probably 85% of Lyon games last year, and even with the lower standard of football over there I spent most of those games laughing at how painfully sh*t he is. Don't be fooled by the 18 goals he somehow managed to steal last year, he's a dreadful footballer and would be completely embarrased in the PL.