Just now, The Brit said:

yeah I noticed that with Mount too...quite telling against fulham that when azpi got scythed in two by the fulham full back, he was the only one to react in anger/stand up to the kid. In the old days, there would be a swarm of chelsea players defending their teammate

The old days? How about 5 years ago, remember when one of our players got fouled in the PSG game and literally all of our first 11 were surrounding the player to get him sent off. My memory is fuzzy on who it was at the time, but I remember the PSG fans complaining about it. And even though we got knocked out that game, that was still a proper Chelsea team that won things. 

Just now, Osgoodwasgood said:

Yes with a squad that could field two sides that would finish in the top five in the premier league, in a league where you get a handful of tricky games all season, Nothing like the premiership.

I could have won a trophy at Madrid with the resources he has at his disposure.

He won 3 Champions League's back to back.... And Barcelona usually win the league there, Zidane has won it twice with Madrid and numerous other trophies while being there. 

If he can't get credit for that, what can he get credit for... 

4 hours ago, nonotnowjim said:

Was half expecting to turn on gadgets this morning and see the news that lamps is done. A Bloody hard situation and this will no doubt be hurting Frank as much as anyone. He is proper Chels - but I can't see a way out of this. 
 

I love Lampard. He is my fav player of all time, but he has not shown enough over the past 1.5 seasons to indicate to me that he has the skills or tactical nouse to turn things around. 
 

We got top 4 last year by creeping over the line, very fortunate having done our best to throw it away at multiple times.

 

This year, after positive early signs, we have clearly regressed.  Early on this season we were a team that  played brilliantly in spurts. We would be electric for 20-25 mins , and lamps would talk about needing to extend that. But instead, those electric periods have gone.

We have instead reverted to the slow, sideways, backwards passing, lack of ideas, lack of bottle to take the game by the scruff of the neck, and frankly a lack of character. 
 

That's not all on Lampard - but he has now had half a season to address those problems - and whilst I don't expect miracles overnight, I have not seen 1 single positive development to indicate that he has the answers.  Not 1.

There has been nothing he has done, that I can see with my layman's understanding of the game, which has benefited the team.

No tweaks to get the best of his players, no system changes, uninspiring or predictable subs, no change in the style or urgency,  no apparent instructions to stop playing slow/sideways/backwards -and be more progressive. 

So, in my mind, either Lampard wants us to play like this, and is therefore not trying to make changes (I doubt this), or, the players are simply ignoring him and his instructions -but lamps continues to pick them (I doubt this) or, in my mind the most likely,  he doesn't know how to change it. 
 

I am conflicted.l and don't know what I want.

in my heart, I think he needs to go.

but I don't want him to.

I think that an experienced number 2/ advisor would help, but expect that this would be akin to a vote of confidence, wouldn't go down well with lamps himself, and would be picked apart by the media. Also I am not sure there is someone sufficiently trusted by lamps that would take the job of "special advisor"....

sorry for the long post. Can't even remember what I wrote, so hope it isn't too much waffle!

 

KTBFFH 

 

 

I am pretty sure if he doesn't see that he needs help, he will be asked to leave. If I were him, I would look to replace my number 2 with someone with more experience.

1 minute ago, Slojo said:

The old days? How about 5 years ago, remember when one of our players got fouled in the PSG game and literally all of our first 11 were surrounding the player to get him sent off. My memory is fuzzy on who it was at the time, but I remember the PSG fans complaining about it. And even though we got knocked out that game, that was still a proper Chelsea team that won things. 

Probably not a good example it was Ibrahimovic, even Cech was sprinting 50 yards to remonstrate for a 50:50, JM imo planned to get him sent off.

Better examples are with Costa with the whole team squaring up to Arsenal or Spurs especially.

6 minutes ago, Argo said:

Yeah and despite that i was a lot happier with the progress last season than i am this, i look deeper than mere results when factoring in the bigger picture.

He said that quote in a pre match presser.

I’ve nae idea how to split them when on my phone.

 

1. Are you factoring in the bigger picture though? The 5 new first team players? The lack of any proper off season? The lack of pre-season? The large amount of injuries we had early in the season? The lack of time between matches to work on things? Fixture congestion? Lack of a market to get rid of unwanted players who want game time? You sure you’re taking everything with the “bigger picture”? Find it strange you’re so unhappy given all the mitigating circumstances & no one in the league being particularly impressive.

 

2. That’s exactly what I said, AVB spouting pish to journalists, all you’ve done is add the context of where it was so I’m not sure what your point is? The Matt law reference was to Franks three year plan etc.

If we are too change it needs to be someone who suits the way the squad is shaping up, faster and more direct football.

If we were to get Simeone would we end up in this position questioning him whilst he waited to buy the correct players?

What worries me is the purchase of Werner when we don’t play to his strengths, was it a board buy or Franks request? Both scenarios are concerning even more so if it’s Franks buy who then plays completely the wrong football for him and seemingly most of the squad. 

Pains me to say it but Tuchel might be best suited or the Leipzig coach. 

Or with top 4 looking increasingly unlikely and morale so low do we give Frank the season if relegation doesn’t threaten us and allow a good few months of preparation for a new manager or Frank does then actually get us going.

2 minutes ago, Slojo said:

He won 3 Champions League's back to back.... And Barcelona usually win the league there, Zidane has won it twice with Madrid and numerous other trophies while being there. 

If he can't get credit for that, what can he get credit for... 

i thought surely Pirlo bombing with Juventus has put pay to this "even me, Shannon from Sc**thorpe and her dog could win with (name elite EU team here)"

13 minutes ago, Argo said:

Yeah and despite that i was a lot happier with the progress last season than i am this, i look deeper than results when factoring in the bigger picture.

He said that quote in a pre match presser.

Didn't the beef with Dortmund start with the incident of the terrorist scare at SIP? As for PSG, even Thiago Silva has fallen out with Leonardo.

so how would you be sure he wont start the beef with Roman and Marina? We all know they arent the best to work with tbf

1 hour ago, Sindre said:

Fairly convinced the fickle bastards in the dressing room have turned their backs on him. With a few honorable expections like Mount.

That maybe due to the fact that whenever the team is picked, Mount's name is on it. Imagine being Werner, Giroud or now Zouma when you have no idea when you are going to be in the first team again.

A report in The Athletic today saying the Board are looking at German speakers to replace FL. I suppose with some of Chelsea's potentially best players - Werner, Havertz, Pelusic and Ziyech all fluent in German it does make some sense.

7 minutes ago, Slojo said:

He won 3 Champions League's back to back.... And Barcelona usually win the league there, Zidane has won it twice with Madrid and numerous other trophies while being there. 

If he can't get credit for that, what can he get credit for... 

id prefer to see how he does with a season at Bristol Rovers with no money, Look at the Squad he's won those trophies with, he deserves Credit for his CV of course he does, but it doesn't guarantee success with a lesser budget.

17 minutes ago, Slojo said:

Again, what's Ole done at United? He's been for nearly 3 years now, he's won nothing, he's achieved nothing. Because he's first place now? How long do you think that's going to last? He's already got them knocked out of two cups including a Champions League. This league is going to be either Liverpools or Cities and by the end of it Ole will win nothing again. 

Achieved nothing?

United when he took over approx December 2018 - 8th

United at the end of the season in 2019 - 6th

United at the end of 2020 season - 3rd

United in January 2021 - 1st

 

Now, I think if we look at those placements those numbers appear to be getting better which would thus indicate that there is clearly improvement there. 

Edited January 20, 20215 yr by EdinburghBlue

1 hour ago, Slojo said:

We spent over 200 million on players,

You and a lot of others keep on saying this, mate, obsessed with the money spent 

What none of you ever mention when doing so is that, of that 200 million, over half of it was spent on two players who have turned out to be utter garbage, without even the basics of a pub-football level player for the most part, Ziyech is in and out with injury, and in and out of form when he does play, and doesn't look to me like a player who will put in the tackles when necessary.  Take that and compound it with Chilwell being a bit more breakable than a cheese straw, CHO never stepping up when he gets a chance, Pulisic trying way too hard to make it all happen on the few occasions he isn't injured, Jorginho being slower than a glacier, Kante having developed headless chicken syndrome and Giroud being our best striker at the age of 103.  (I could go on!)

 

And I know I have now opened my self up to a tsunami of over 100 googled graphs and 22 hours of Youtube showing how Havertz was the best ever player in the world in the Bremen under-13's league from that google-twat, but we all have our crosses to bear.

1 minute ago, EdinburghBlue said:

I’ve nae idea how to split them when on my phone.

 

1. Are you factoring in the bigger picture though? The 5 new first team players? The lack of any proper off season? The lack of pre-season? The large amount of injuries we had early in the season? The lack of time between matches to work on things? Fixture congestion? Lack of a market to get rid of unwanted players who want game time? You sure you’re taking everything with the “bigger picture”? Find it strange you’re so unhappy given all the mitigating circumstances & no one in the league being particularly impressive.

You say lack of time between matches, well okay we've had three midweeks off lately, so why hasn't there been signs of tactical work on the pitch? It was a perfect opportunity for Lamps and Jody to drill a tactical plan into the players so why has there been no improvement? If anything we've got worse. For perspective Sarri only had one free midweek from September onwards and iirc you were against him from quite early on (apologies if i got you mixed up with someone else).

I don't think we would like Simeone's football yet here's the thing 

I read a point the other day that I found interesting they said at CFC, we have half the team trying to play possession football and the other half trying to play quick pass attacking football and it does not work.

I was reminded of almost two months ago after a throw-in when Werner passed to Havertz and then sprinted forward and Havertz passed back to the space where Werner was in shock that he had moved.

Lately Pulisic breaks down the Left all Chilwell needs to is move forward one touch and a cross from the by-line, does he move NO!  Perhaps he is wondering where Reece is and does he need to get back to cover??

Recently no-one can hit the target, it is like Werner's form is contagious and has spread to Pulisic, CHO and Giroud. 

We had talks with Allegri recently and he is supposed to play the style that suits the squad best. 

That sounds like a potential way to save the season, if we move quickly.

 

Just now, Argo said:

You say lack of time between matches, well okay we've had three midweeks off lately, so why hasn't there been signs of tactical work on the pitch? It was a perfect opportunity for Lamps and Jody to drill a tactical plan into the players so why has there been no improvement? If anything we've got worse. For perspective Sarri only had one free midweek from September onwards and iirc you were against him from quite early on (apologies if i got you mixed up with someone else).

That’s a good question mate and honestly I don’t have the answers, without being able to see the work going on it’s hard to know. How did we look so much better defending set pieces this season? Clearly work is being done and I assume the players for whatever reason aren’t taking it on board. 
 

No, you’re right - I was against Sarri after a while, mainly because I didn’t like the style he was trying to implement, the slow build up play, 400 years in possession without trying to go forward and everything must go through Jorginho bugged me. I liked the fast counter attacking play we had prior to that. However, by the end of the season, I also said I’d quite like Sarri to stay another year as I get it was too early for Frank (Prior to it being clear he wanted to go). But now he’s here, the club were perfectly aware he was a young manager learning the ropes so it’s preposterous for them to turn around and go “he’s not the perfect manager yet, we can’t believe it 👁👄👁”
 

Liverpool are probably the style of football I enjoy the most, they’re attacking but they do it at pace getting the ball forward quickly and that’s what I believe Frank wants for us we’re just not there yet. Like I said, 3 year plan - see it out, if it’s a failure then we part ways amicably and worst case scenario we’re left with what we’re told is a very highly talented squad.

4 minutes ago, yorkleyblue said:

You and a lot of others keep on saying this, mate, obsessed with the money spent 

What none of you ever mention when doing so is that, of that 200 million, over half of it was spent on two players who have turned out to be utter garbage, without even the basics of a pub-football level player for the most part, Ziyech is in and out with injury, and in and out of form when he does play, and doesn't look to me like a player who will put in the tackles when necessary.  Take that and compound it with Chilwell being a bit more breakable than a cheese straw, CHO never stepping up when he gets a chance, Pulisic trying way too hard to make it all happen on the few occasions he isn't injured, Jorginho being slower than a glacier, Kante having developed headless chicken syndrome and Giroud being our best striker at the age of 103.  (I could go on!)

 

And I know I have now opened my self up to a tsunami of over 100 googled graphs and 22 hours of Youtube showing how Havertz was the best ever player in the world in the Bremen under-13's league from that google-twat, but we all have our crosses to bear.

Yeah well that's where you're wrong Yorkley because look at these graphs and pie charts.

 

 

You clearly need to do more research. 

33 minutes ago, EdinburghBlue said:

You’re comparing an article of him spouting pish to journalists with close ties to the club like Matt Law etc stating that this plan is in place?

 

Personally, my tipping point will be the end of a normal season, with a normal pre season, a normal fixture schedule when half the team have had time to bed in together, which will be - next season. This season as I already said was always going to be a nightmare. 
 

look at this thread, you’d think we were about to be relegated. We’re f**king 9 points off the top of the league. We finished 33 points off top last season for reference.

It is not just the defeats that are the issue, it is the manner of the defeats. A few weeks ago I read that due to the congested fixture list, there had been no time on the practice pitch to prepare the team for a particular match. In the last two weeks Chelsea have had no midweek games, played a second team against Morcambe and yet I have seen zero improvement in style or tactics. When I saw Chelsea were playing 3 in midfield with Mount and Havertz against Leicester I had absolutely no hope of seeing a good result. What did they do in training in the free weeks?

A lot of people are using OGS as a reason for lampard to stay. That is, he got them out of their slump so lampard should be given that time as well. The truth of the matter though is that a lot of united fans still don’t trust OGS and know that long term he isn’t the manager to make them a title challenger despite being high up the table. The  moment they dip form again they’ll be calling for his head. 

1 minute ago, pcmacca said:

It is not just the defeats that are the issue, it is the manner of the defeats. A few weeks ago I read that due to the congested fixture list, there had been no time on the practice pitch to prepare the team for a particular match. In the last two weeks Chelsea have had no midweek games, played a second team against Morcambe and yet I have seen zero improvement in style or tactics. When I saw Chelsea were playing 3 in midfield with Mount and Havertz against Leicester I had absolutely no hope of seeing a good result. What did they do in training in the free weeks?

Good question mate, see my response to Argo above! There have been improvements which must have been done on the training pitch, the key question is why have we not seen it now & I don’t think any of us can answer that.

I still feel Frank gets a bit longer,I really can't see him sacked yet.

1 minute ago, Frankie8Lampard said:

A lot of people are using OGS as a reason for lampard to stay. That is, he got them out of their slump so lampard should be given that time as well. The truth of the matter though is that a lot of united fans still don’t trust OGS and know that long term he isn’t the manager to make them a title challenger despite being high up the table. The  moment they dip form again they’ll be calling for his head. 

United are higher in the League not because of any tactical genuis but because their individual players particularly in midfield can score goals time and time again. Chelsea's midfield?

For anyone hoping Frank goes then you might be in luck soon, depends how much you believe Twitter talk but this guy has been spot on with info about the Mendy signing among other things well before anyone else to do with Chelsea & releases West Ham lineups before they’re announced. I genuinely believe he’s got sources at both Chelsea and West Ham but focuses on the latter because he supports them which is a shame.

 

 

We should appoint Wenger just to take the piss. 

7 minutes ago, EdinburghBlue said:

That’s a good question mate and honestly I don’t have the answers, without being able to see the work going on it’s hard to know. How did we look so much better defending set pieces this season? Clearly work is being done and I assume the players for whatever reason aren’t taking it on board. 
 

No, you’re right - I was against Sarri after a while, mainly because I didn’t like the style he was trying to implement, the slow build up play, 400 years in possession without trying to go forward and everything must go through Jorginho bugged me. I liked the fast counter attacking play we had prior to that. However, by the end of the season, I also said I’d quite like Sarri to stay another year as I get it was too early for Frank (Prior to it being clear he wanted to go). But now he’s here, the club were perfectly aware he was a young manager learning the ropes so it’s preposterous for them to turn around and go “he’s not the perfect manager yet, we can’t believe it 👁👄👁”
 

Liverpool are probably the style of football I enjoy the most, they’re attacking but they do it at pace getting the ball forward quickly and that’s what I believe Frank wants for us we’re just not there yet. Like I said, 3 year plan - see it out, if it’s a failure then we part ways amicably and worst case scenario we’re left with what we’re told is a very highly talented squad.

But they've got defensive based players that can pass it more than 10 yards Sideways, Van Djik, Henderson, Alcantara, Fabinho, Wjinaldum, this in my opinion is where Frank's ideas are falling flat.