14 hours ago, JM7 said:

It’s just a shame that we’ve got a proven PL striker who is homegrown and we’re willing to sell him. 

Apart from the homegrown bit this exact same argument was made in Michy's defense for years.

Just now, Argo said:

Apart from the homegrown bit this exact same argument was made in Michy's defense for years.

Not really, Michy is a penalty box player who can only score, tammy is far better 

1 minute ago, Bob stark said:

Not really, Michy is a penalty box player who can only score, tammy is far better 

Fair enough but the general point remains that you need a lot more than a goal record at teams looking to be at the top, even elite scorers like Gomez and RVN fell victim to the chop at Bayern and United respectively because of that.

1 hour ago, Valhalla said:

I disagree that he has marginalised Gilmour. Foden was in a similar situation with Pep not playing him often, instead he was slowly brought into the team. Now look at him. Gilmour was set to go on loan but Tuchel wanted to keep him with the 1st team. I think we will see more of Gilmour next season. Time is on his side, no need to rush him. Training with the 1st team during these big games we are playing in now is better than just sending him out on loan to a random relegation side. 

Gilmour didn't travel with the squad for either of the Champions League games against Porto. 

Yesterday Emerson, a left back by trade, was bought on ahead of Gilmour. 

Sorry but I just don't see how that's of a benefit to Gilmour. 

7 minutes ago, ForeverCarefree said:

Gilmour didn't travel with the squad for either of the Champions League games against Porto. 

Yesterday Emerson, a left back by trade, was bought on ahead of Gilmour. 

Sorry but I just don't see how that's of a benefit to Gilmour. 

Gilmour is a deep lying playmaker, why on earth would we bring him on in a position he's probably never trained in before let alone played?

Edited April 18, 20215 yr by Argo

Just now, Argo said:

Gilmour is a deep lying playmaker, why on earth would be bring him on in a position he's probably never trained in before let alone played?

So what's the argument for putting a left back on to play in midfield? 

4 minutes ago, ForeverCarefree said:

So what's the argument for putting a left back on to play in midfield? 

Emerson was brought on in the wing something he's done a lot of times in his career, not brilliantly granted (hence being moved to LB in the first place) but he still has some idea on how to play that position.

Gilmour by compairison has probably never even trained in that position, he was about as relevant to that switch as Caballero.

6 minutes ago, Argo said:

Emerson was brought on in the wing something he's done a lot of times in his career, not brilliantly granted (hence being moved to LB in the first place) but he still has some idea on how to play that position.

Gilmour by compairison has probably never even trained in that position, he was about as relevant to that switch as Caballero.

When has Emerson played as a winger? He came on for Ziyech. If he wasn’t good that he moved to LB, why use him there? He could have brought on Gilmore to play with Jorginho and let Kante do his thing higher up. And certainly Gilmour is the better player of the two. Happy with the result, and it worked, but it’s just normal that some people asks questions.

13 minutes ago, Argo said:

Emerson was brought on in the wing 

But he wasn't playing on the wing he was part of a midfield 3 with Kante and Jorginho. 

For a time he was playing on the right of that 3.

After he came on we were playing 5-3-2 with Havertz and Pulisic as the forward 2.

1 hour ago, Argo said:

Fair enough but the general point remains that you need a lot more than a goal record at teams looking to be at the top, even elite scorers like Gomez and RVN fell victim to the chop at Bayern and United respectively because of that.

In the current game it's more about systems than individual qualities. Having a goal record is fine but you need to be scoring at a rate of 1 goal in 2 games if you don't contribute much to the team's performance. 

Lewandowski doesn't really trouble defences much but give him half a chance and he can score. Tammy is a good poacher that's it.

1 hour ago, ForeverCarefree said:

So what's the argument for putting a left back on to play in midfield? 

Probably because it was all about hanging on at that point. And bringing on someone with defensive awareness, strength and speed was the right move in my view.

Billy Gilmour wasn't going to be useful in that kind of situation.

When Tuchel was asked why he dropped mount against wolves, he said he preferred to put the pressure on the older players, maybe goes some way to explaining Emerson over gilmour yesterday, although I would argue from a tactical point of view, it was probably the better decision, since he was looking at covering the inside left position, where gundogan was finding space. 

Have I stumbled into the Billy Gilmour thread by mistake? Try to stay on topic guys and girls!

For what it's worth Abraham to Leicester would be an excellent deal for both Leicester and Tammy.

8 minutes ago, PloKoon13 said:

For what it's worth Abraham to Leicester would be an excellent deal for both Leicester and Tammy.

How much would we be looking at? If we rinse Leicester even half as much as they rinsed us for drinky and chilly, then it could end up being a good deal for us as well. 

Maybe we could throw in Drinkwater for free as well.

33 minutes ago, PloKoon13 said:

For what it's worth Abraham to Leicester would be an excellent deal for both Leicester and Tammy.

Really would be.

24 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

How much would we be looking at? If we rinse Leicester even half as much as they rinsed us for drinky and chilly, then it could end up being a good deal for us as well. 

Question is could we use talks to bring in someone from Leicester who could prove useful for us? Harvey Barnes perhaps or maybe Nididi?

5 hours ago, Argo said:

Fair enough but the general point remains that you need a lot more than a goal record at teams looking to be at the top, even elite scorers like Gomez and RVN fell victim to the chop at Bayern and United respectively because of that.

But Tammy is so much more than a penalty box player and goal getter. 

IMO if developed right, tammy can be an absolute monster of a striker. The fact that he is not on the team really piss me off. I understand if our striker is Diego Costa/Drogba but it is timo werner. A lot of praise for timo, but timo playing as nailed down starter make 0 sense. He should be just part of rotation. Play him against high line otherwise rotate him. 

Edited April 18, 20215 yr by Bob stark

19 minutes ago, Bob stark said:

But Tammy is so much more than a penalty box player and goal getter. 

IMO if developed right, tammy can be an absolute monster of a striker. The fact that he is not on the team really piss me off. I understand if our striker is Diego Costa/Drogba but it is timo werner. A lot of praise for timo, but timo playing as nailed down starter make 0 sense. He should be just part of rotation. Play him against high line otherwise rotate him. 

But again, you can say that he is a complete, all round striker etc - but this is not bourne out in his performances. He has not done nearly enough to earn a place - goals or assists leading to 1 point is evidence of that. 

5 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

But again, you can say that he is a complete, all round striker etc - but this is not bourne out in his performances. He has not done nearly enough to earn a place - goals or assists leading to 1 point is evidence of that. 

I really don't think you understand the meaning of complete striker. Werner is a very good example of non complete striker. He is only good at one thing other than that he is a liability. 

I really don't want us to repeat our mistake. We lost salah, kdb and Lukaku. Losing salah isn't a problem, you can't play salah and hazard together. But we lost kdb for Oscar and Willian. Why? I like both player but you can easily see kdb fit into am role. We lost Lukaku but at least we lose Lukaku for Costa. 

Right now we don't play cho and Tammy for Werner and ziyech.

Cho didn't play well one game, out next few games. Tammy didn't play well, out till the season. Ziyech played awful, start the next game, useless again, start again wth. Same with timo, in timo case it is very2 simple. Against high line he is very good against low block he is a liability rinse repeat. 

 

 

30 minutes ago, Bob stark said:

I really don't think you understand the meaning of complete striker.

Maybe I dont....

To me, a complete striker is:

A) someone who can score goals regularly (including against top teams in big games)

B) score important goals to win points

C) Use their physique to win personal battles and bully defenders

D) Regularly assist

E) Be able to head the ball.

To me, THAT is what a complete striker does.

Complete strikers are rare breeds, limited to special players. To me, players like Kane, Lewondowski, Cavani, Benzema, Drogba, Prime Torres, Crespo can all be argued were complete strikers.

Tammy on the other hand, at best has not proven his ability to deliver on A, B, C, D or E, and at worst, is downright useless at scoring big goals,heading or winning physical battles - instead preferring to fall over and wave his hands in the air.

On 18/04/2021 at 16:34, Bob stark said:

But Tammy is so much more than a penalty box player and goal getter. 

IMO if developed right, tammy can be an absolute monster of a striker. The fact that he is not on the team really piss me off. I understand if our striker is Diego Costa/Drogba but it is timo werner. A lot of praise for timo, but timo playing as nailed down starter make 0 sense. He should be just part of rotation. Play him against high line otherwise rotate him. 

Can you give me all the qualities you believe that Tammy has that will make him an absolute ‘MONSTER’ of a striker?

I’m just not seeing it on 2 years performances with us so far!

I see an average player that has scored against lesser teams, and failed to perform in big games when it matters.

On 18/04/2021 at 09:14, axman2526 said:

Really would be.

Question is could we use talks to bring in someone from Leicester who could prove useful for us? Harvey Barnes perhaps or maybe Nididi?

I doubt that Leicester would be too interested in Tammy to be honest, he is very over rated & if they were Ndidi is probably worth 3 times as much a TA. Barnes probably twice as much. Villa would like him back as they remember him from the Championship where he looked good. 

I'm not sure Villa would be either now that they have Olly Watkins.

Dean Smith said Tammy would score yet nowhere as many as he should.

Glad we continue to overlook are best goal scorer when we're sweeping aside all these easy teams.