3 hours ago, Bob stark said:

Not really. 

Carrying one passenger is not difficult especially if he is a st. PSG carried 3 passengers, now this is whole another story. 

He’s not a striker.  I think there’s a difference between a player who isn’t naturally good at tackles and interceptions who still runs and puts pressure on the opponent rather than just plain lazy and unwilling to run for the team.  not sure the stats are able to convey this though.

I don’t see why anyone should be given special licence for being lazy.  

49 minutes ago, DarkMata said:

He’s not a striker.  I think there’s a difference between a player who isn’t naturally good at tackles and interceptions who still runs and puts pressure on the opponent rather than just plain lazy and unwilling to run for the team.  not sure the stats are able to convey this though.

I don’t see why anyone should be given special licence for being lazy.  

I wasn't talking about cherki in particular but I just want to point out carrying player who doesn't want to defend is not a problem especially if he is playing in the middle. It is slightly harder on the side but not the end of the world. 

 

This one definately has some Taarabt/Ben Arfa vibes about him. There's been some noise in regard to him being lazy and arrogant. 

Exciting player with enormous skill and creativity. As some have mentioned he doesn't look very pacy - but neither were players like Eriksen and Deli Alli.
- Both performed great under Pochettino. Eriksen probably as the more hard working part.

He's interesting - but not to sure if he's worth the €43m that's being quoted. 5G/10A in 83 Ligue 1 games.

Sure, he was very young when he his named was first introduced to the big stage - but it has since taken 2-3 seasons for him to really break through after that. Last season was first decent season with 4G/6A in 34 games i Ligue 1. Still, this was in a team where an 31-year-old Lacazette managed 27G/5A in 35 games. 

Seems like Carney is staying. Doubt this move happens then. 

1 hour ago, Sconnie Blue said:

Seems like Carney is staying. Doubt this move happens then. 

Good...on the Carney front

2 hours ago, Hanzen said:

This one definately has some Taarabt/Ben Arfa vibes about him. There's been some noise in regard to him being lazy and arrogant. 

Exciting player with enormous skill and creativity. As some have mentioned he doesn't look very pacy - but neither were players like Eriksen and Deli Alli.
- Both performed great under Pochettino. Eriksen probably as the more hard working part.

He's interesting - but not to sure if he's worth the €43m that's being quoted. 5G/10A in 83 Ligue 1 games.

Sure, he was very young when he his named was first introduced to the big stage - but it has since taken 2-3 seasons for him to really break through after that. Last season was first decent season with 4G/6A in 34 games i Ligue 1. Still, this was in a team where an 31-year-old Lacazette managed 27G/5A in 35 games. 

He's only 19.  How many 19 year old attacking midfielders are getting double figures in goals or assist?  Our very own Hazard only had 5 goals in the same league, and Saka only 5, both at the same age.  Most appearances would likely be as a late subs for 10 minutes or so given that they all started playing at 17 (16 for Cherki)

Both Hazard and Saka exploded at 21, will Cherki do the same I don't know, too early to judge but he looks head and shoulders above most 19 year olds.

He looks fat from the pictures I’ve seen. 

10 hours ago, DarkMata said:

He's only 19.  How many 19 year old attacking midfielders are getting double figures in goals or assist?  Our very own Hazard only had 5 goals in the same league, and Saka only 5, both at the same age.  Most appearances would likely be as a late subs for 10 minutes or so given that they all started playing at 17 (16 for Cherki)

Both Hazard and Saka exploded at 21, will Cherki do the same I don't know, too early to judge but he looks head and shoulders above most 19 year olds.

Well said.. was certain Hazard only earned his move after exploding at 21 at Lille. 

15 hours ago, DarkMata said:

He's only 19.  How many 19 year old attacking midfielders are getting double figures in goals or assist?  Our very own Hazard only had 5 goals in the same league, and Saka only 5, both at the same age.  Most appearances would likely be as a late subs for 10 minutes or so given that they all started playing at 17 (16 for Cherki)

Both Hazard and Saka exploded at 21, will Cherki do the same I don't know, too early to judge but he looks head and shoulders above most 19 year olds.

I think I get where you're going. However, I've never mentioned double figures anywhere as a criteria for succes. 

It's not that I think that Cherki isn't a talent. As mentioned he has massive skill and creativity already. He's interesting. 

Besides, it's easy to shape data towards any agenda. Below you'll see actual data for Hazard - not just goals. 

Hazard: 09/10 (18Y) 52M; 10G/13A
Hazard: 10/11 (19Y)  54M; 12G/14A

Across two of his first seasons as a senior he managed 49 G/A in 106 matches. He didn't explode at 21. He did it way before.

Saka, well. We could just as well have taken any other CAM/RW for that sake. Not sure how he's chosen in this comparison?
Some talents does take more time to get into the first team. Cherki was there at 16 - Saka only started playing first team football at 18.

Since then he's played four full seasons as an integral part the team in all seasons. He didn't just explode last season.

Anyhow. My point was that it would be sad if he was one of the young talents that bursts to the scene at an extremely early age only to fall through.

Despite playing 3-4 seasons at Lyon, this is his first season where he's close to really breaking through. Again, this is in Ligue 1 - at a club where a player that Arsenal didn't need managed 27G/5A.

He could end out taking another step next year - and he probably will. Though he could also end up as Mastour, Januzaj and Bojan Krkic (or Ben Arfa/Taarabt; ie. players that never fulfilled their potential).

All I'm saying is that there's some riscs given that he already has somewhat a reputation of being lazy despite being 19Y. With this in mind there are some potential areas that reminds Taarabt/Ben Arfa - absolute magicians that were sadly deemed lazy. 

Is he what we need right now? At €43m I'm just not so sure.

1 hour ago, Hanzen said:

I think I get where you're going. However, I've never mentioned double figures anywhere as a criteria for succes. 

It's not that I think that Cherki isn't a talent. As mentioned he has massive skill and creativity already. He's interesting. 

Besides, it's easy to shape data towards any agenda. Below you'll see actual data for Hazard - not just goals. 

Hazard: 09/10 (18Y) 52M; 10G/13A
Hazard: 10/11 (19Y)  54M; 12G/14A

Across two of his first seasons as a senior he managed 49 G/A in 106 matches. He didn't explode at 21. He did it way before.

Saka, well. We could just as well have taken any other CAM/RW for that sake. Not sure how he's chosen in this comparison?
Some talents does take more time to get into the first team. Cherki was there at 16 - Saka only started playing first team football at 18.

Since then he's played four full seasons as an integral part the team in all seasons. He didn't just explode last season.

Anyhow. My point was that it would be sad if he was one of the young talents that bursts to the scene at an extremely early age only to fall through.

Despite playing 3-4 seasons at Lyon, this is his first season where he's close to really breaking through. Again, this is in Ligue 1 - at a club where a player that Arsenal didn't need managed 27G/5A.

He could end out taking another step next year - and he probably will. Though he could also end up as Mastour, Januzaj and Bojan Krkic (or Ben Arfa/Taarabt; ie. players that never fulfilled their potential).

All I'm saying is that there's some riscs given that he already has somewhat a reputation of being lazy despite being 19Y. With this in mind there are some potential areas that reminds Taarabt/Ben Arfa - absolute magicians that were sadly deemed lazy. 

Is he what we need right now? At €43m I'm just not so sure.

Don’t think I shaped any data, I just matched the one league season at 19.  Anyway that’s besides the point I was making which was goal ratios for me aren’t the best metric to judge young players on.  
 

I think we agree he looks like a very talented player.   I see a player that does things on the pitch not many players do, things you can’t coach, his work rate and goal output can.  Yes he could be the next big flop but that would be down to him personally and that’s the difficult metric to judge.  He could knuckle down and really push to be the best player he can be or he could just get a nice big paycheque and think he’s already made it.  
 

Agree the fee is a bit steep, half the Mudryk deal with a similar risks though, plus we can always sell him to Arsenal for £40 million in a couple of years if it doesn’t work out.

37 minutes ago, DarkMata said:

Don’t think I shaped any data, I just matched the one league season at 19.  Anyway that’s besides the point I was making which was goal ratios for me aren’t the best metric to judge young players on.  
 

I think we agree he looks like a very talented player.   I see a player that does things on the pitch not many players do, things you can’t coach, his work rate and goal output can.  Yes he could be the next big flop but that would be down to him personally and that’s the difficult metric to judge.  He could knuckle down and really push to be the best player he can be or he could just get a nice big paycheque and think he’s already made it.  
 

Agree the fee is a bit steep, half the Mudryk deal with a similar risks though, plus we can always sell him to Arsenal for £40 million in a couple of years if it doesn’t work out.

True that 😂

just get him 

3 hours ago, Hanzen said:

I think I get where you're going. However, I've never mentioned double figures anywhere as a criteria for succes. 

It's not that I think that Cherki isn't a talent. As mentioned he has massive skill and creativity already. He's interesting. 

Besides, it's easy to shape data towards any agenda. Below you'll see actual data for Hazard - not just goals. 

Hazard: 09/10 (18Y) 52M; 10G/13A
Hazard: 10/11 (19Y)  54M; 12G/14A

Across two of his first seasons as a senior he managed 49 G/A in 106 matches. He didn't explode at 21. He did it way before.

Saka, well. We could just as well have taken any other CAM/RW for that sake. Not sure how he's chosen in this comparison?
Some talents does take more time to get into the first team. Cherki was there at 16 - Saka only started playing first team football at 18.

Since then he's played four full seasons as an integral part the team in all seasons. He didn't just explode last season.

Anyhow. My point was that it would be sad if he was one of the young talents that bursts to the scene at an extremely early age only to fall through.

Despite playing 3-4 seasons at Lyon, this is his first season where he's close to really breaking through. Again, this is in Ligue 1 - at a club where a player that Arsenal didn't need managed 27G/5A.

He could end out taking another step next year - and he probably will. Though he could also end up as Mastour, Januzaj and Bojan Krkic (or Ben Arfa/Taarabt; ie. players that never fulfilled their potential).

All I'm saying is that there's some riscs given that he already has somewhat a reputation of being lazy despite being 19Y. With this in mind there are some potential areas that reminds Taarabt/Ben Arfa - absolute magicians that were sadly deemed lazy. 

Is he what we need right now? At €43m I'm just not so sure.

Fair points. My counter would be he is still only “19” and it’s a rarity to find someone so young trusted to play as playmaker for an European club. Usually managers tend to either loan them out to a lesser club (see Odegaard, De Bruyne) and let someone else handle their development in a low pressure environment, or let them start out on the wings until they are experienced enough and move them back into the middle (see Jose & De Bruyne’s short stint at Chelsea). To earn that trust at a young age is remarkable, and to put that into perspective Jeff Reine Adelaide (ex Arsenal) who was Lyon’s playmaker ended this season out on loan. This is also his first full season, they have slowly been bringing him into the 1st team so I wouldn’t be reading too much into his stats. His lack of defensive contributions is not also something I would worry about at 19, he is still finding his feet. Blanc has been very tough on him, criticising his performances in the press and even dropping him. Cherki has also started showing some consistent performances.

I don’t think the €40m-€45m (£35m) is a steep fee, if he has breakout season Lyon will easily demand €60m with PSG & Madrid lurking. If we sign him and it goes wrong, we can easily shift him to Strasbourg after 3 seasons for £20m and not book a loss.

Hes versatile and looks technical and two footed....

 

Sign him up! 😂😁

He is a very skilful player without doubt. My concern is that the EPL is very hard and would mark him much tighter. His penchant for dribbling (while good to the eyes) would mean more chances of turn overs and open us up to counter attacks. We would need a disciplined pivot to help maintain your defensive structure when he plays

We should definitely get him,I thought we were getting all the decent young players,I feel this would end up being the one that got away if we don't get him.

With City looking like they are selling Mahrez we've got to hope they don't go after Cherki or that could be our hopes dashed.

On 17/07/2023 at 15:47, DarkMata said:

He's only 19.  How many 19 year old attacking midfielders are getting double figures in goals or assist?  Our very own Hazard only had 5 goals in the same league, and Saka only 5, both at the same age.  Most appearances would likely be as a late subs for 10 minutes or so given that they all started playing at 17 (16 for Cherki)

Both Hazard and Saka exploded at 21, will Cherki do the same I don't know, too early to judge but he looks head and shoulders above most 19 year olds.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but didn't Hazard win Ligue 1 YPOTY when he was 18-20 and then carried Lille to their league title at age 19-20 winning Ligue 1 POTY at ages 19-21. Hazard was by far the best player in Ligue 1 at 19.

Looks more of a Boufal than a Hazard imo. 

1 hour ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Correct me if i'm wrong, but didn't Hazard win Ligue 1 YPOTY when he was 18-20 and then carried Lille to their league title at age 19-20 winning Ligue 1 POTY at ages 19-21. Hazard was by far the best player in Ligue 1 at 19.

Looks more of a Boufal than a Hazard imo. 

As you say Hazard goes on to win back to back player of the seasons with 20 goals in his last year.  Judging him solely on the 5 goals he scored the previous season when he was 18-19 would have given a false idea of how good he actually was.  I'm not comparing the 2 claiming they are of similar quality, I don't think this lad is anyway close to Hazard and probably never will be.  Just that constantly comparing goal ratios is kinda pointless with these young players, as few are prolific at that age.  Ricardo Quaresma also had about 5 goals at similar age and went on to win Primeira Liga player of the year - he turned out to be sh*t.  

There's probably a higher chance of him being a Boufal than a Hazard, but those are the odds, diamonds are hard to find. 

15 hours ago, 2211 said:

With City looking like they are selling Mahrez we've got to hope they don't go after Cherki or that could be our hopes dashed.

Already have Madueke and that Gabriel lad impressed last night. 

29 minutes ago, DarkMata said:

As you say Hazard goes on to win back to back player of the seasons with 20 goals in his last year.  Judging him solely on the 5 goals he scored the previous season when he was 18-19 would have given a false idea of how good he actually was.  I'm not comparing the 2 claiming they are of similar quality, I don't think this lad is anyway close to Hazard and probably never will be.  Just that constantly comparing goal ratios is kinda pointless with these young players, as few are prolific at that age.  Ricardo Quaresma also had about 5 goals at similar age and went on to win Primeira Liga player of the year - he turned out to be sh*t.  

There's probably a higher chance of him being a Boufal than a Hazard, but those are the odds, diamonds are hard to find. 

Always funny on social media seeing liverpool fans use goals to say that Salah is better than Hazard but god forbid you use their own logic against them and mention Lampard's goals compared to Gerrard. 

Could be a load of rubbish but this guy says we have ended our interest in Cherki as Pocchetino doesn't rate his attitude.

 

https://www.football.london/chelsea-fc/transfer-news/rayan-cherki-transfer-decision-chelsea-27419105

If that's the case I expect Sterling to be dropped almost immediately. 

On 17/07/2023 at 22:05, JM7 said:

He looks fat from the pictures I’ve seen. 

I think it’s mainly due to the fact he has a fat face, as physically, despite being bulky he’s definitely not hazard-summer vibes fat.

If he has an attitude problem then fair enough to Pochettino, probs faked his passport anyway, as there is no way that’s a 19 year year old kid.

For me, with Nkunku & Carney now out this is the ideal signing.

Suits the current model of young + potential.

Seen rumours resurfacing today and personally all for it.