Poor match management by Tuchel today. It's obvious that when we are playing against a team that may give us problem with their attack, we cannot play Jorginho because he cannot support the defense at all. And luckily we have Loftus Cheek who I feel would have been better defensively in front of that defence to protect the defense.

Today it felt like there was nobody to mark in front of that defense, that was why Burnley got their equaliser.

If I'm not wrong, I think it was Loftus Cheek that played instead of Jorginho against Brentford. So I feel he can play that position, and he should be playing instead of Jorginho against big teams.

Edited November 6, 20214 yr by hephzibah

1 minute ago, Deino said:

They were 16 shots 5 on target and 68% possession. Hardly any different.

What's different is they scored 1 more than us. 

It's the attitude, they don't stop grinding and trying to score more and they were denied a penalty after Telles got away with it, they kept trying to score the 3rd goal. All that against a much better opponent than Burnley, and away.

Our intensity isn't good enough, with such a high amount of possession to have only 4 shots on target is too little, you are basically still expecting the squad to be clinical in order to get a routine home win!

There have been a few games recently where we haven't our chances away, and were then a bit fortunate to hold on and get a result. Brentford being the most obvious. Malmo in midweek too. Today we weren't as fortunate. It happens, but we need to learn from this be more clinical in front of goal.

I also wonder why we left it so late to make subs. Ruben was the first one on 73 min. If anything I would have brought on an attacking player like Mount or Pulisic with at least 20 to go. 

1 minute ago, goose said:

As both those clubs did exactly 7 days ago. No team will win all the games they are supposed to do. City win dominate games and not score enough, while Liverpool’s defence  will let goals slip.

We’ve had two of our main forwards out this past 3 weeks and other offensive players out injured and we are still having  a good run and top of the league. 
 

I’m frustrated with the result today but those results are expected. 

There's a difference, we are the pace setters. It can be demoralising trying to chase down a team that keeps winning, but when they slip up, those teams suddenly get an injection of confidence. City and Liverpool are more experienced at getting their sh*t together and going on big winning runs.

As for results like today being expected, well they shouldn't be. Results like that should only be expected if the opposition team played a good game, like when Brentford played against us a few weeks back. Burnley were nothing like that though, they were terrible. Give City and Liverpool the same number of chances to score and chances against them, and they win. With us, there is always that doubt that we won't take our chances.

There have been plenty of signs that this is was going to catch up to us eventually. The two League cup games that we won on penalties, the Champions League games against Zenit and Malmo, the Premier League games against Brentford, Southampton, Newcastle and even Liverpool. Too many games that we haven't been able to kill off because of really poor finishing. We keep giving teams a chance to take something from us. We only have to look at last season to see how many times we dropped points because of this problem.

38 minutes ago, SFL82 said:

Absolute sh*t game management today far far superior and drop 2 points 

Unable to make a decision when it matters!

The blame is with the manager I must admit

1 minute ago, Scott Harris said:

There's a difference, we are the pace setters. It can be demoralising trying to chase down a team that keeps winning, but when they slip up, those teams suddenly get an injection of confidence. City and Liverpool are more experienced at getting their sh*t together and going on big winning runs.

As for results like today being expected, well they shouldn't be. Results like that should only be expected if the opposition team played a good game, like when Brentford played against us a few weeks back. Burnley were nothing like that though, they were terrible. Give City and Liverpool the same number of chances to score and chances against them, and they win. With us, there is always that doubt that we won't take our chances.

There have been plenty of signs that this is was going to catch up to us eventually. The two League cup games that we won on penalties, the Champions League games against Zenit and Malmo, the Premier League games against Brentford, Southampton, Newcastle and even Liverpool. Too many games that we haven't been able to kill off because of really poor finishing. We keep giving teams a chance to take something from us. We only have to look at last season to see how many times we dropped points because of this problem.

Lukaku is the only finisher we have. When he's not in the lineup we are mostly doomed up front.

It was one of those games that 9 out of 10 we would have won comfortably. 

Just bad luck and a bit of complacency starting from the manager to the players.

33 minutes ago, Frankie8Lampard said:

That sample size is skewed considering Lukaku played in matches where we had tougher opposition before his injury which would obviously equate to less chances.

Yes but with this system we've also created numerous chances against the top sides. Real Madrid, City, Atletico etc..

42 minutes ago, abramovich said:

Probably not fair based on twenty minutes he spent on the pitch but this was a good example why despite having a natural ability RLC will never be a starter for a top side. Barkley's finishing was shocking but he played with intensity and desire, Ruben was fresh yet looked like he was having a stroll. The man is soft, no character.

That's very, very harsh.

He's been excellent so far this season. Came on in a different position today and didn't look quite as good but I think it's clear his best position is in the double pivot.

And there have been no signs of lack of intensity and desire either from Loftus-Cheek so far this season. If anything he's been very hard working.

2 minutes ago, Argo said:

Yes but with this system we've also created numerous chances against the top sides. Real Madrid, City, Atletico etc..

True. We definitely create a lot of chances in this system. But think back to all those games and we ended up winning by very narrow margins because we didn't take our chances.

Favourite moment of a wasteful performance 

 

20 minutes ago, Deino said:

They were 16 shots 5 on target and 68% possession. Hardly any different.

What's different is they scored 1 more than us. 

More like the difference is the level of opposition. The only reason why they didn't score more goals was because De Gea pulled off 2 or 3 brilliant saves again. Burnley are a team fighting relegation, not a team trying to finish in the top 4. 

If we had 16 shots away to United with 68% possession and won 2-0, I would be over the moon. 

You also need to factor in when City scored their goals. They scored their goals at crucial moments. An early goal and a goal before half time are perfect times to score goals, it puts you complete control. Today, we had about 5 good chances in the first 10 minutes, and we didn't score one of them. We also had a similar spell in the second half and failed to score from it. If you don't score in those moments, then the opposition just grows in confidence.

6 minutes ago, Sindre said:

That's very, very harsh.

He's been excellent so far this season. Came on in a different position today and didn't look quite as good but I think it's clear his best position is in the double pivot.

And there have been no signs of lack of intensity and desire either from Loftus-Cheek so far this season. If anything he's been very hard working.

I agree. Pretty much every time Loftus-Cheek has played this season, he has been driving forward and trying to make things happen. I don't think subbing Barkley off was the right move today, but I didn't see a lack of desire to make things happen when Loftus-Cheek came on.

15 minutes ago, Evenflow20 said:

Lukaku is the only finisher we have. When he's not in the lineup we are mostly doomed up front.

He's played 11 games this season and he's scored 4 goals, it's hardly spectacular numbers.

20 minutes ago, Gol15 said:

It's the attitude, they don't stop grinding and trying to score more and they were denied a penalty after Telles got away with it, they kept trying to score the 3rd goal. All that against a much better opponent than Burnley, and away.

Our intensity isn't good enough, with such a high amount of possession to have only 4 shots on target is too little, you are basically still expecting the squad to be clinical in order to get a routine home win!

And you think the fact that we have 25 shots means we don't have the attitude to score more?

City had 5 on target. We were wasteful today and City were slightly more clinical. 

Last week it was the other way around. I get it you're frustrated but today we lacked composure

I'm glad with a point as it was only one team winning it after they got the equalizer and it wasn't us. These type of games follow a simple script - Team A dominates but scores only 1 goal, Team B hangs on and flukes a goal in the last 10 minutes or Team A hang on to win. Sadly it was the former for us. That's why we getting the killer goal against Real Madrid in the CL semis in the last 5 minutes was such a surprise. If the dominant team doesn't score the 2nd goal before the 80th minute then its not supposed to happen. But these type of games happen when its just a draw or a loss no matter how well you play. 

3 minutes ago, Deino said:

And you think the fact that we have 25 shots means we don't have the attitude to score more?

City had 5 on target. We were wasteful today and City were slightly more clinical. 

Last week it was the other way around. I get it you're frustrated but today we lacked composure

City's first goal was a sh*tty deflection (similar to the sh*tty deflection that they scored against us) and the 2nd goal was somehow bundled in when the goalie normally saves these 9/10.  Havertz one goal was far more "clinical" than both of their goals combined but its 2 points dropped, that's how it is sometimes.

10 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

More like the difference is the level of opposition. The only reason why they didn't score more goals was because De Gea pulled off 2 or 3 brilliant saves again. Burnley are a team fighting relegation, not a team trying to finish in the top 4. 

If we had 16 shots away to United with 68% possession and won 2-0, I would be over the moon. 

You also need to factor in when City scored their goals. They scored their goals at crucial moments. An early goal and a goal before half time are perfect times to score goals, it puts you complete control. Today, we had about 5 good chances in the first 10 minutes, and we didn't score one of them. We also had a similar spell in the second half and failed to score from it. If you don't score in those moments, then the opposition just grows in confidence.

And Pope didn't pull off some saves to deny goals? These days happen. Heck Palace won against them just last week and Palace too was a team fighting relegation. 

Yes we didn't score at the right times today but so what? We still have 81 points to play for. What's more important is the issues are addressed going forward, it's not like the team gave up today is it? 

Should have been out of sight by half time. Second half was nigly and we lost our concentration at the crucial time.

worst thing for me was the lack of clear cut chances in the second half. It always felt burnley would get a chance to nick something if we didn’t put them away.

referee was a complete bellend just to top it off.

21 minutes ago, forbzy said:

True. We definitely create a lot of chances in this system. But think back to all those games and we ended up winning by very narrow margins because we didn't take our chances.

It is but it will still on the law of averages win us more games than the September ball of creating little and hoping Lukaku finished what came his way.

What this system really needs Is a goalscoring inside forward, that or Werner/Callum to evolve into such.

1 minute ago, Argo said:

What this system really needs Is a goalscoring inside forward, that or Werner/Callum to evolve into such.

Very much agree. This is probably what's lacking for us to win the title this season. We fall well short of Liverpool and City's quality in attacking area because of this.

22 minutes ago, Sindre said:

That's very, very harsh.

He's been excellent so far this season. Came on in a different position today and didn't look quite as good but I think it's clear his best position is in the double pivot.

And there have been no signs of lack of intensity and desire either from Loftus-Cheek so far this season. If anything he's been very hard working.

He looks good when the team's in control and the opposition is struggling. But with the game on the line, he won't be someone to rise to the challenge, to make a difference, he's not a leader, he's too soft, and I don't mean his injury prone body. Players like James or Mount have a bit of a nasty sreak in them, they are mentally tough, they're fighters, Ruben is not.

I know it's nothing to do with the result but why was Pope allowed to take extra 10-15 seconds every time he had a goal kick? Isn't there a limit to how long that supposed to take? It's the usual sh*thousery from Dyche and Co, but it's the ref's job to stop that.

P.S. I hope those c**ts are relegated.

Just now, abramovich said:

He looks good when the team's in control and the opposition is struggling. But with the game on the line, he won't be someone to rise to the challenge, to make a difference, he's not a leader, he's too soft, and I don't mean his injury prone body. Players like James or Mount have a bit of a nasty sreak in them, they are mentally tough, they're fighters, Ruben is not.

I think you should give him a chance to prove himself in that regard too.

I think he may surprise you and a few others. Tuchel doesn't give out chances to anyone who's not prepared to work their socks off for his team and given this was Rubens 10th appearance of the season I think he's doing a lot right. Especially considering just about everyone had written him off and put him on the "sell" list only a few months ago.

Just now, Sindre said:

I think you should give him a chance to prove himself in that regard too.

I think he may surprise you and a few others. Tuchel doesn't give out chances to anyone who's not prepared to work their socks off for his team and given this was Rubens 10th appearance of the season I think he's doing a lot right. Especially considering just about everyone had written him off and put him on the "sell" list only a few months ago.

I wasn't talking about his skill level or how hard he trains.