On 4/17/2018 at 08:13, Stim said:

Morata has more league goals than Torres ever managed for us in a season in his entire time here. He has basically double the amount of league goals Torres scored in 3 out of 4 seasons. His league goal tally equal Torres' second highest output for us in a season in ALL competitions. Torres best season was 8 more goals, 9 of which were scored in the europa league.

All this talk about preferring Torres is just absence making the heart grow fonder or an irrational level of disdain for Morata.

I can't help but scratch my head when I see people using Torres comparisons.

Did you even watch Torres when he was here? You can't have done to even think it's a feasible thing to say, Torres was so bad that they even made a website for him which was running for months and months "has-fernando-torres-scored-a-goal-yet . com" something silly along those lines. He even became a likeable underdog by so many other fans because they felt sorry for him.. They felt sorry for a rival player, embarrassment wasn't in it. 

Another poor performance today missed two 1 v 1 chances. 

3 minutes ago, DG19 said:

Another poor performance today missed two 1 v 1 chances. 

The first one was tough, the keeper closed Morata down really well, not many would have scored from that chance, but the second one.........that was like a flashback to Torres.

Morata should never have taken that number 9 shirt, it's cursed 

Juventus are welcome to him.

He’s pants.

16 minutes ago, DG19 said:

Another poor performance today missed two 1 v 1 chances. 

Missing 1v1s is fine. Honestly, can be improved. But when you cant square the ball for your teammate to score in an open freaking goal, thats the worrying part. Should be benched till the end of the season. Literally has done NOTHING to warrant a starting spot. 

He had 3 chances, 1st he took an extra touch and the angle went tight, the 2nd I don't think he could've done any better, but the 3rd should've been tucked away, even if it was a sensational save. 

I know Batshuayi has his floors, but I think he would be quality in a 2 man attack with giroud, who does the things bats is poor at, brilliantly. 

Not really a long term solution though with giroud being 32. 

Not sure what will happen with morata, he looked really angry with himself, but he needs to improve his finishing or he will never be a top striker at a big club.

Can everyone stop calling me out when i call him sh*t now. On par with Bakayoko this season as our worst player, luckily a few early goals to mask it.

2 minutes ago, big blue said:

He had 3 chances, 1st he took an extra touch and the angle went tight, the 2nd I don't think he could've done any better, but the 3rd should've been tucked away, even if it was a sensational save. 

I know Batshuayi has his floors, but I think he would be quality in a 2 man attack with giroud, who does the things bats is poor at, brilliantly. 

Not really a long term solution though with giroud being 32. 

Not sure what will happen with morata, he looked really angry with himself, but he needs to improve his finishing or he will never be a top striker at a big club.

Honestly really, he has the touch and speed to beat defenders quite easy, he just needs to bury chances when they come.

One of the worst strikers I've seen at 1 v 1's which is f**king embarrassing. 

The thing is we haven't been clinical at all this season and he's mainly responsible for that. A shocking season when it comes to putting the ball in the back of the net, I can't remember another one like it, we should've been in the top 4 with all the chances we create. 

32 minutes ago, Slojo said:

One of the worst strikers I've seen. PERIOD

 

41 minutes ago, didierforever said:

 

Please don't quote me with your drivel mate, if I want a 2-year-olds opinion on something I'll let you know. 

20 minutes ago, Slojo said:

Please don't quote me with your drivel mate, if I want a 2-year-olds opinion on something I'll let you know. 

Thats fine with me, atleast I am not biased. Should we still start morata? 

35 minutes ago, didierforever said:

Thats fine with me, atleast I am not biased. Should we still start morata? 

Is this your attempt at a "I TOLD YA SO!" ? 

Well, my post is pretty self-explanatory, and if you saw my comments in the Oliver Giroud thread you would know that I would prefer Giroud to start at this moment in time. I still want to give him another season because I don't like writing players off unless they've shown absolutely no signs of being a good footballer. (Bakayoko perfect example who you strangely want to give another season, I would say that's bias just by given the lack of inconsistency).

I don't throw my toys out of the pram when I see a player badly perform, some footballers need more time than others, and if he doesn't improve next season then, by all means, he should be sold.  

Edited April 20, 20188 yr by Slojo

2 hours ago, Slojo said:

Is this your attempt at a "I TOLD YA SO!" ? 

Well, my post is pretty self-explanatory, and if you saw my comments in the Oliver Giroud thread you would know that I would prefer Giroud to start at this moment in time. I still want to give him another season because I don't like writing players off unless they've shown absolutely no signs of being a good footballer. (Bakayoko perfect example who you strangely want to give another season, I would say that's bias just by given the lack of inconsistency).

I don't throw my toys out of the pram when I see a player badly perform, some footballers need more time than others, and if he doesn't improve next season then, by all means, he should be sold.  

I remember you saying morata should be our no.1 striker till the end of the season just a few weeks back. Did not we have a bit of a back and forth then?

Thank god, you bought in Baka into the discussion or lets say cahill or lets say alonso or numerous other players - andreas. The point is not player "performing badly". I am fine with it. Its the lack of effort and his heart thats the worrying part. Thank god for giroud that we can actually see the difference made by a not so great striker giving it his all to a "highly rated" striker just going through the motions barely even trying.

Bar the misses, I though Morata was a lot better last night and I think that had a lot to do with Giroud being on the pitch putting in a shift and Morata would have been embarrassed if he had put in one of his half-arsed displays. I like the fact he was angry with himself when he came off. It's not ideal him missing chances but as long as his general play is good and he's putting in the effort I'll be fine with that.

 

1 hour ago, didierforever said:

I remember you saying morata should be our no.1 striker till the end of the season just a few weeks back. Did not we have a bit of a back and forth then?

Thank god, you bought in Baka into the discussion or lets say cahill or lets say alonso or numerous other players - andreas. The point is not player "performing badly". I am fine with it. Its the lack of effort and his heart thats the worrying part. Thank god for giroud that we can actually see the difference made by a not so great striker giving it his all to a "highly rated" striker just going through the motions barely even trying.

Yes and I was wrong, Giroud has done better than I expected him to.

If I didn't change my opinions then I would simply be in denial now wouldn't I? I'm a fan of Morata so of course I'm a little bias, but I'm not going to make excuses for his performances or attitude. I just don't understand how people (i.e. you) can compare him to Torres and want him gone after one season. Torres was much worse and people were happy to give him another season (including myself at the time, but I was sceptical about his slow pace and worrying injury scare).

Just like I was scared about signing Demba Ba because of his dodgy knee, but he turned out to be a good signing and wasn't utilised enough, when Ba played he scored. Giroud seems to have a similar mentality and I like it, do I see a starter in Giroud though? I don't sadly, but I think he would make for a great squad player.    

14 minutes ago, Slojo said:

Yes and I was wrong, Giroud has done better than I expected him to.

If I didn't change my opinions then I would simply be in denial now wouldn't I? I'm a fan of Morata so of course I'm a little bias, but I'm not going to make excuses for his performances or attitude. I just don't understand how people (i.e. you) can compare him to Torres and want him gone after one season. Torres was much worse and people were happy to give him another season (including myself at the time, but I was sceptical about his slow pace and worrying injury scare).

Just like I was scared about signing Demba Ba because of his dodgy knee, but he turned out to be a good signing and wasn't utilised enough, when Ba played he scored. Giroud seems to have a similar mentality and I like it, do I see a starter in Giroud though? I don't sadly, but I think he would make for a great squad player.    

I think the difference was we knew Torres could do it at prem level (Liverpool days) so we were hopeful he'd return to that level. Was actually surprisingly likeable for a player that had come from Scouse territory. 

 

Morata has never done it consistently starting at a top level and doesn't look like he will any time soon. His attitude also stinks that place up a bit. 

 

By the way i am in no way comparing him to Torres and think Morata should be given one more season to try and be a footballer. 

9 minutes ago, Slojo said:

Yes and I was wrong, Giroud has done better than I expected him to.

If I didn't change my opinions then I would simply be in denial now wouldn't I? I'm a fan of Morata so of course I'm a little bias, but I'm not going to make excuses for his performances or attitude. I just don't understand how people (i.e. you) can compare him to Torres and want him gone after one season. Torres was much worse and people were happy to give him another season (including myself at the time, but I was sceptical about his slow pace and worrying injury scare).

Just like I was scared about signing Demba Ba because of his dodgy knee, but he turned out to be a good signing and wasn't utilised enough, when Ba played he scored. Giroud seems to have a similar mentality and I like it, do I see a starter in Giroud though? I don't sadly, but I think he would make for a great squad player.    

I think we have gone through with the torres and morata comparision. Dont want to go round in circles.

We have also gone through why we need to cut our losses with him. Each player is different, with some you feel they can come good, and for others you see them pplaying for a whole season and dont see a single positive thing, and hence dont see how that problem solves itself in the future. Dont know what part of that argument you are not getting, I can go back and copy paste what I wrote before if you want. 

All that said, if he is here next season, I will support him with all my heart (if he can literally show an ounce of fight for the club) and hope I get proven wrong.

God 1 v 1 he really is atrocious. What makes it worse is you have a f**king winger in salah who week in, week out, is more clinical than our no.1 striker. The amount of chances salah slots away with ease identical to morata's chance yesterday.

It does enrage me, even more so when we go on to concede and draw or lose the game. If he is to stay next season those one v one chances need to improve, and drastically. 

5 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

I think the difference was we knew Torres could do it at prem level (Liverpool days) so we were hopeful he'd return to that level. Was actually surprisingly likeable for a player that had come from Scouse territory. 

 

Morata has never done it consistently starting at a top level and doesn't look like he will any time soon. His attitude also stinks that place up a bit. 

 

By the way i am in no way comparing him to Torres and think Morata should be given one more season to try and be a footballer. 

Well yeah, but he was horrifically bad and he was terrible before we signed him. Unfortunately, the only good game he had before we signed him was against us but we were losing 3-0 to Sunderland at home then so we were even worse at that time. If I remember correctly we didn't win 1 game of football in November under Carlo Ancelotti in his 2nd season, something ridiculous like that.

But the reason I brought up Bakayoko earlier is that if you believe Bakayoko can turn it around next season, why not Morata? I don't see the difference. If anything I would be more confident in Morata because he has at least shown glimpses. If Juve comes in and offer the same amount of money we paid for him, then fair enough I can understand if a lot of people were for selling him, it makes sense. But sell him for half that price because he had one bad season just seems silly to me, we may as well give him another run at it. But that's not to say we rely on him, same with Bakayoko, don't put all our eggs in one basket, make sure we signed other options. With Morata hopefully, we can bring in Michy and give Michy more game time. 

4 minutes ago, didierforever said:

I think we have gone through with the torres and morata comparision. Dont want to go round in circles.

We have also gone through why we need to cut our losses with him. Each player is different, with some you feel they can come good, and for others you see them pplaying for a whole season and dont see a single positive thing, and hence dont see how that problem solves itself in the future. Dont know what part of that argument you are not getting, I can go back and copy paste what I wrote before if you want. 

All that said, if he is here next season, I will support him with all my heart (if he can literally show an ounce of fight for the club) and hope I get proven wrong.

And that's fine with me, if you behaved like this regularly I wouldn't have an issue with you, but you don't make that very clear. A lot of your posts come across aggressive and full of knee jerks you need to understand why people can get frustrated with seeing you on multiple threads saying the same things. Not saying I'm perfect but I try my best to stay on topic and be positive when need be, I don't care about being right, I want whats best for my team. 

His one on one chances were taken better than before, the one where he was away was a fingertip save I think but can't be sure if it would've hit the target.

His previous misses were straight at the keeper or not even on target so there is a slight improvement but the fact remains that he had another 3 chances yesterday and didn't score any of them.

Also he can't take any physicality from defenders and not even jeering from the home fans which is part and parcel of being a footballer, to react like that shows how soft he is.

He might grow from being in the PL but at the moment he is showing that he is extremely far out of his comfort zone, probably too much to get any positives from it. 

@Nibs You might want to see his tweet. 

 

 

I don't think any Chelsea fan can be unhappy with that response. Fair play. 

2 minutes ago, Slojo said:

I don't think any Chelsea fan can be unhappy with that response. Fair play. 

Trouble is, he's been missing those sorts of chances all season and he's cost us a few points this season through bad finishing. 

He's a £60m striker, our most expensive ever player. Chances like that 1v1 should be his bread and butter and should be finishing that 99 times out of 100. Do you think if that chance had fallen to Diego Costa or Jimmy Floydd Hasselbaink they'd have missed it? I don't because they were pure goal scorers and they had a ruthlessness in front of goal that Morata doesn't possess. 

2 minutes ago, Slojo said:

And that's fine with me, if you behaved like this regularly I wouldn't have an issue with you, but you don't make that very clear. A lot of your posts come across aggressive and full of knee jerks you need to understand why people can get frustrated with seeing you on multiple threads saying the same things. Not saying I'm perfect but I try my best to stay on topic and be positive when need be, I don't care about being right, I want whats best for my team. 

There should be something positive going on to be positive. I dont know if everything after this point would be classified as "aggressive" and "knee-jerk" or not but I will try and put my point ahead.

Our midfield was getting ripped apart by each and every team we played. Literally. Yet, Conte continues to use cesc in a 2-man mid. Whats their to be positive here. Honestly. 

This was my first post right after the team sheets were announced. Give me a reason to be positive. Everyone here knew what our problem(s) were, how can a 10million pound earning manager not see that? Last night we actually controlled the game, did not need to defend for the majority of the game and hence gave the opponents very few chances that they created or chances that they could take and capitalize on our mistakes. And we did make a few - GCs last ditch tackle after the poor touch, Kante playing the ball blindly and square right in front of our own box. Maybe it was due to cesc not being on the pitch or due to the 3-man mid, but majority of the fans have been wanting both of these or either of these things to happen, it could have saved our season or atleast given us a better chance to finish in top4. If the manager does not do the needful, I dont see the point of being positive. He is basically handicapping us in every game and not trying ANYTHING different to stop the rut. I honestly in no way think thats "knee-jerk". Yes, the way I express can be OTT and come out as "aggressive", but definitely not knee jerk. 

Morata's missed chances this season:

Burnley home - At the end of the match ball came off his heel in the last minute.

Spurs away - easy header wide

Bournemouth away - shot wide at the end of 1st half.

Roma away - blasted over the bar to miss equaliser.

Quarabag away - missed 2 good chances after coming on.

Atlético home - 1 on 1 straight at keeper to win the group.

West ham away - last minute volleyed wide to rescue a point.

Stoke home - missed a couple of 1 on 1's.

Arsenal away - missed a couple of 1 on 1's. 

United away - hit the bar, was unlucky, but probably should've scored.

West ham home - missed a header in the second half.

Burnley away - missed a couple of 1 on 1's. 

That's 14 big chances, and im sure I've missed a few aswell. 

I was a striker myself, so by no means do I think he should have scored every one of those, some where unlucky, some were a little more difficult, but if morata had put away half of those missed chances, he would be heading for 25 goals in his 1st season. 

I always think the time worry is when strikers aren't getting chances, which is why I don't see this as the same situation to Torres at all. Torres obviously missed a few, like all strikers do, but I think his loss of pace, and the way we played, meant he wasn't getting the chances he used to. 

I would definately stick with morata for another season, because I think he isn't far off being a top striker, and his instinct to sniff out chances is good. 

His temperament and composure need to improve, and the rest will fall into place.