2 minutes ago, Deino said:

Reality is he scored the penalty and delivered the cross that leads to the goal.

Celebrate that and celebrate the win.

Reality is none of the other players did that. Why are we as fans out here ragging on players during a win?

It's like you want us to lose just to prove your point 🤷‍♂️

For the record, I wanted Santos to start because Fulham is always a tough game and Enzo doesn't suit games like that.

It’s silly to bury your head in the sand and ignore glaring issues in a squad just because we’ve won though. You should be able to see the issues before they cause problems. It’s like saying we don’t need a new GK because we have 2 clean sheets this season.

12 minutes ago, Gol15 said:

As usual you share the exact same view as the other one so why would I even bother to point out your nitpicking here when it's obvious that Enzo's role is much more than how a few of you imagine it in your heads, Enzo is by all means one of the most hard working players the club has and he has been like that since day 1, he tries as physically possible to cover as much ground as he can and he also tried to deliver in the final third, it's only your problem to focus on whatever negative you can hold on to.

I never said anything that goes against everything you have said here, if you actually try to understand the difference from sh*t takes on the internet and real life of course.

Hard working players? Gallagher was better at it and had similar levels of end product and was better at covering the ground around Caicedo.

I love the effort/passion, dont get me wrong, but we still havent found his best position for us... There are big gaps in our midfield at points and no ammount of effort or tracking back if yuo dont have pace will dig you out of that hole at the top level. And he's been a few years at the club. Its a conundrum because if fit he plays. But should he?

And this is where it comes back to Maresca, either not having a pair to tell the board it's a team game and he needs to rotate players, or not having a variety of tactics that we can deploy either during a game, or dependent on the opposition ahead of a match. Would Enzo make a better impact sub in certain games where the opposition have pace? would he be better off behind the striker in a 10 not needing to track back but can press midfielders and defenders? should we deploy a diamond in midfield? He struggles.

We won yesterday and he was central to that... Less can be more and it really is something the coach needs to pick up on rather than dying on the hill of his system that is struggling to beat mid-table clubs.

Enzo has his fan boys and critics and that's down to his performances, and that's either down to him not suiting the league or mismanagement of his skillset in Marescas' system. The guy would light up La Liga/ Serie A where he would dominate midfields given the pace.

I hope we could swap him for Bellingham. that would be my solution.

51 minutes ago, Nibs said:

Let's get this right. The modern game is all about letting opponents go past you with relative ease and and also to mis-place passes and lose possession on a regular basis?

f**k me, I'd be worth £200m

6 minutes ago, bluelightening said:

Hard working players? Gallagher was better at it and had similar levels of end product and was better at covering the ground around Caicedo.

I love the effort/passion, dont get me wrong, but we still havent found his best position for us... There are big gaps in our midfield at points and no ammount of effort or tracking back if yuo dont have pace will dig you out of that hole at the top level. And he's been a few years at the club. Its a conundrum because if fit he plays. But should he?

And this is where it comes back to Maresca, either not having a pair to tell the board it's a team game and he needs to rotate players, or not having a variety of tactics that we can deploy either during a game, or dependent on the opposition ahead of a match. Would Enzo make a better impact sub in certain games where the opposition have pace? would he be better off behind the striker in a 10 not needing to track back but can press midfielders and defenders? should we deploy a diamond in midfield? He struggles.

We won yesterday and he was central to that... Less can be more and it really is something the coach needs to pick up on rather than dying on the hill of his system that is struggling to beat mid-table clubs.

Enzo has his fan boys and critics and that's down to his performances, and that's either down to him not suiting the league or mismanagement of his skillset in Marescas' system. The guy would light up La Liga/ Serie A where he would dominate midfields given the pace.

I hope we could swap him for Bellingham. that would be my solution.

I understand your view and I was really 100% against Gallagher leaving and I also know that Enzo's role is a complicated matter that gives the team lack of balance at times.

But nobody at the club sees Enzo as bang average.

I think a lot of people hold Enzo’s pricetag against him and thus expect Caiceido level performances week in week out.

He’s perfectly fine in the lineup, he’s not our best player, he’s not our worst. Simple as that really.

Seems to have a real passion for the club and is 100% committed every week.

Do we need an immediate upgrade on him? No.

Should he rotate out in some fixtures as Santos is better suited to the opponent? Yes.

Would he become an absolute world beater in a slower paced league like Madrid? Yes.

Think we all need to put a bit more respect on Captain (South) America please.

Neither camps are wrong to be honest, I'm just more on the side of ends justify the means.

Maresca clearly thinks the risk is worth it and judging by his output and performances since we changed around November/December I would have to agree even if I don't personally like the role.

A lot of what ifs about us getting punished when facing better opponents but we have won against said better teams with him playing the same role and he's also picked up goals and assists against teams better than West Ham last season too. Until we lose solely due to him/his role consistently I am not expecting anything to change.

Edited August 31, 2025Aug 31 by Remodez

53 minutes ago, Gol15 said:

As usual you share the exact same view as the other one so why would I even bother to point out your nitpicking here when it's obvious that Enzo's role is much more than how a few of you imagine it in your heads, Enzo is by all means one of the most hard working players the club has and he has been like that since day 1, he tries as physically possible to cover as much ground as he can and he also tried to deliver in the final third, it's only your problem to focus on whatever negative you can hold on to.

I never said anything that goes against everything you have said here, if you actually try to understand the difference from sh*t takes on the internet and real life of course.

Enzo covered the most distance out of all our players last season, I definitely think his poor performances lately have been as a result of that.

He needs a rest but Maresca doesn't seem to trust Santos yet to play the same role.

35 minutes ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

(I used an American gif so you’d understand, yeehaw!)

Your xenophobia of our colonies is getting out of hand.

America has done a lot for the world, Nuclear Weapons, Obesity, ‘Woke’ Culture, Trumanism, be more grateful.

5 hours ago, just said:

It's just like the Jorginho thread all over again Venom.

Where's Gol15 when we need him?

And just like the Genie, Gol magically reappears at the mention of the unmentionable

Welcome back Gol

14 minutes ago, The Boehly Babes said:

Your xenophobia of our colonies is getting out of hand.

America has done a lot for the world, Nuclear Weapons, Obesity, ‘Woke’ Culture, Trumanism, be more grateful.

Don’t forget about the destabilisation of the Middle East and Africa!

Just now, Ukraine Bolt said:

It’s silly to bury your head in the sand and ignore glaring issues in a squad just because we’ve won though. You should be able to see the issues before they cause problems. It’s like saying we don’t need a new GK because we have 2 clean sheets this season.

Not ignoring it, just that I give credit when it's due. The team is already playing without our best attacking player and our starting CB, on top having to bed in a young winger.

The midfield is carved open so easily because Fulham keeps targeting the space behind Estevao. Enzo's our LCM, he's not supposed to go there, Caicedo however drops back because he has to anticipate. Estevao and Pedro going AWOL on defense is what led to the Fulham attack carving us open.

Even the Josh King goal started from George losing the ball when Enzo went up to attack the box, Trev got fouled and King went for the space behind Gusto and Trev

Any attack that came down from the left gets snuffed out because Pedro Neto's workrate plus Cucu and Enzo always has little triangle traps with Caicedo as the second last line of defense. They're not perfect though, all of them had little mistakes that exposed the defense.

The game became more controlled in the second half because Neto moved to the right and JP dropped deep to make up the numbers.

You can see Enzo gassed up from a combination of not being superhuman fit and having to cover huge amounts of the pitch because he supports the defence, covers the middle and box crash. He'll miss some critical passes because of this.

This is why I give him leeway whenever he produces goals and assists. I don't see any midfielder in world football that does all that.

1 hour ago, bluelightening said:

Hard working players? Gallagher was better at it and had similar levels of end product and was better at covering the ground around Caicedo.

I love the effort/passion, dont get me wrong, but we still havent found his best position for us... There are big gaps in our midfield at points and no ammount of effort or tracking back if yuo dont have pace will dig you out of that hole at the top level. And he's been a few years at the club. Its a conundrum because if fit he plays. But should he?

And this is where it comes back to Maresca, either not having a pair to tell the board it's a team game and he needs to rotate players, or not having a variety of tactics that we can deploy either during a game, or dependent on the opposition ahead of a match. Would Enzo make a better impact sub in certain games where the opposition have pace? would he be better off behind the striker in a 10 not needing to track back but can press midfielders and defenders? should we deploy a diamond in midfield? He struggles.

We won yesterday and he was central to that... Less can be more and it really is something the coach needs to pick up on rather than dying on the hill of his system that is struggling to beat mid-table clubs.

Enzo has his fan boys and critics and that's down to his performances, and that's either down to him not suiting the league or mismanagement of his skillset in Marescas' system. The guy would light up La Liga/ Serie A where he would dominate midfields given the pace.

I hope we could swap him for Bellingham. that would be my solution.

Madrid would never sell Bellingham in his prime years and the club won't offer the big wages needed to sign him. You'd have better luck signing Isak

32 minutes ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

Don’t forget about the destabilisation of the Middle East and Africa!

And Achy Breaky Heart

56 minutes ago, Deino said:

Not ignoring it, just that I give credit when it's due. The team is already playing without our best attacking player and our starting CB, on top having to bed in a young winger.

The midfield is carved open so easily because Fulham keeps targeting the space behind Estevao. Enzo's our LCM, he's not supposed to go there, Caicedo however drops back because he has to anticipate. Estevao and Pedro going AWOL on defense is what led to the Fulham attack carving us open.

Even the Josh King goal started from George losing the ball when Enzo went up to attack the box, Trev got fouled and King went for the space behind Gusto and Trev

Any attack that came down from the left gets snuffed out because Pedro Neto's workrate plus Cucu and Enzo always has little triangle traps with Caicedo as the second last line of defense. They're not perfect though, all of them had little mistakes that exposed the defense.

The game became more controlled in the second half because Neto moved to the right and JP dropped deep to make up the numbers.

You can see Enzo gassed up from a combination of not being superhuman fit and having to cover huge amounts of the pitch because he supports the defence, covers the middle and box crash. He'll miss some critical passes because of this.

This is why I give him leeway whenever he produces goals and assists. I don't see any midfielder in world football that does all that.

It’s more on Enzo Snr than Enzo Jnr, the manager hangs him out to dry by asking him to box crash while Gusto overlaps. A solid pivot would be much better, hopefully we see it again when Lavia is back as Enzo can’t be trusted there. It’s so confusing that he doesn’t use Santos there, Enzo’s best games have been at the 10 with no defensive responsibilities but Palmer and Pedro are both better there.

3 hours ago, charierre said:

And just like the Genie, Gol magically reappears at the mention of the unmentionable

Welcome back Gol

Hell yeah! He's back.

@Ukraine Bolt needs to give up work he will have a full-time job wrestling with both @Clown Lake and now his original arch nemesis @Gol15

6 hours ago, Deino said:

Reality is he scored the penalty and delivered the cross that leads to the goal.

Celebrate that and celebrate the win.

Reality is none of the other players did that. Why are we as fans out here ragging on players during a win?

It's like you want us to lose just to prove your point 🤷‍♂️

For the record, I wanted Santos to start because Fulham is always a tough game and Enzo doesn't suit games like that.

The 'reality'...is that you can both enjoy a win and be critical of performances. No one needs to appreciate football with blinkers on.

3 hours ago, Clown Lake said:

I once buttered two slices of bread at the same time using a long angled spatula.

10 hours ago, Gol15 said:

As usual you share the exact same view as the other one so why would I even bother to point out your nitpicking here when it's obvious that Enzo's role is much more than how a few of you imagine it in your heads, Enzo is by all means one of the most hard working players the club has and he has been like that since day 1, he tries as physically possible to cover as much ground as he can and he also tried to deliver in the final third, it's only your problem to focus on whatever negative you can hold on to.

I never said anything that goes against everything you have said here, if you actually try to understand the difference from sh*t takes on the internet and real life of course.

I love that description! "one of the most hard working players" and he "tries". That's like describing the kid at school who always got picked last. Were you that kid Gol?

1 hour ago, Nibs said:

I love that description! "one of the most hard working players" and he "tries". That's like describing the kid at school who always got picked last. Were you that kid Gol?

You at the same time hate the fact that you're still talking about a player that both made the assist and scored a goal in our win, but just like I said it takes a bit of knowledge to understand his role, impact and input which you clearly have no business grasping, Enzo is basically the kid that was picked first ever since he put the blue shirt here anyway so even there your comment makes no sense.

2 minutes ago, Gol15 said:

You at the same time hate the fact that you're still talking about a player that both made the assist and scored a goal in our win, but just like I said it takes a bit of knowledge to understand his role, impact and input which you clearly have no business grasping, Enzo is basically the kid that was picked first ever since he put the blue shirt here anyway so even there your comment makes no sense.

Picked first? What ahead of Palmer? Ahead of Caicedo? You're having a laugh.

It's not even that I don't rate Enzo. I can see he has his uses and he does pop up now and again with an important goal. But more often than not, he is the worst player in a blue shirt. Eeven on Saturday when he scored his penalty and took the corner for the assist, most will agree, he was our worst player. He's a good squad member but his minutes on the pitch need to be managed a lot better.

1 hour ago, Nibs said:

I love that description! "one of the most hard working players" and he "tries". That's like describing the kid at school who always got picked last. Were you that kid Gol?

Made Martin O'Neill the greatest manager of all time. Ran up and down that touchline, did squat thrusts and 'threw his arms in the air like he just don't care'

4 minutes ago, Nibs said:

Picked first? What ahead of Palmer? Ahead of Caicedo? You're having a laugh.

It's not even that I don't rate Enzo. I can see he has his uses and he does pop up now and again with an important goal. But more often than not, he is the worst player in a blue shirt. Eeven on Saturday when he scored his penalty and took the corner for the assist, most will agree, he was our worst player. He's a good squad member but his minutes on the pitch need to be managed a lot better.

Day 1 after 1 training he was the first name for us, and kept being that till this day, for all practical purposes he is wearing the captains armband even so you're way out of your depth here thinking that Enzo is being picked last or even close to that, you having a laugh is just a sad side note.

2 hours ago, Nibs said:

I love that description! "one of the most hard working players" and he "tries". That's like describing the kid at school who always got picked last. Were you that kid Gol?

No doubt he will get the "clubman of the year" award this year....such a horrible one to win ha ha, basically "well he tried hard" award.

13 hours ago, Gol15 said:

I never said anything that goes against everything you have said here, if you actually try to understand the difference from sh*t takes on the internet and real life of course.

You're on such an elevated level, nobody can reach your height. So I won't try, but feel free to mansplain it.