8 minutes ago, pcmacca said:

Why not give it to the man already in the PL who clearly wants the job?

https://www.goal.com/en-us/news/werner-one-of-the-best-chelsea-using-wrong-hasenhuttl/1pa0flagyyshc1mfrhsbmcopgf

 

Was talking about managers who have no club at the moment.

If Lamps does leave and we are talking of ones at clubs he would be a good one, so would Brandan, he was tactically spot on yesterday.

50 minutes ago, Slojo said:

Just a couple of questions. 

What's your tipping point here where you decide Frank isn't the man for the job? Is it a certain number of years, or is it if we finish 15th or below? 

As someone else has said above, the man has a 3 year contract and that should be honoured.  15th or below is neither here nor there.

I don't get all creamed in the jeans about top four or finishing above Arsenal, my position has consistently been get to 40 points and avoid relegation and anything over and above that is a bonus.  Don't get me wrong, the recent rollercoaster years have been amazing, but even if we got relegated again, it wouldn't change my love of and support for the club.

As I see it, and tried to explain in my previous post as nicely as I could, I think the knee-jerk demands for Frank to be sacked are, for the most part,  a result of a more modern, I want it all and I want it now, twattering class of fan who has a sense of entitlement and exceptionalism, and are forever wanting the latest shiny shiny thing, be it a manager they know very little about but has been mentioned on Sky Sports, some 17-year old winger that they have seen a youtube compilation of or Declan f**king Rice, FFS.

I disagree with that attitude mainly because we are ONLY halfway through the season, we have won 8 and drawn 5 out of 19 matches and are in a bit of a slump at the moment.  I see no logical reason why we must sack a manager for a short run of matches that we have lost in a time of the year when, traditionally, Chelsea have performed badly, for whatever reason.  We lost 12 matches last season and finished 4th. 

We are currently at           P            W        D          L           F             A            GD         Points

Chelsea

19

8

5

6

33

23

10

29

 

On match 19 last year we had lost more, had a worse goal difference and were 3 points better off.

Chelsea

19

10

2

7

33

27

6

32

To my mind, Frank was appointed to develop youth, and install a long-term project, and, at the time, the vast majority of posters in here, and at the Bridge, were saying forcefully that they would take a year or two without silverware and challenging for the title as long as the youth were brought through and we we "weren't playing f**king Sarriball."  Now the fickle f**ks have turned and gone all squirrelly because we have lost 3 out of the last 5.

Sometimes, and I may have mentioned this before once or twice, our online fanbase embarrass the f**k out of me.

7 minutes ago, pcmacca said:

Why not give it to the man already in the PL who clearly wants the job?

https://www.goal.com/en-us/news/werner-one-of-the-best-chelsea-using-wrong-hasenhuttl/1pa0flagyyshc1mfrhsbmcopgf

 

I like Hassenhuttl but the way he started life at Southampton and the 9-0 loss against Leicester he would've been out of the door fairly quickly at Chelsea.

He was afforded time by the board and he managed to change things around well, it could've gone one of 2 ways and all credit to him to for coming out strong. Considering how much criticism Lampard is getting who is one of our own I can only imagine how he would've been treated if something similar happened to him here.

22 minutes ago, coco said:

it's already happened, Sarri had a vision, it involved Kepa, Rudiger, Christensen, Alonso in the defence and Jorginho in midfield.

What other choice did Sarri have at the time?

His only choice was to bring Jorginho with him and without him he wouldn't have managed to make the team to play his tactics at all, all the other players he simply inherited, I don't think Kepa was his choice that was most likely the board's panic decision making when Courtois left, I doubt that they would have asked Sarri to pick any keeper after which he would have answered that he wants that kid from Bilbao...

People forget that Sarri managed to finish top 3 without having a proper striker and while having a very shaky defense. He got the best out of Hazard and Kante attack-wise

I watched this last week, quite interesting for anyone who has a spare hour. 

In relation to our situation, Neville talks about how it felt going up against the better coaches in la liga, and how he was tactically under prepared, with the likes of Simeone and Valverde almost toying with him, and how their teams were always one step ahead of every change he would make. 

I feel that is what is happening with Lampard now, we have lost that element of the unknown we had last season, and alot of the better managers with good players, are finding ways to nullify us, and hurt us. 

Not even prime Mourinho would do much better with this squad.

By the way why does nobody question Lampard regarding the situation with Alonso?

After recent performances from Chilwell maybe it's time to give him some rest.

Edited January 20, 20215 yr by wizardous

1 minute ago, big blue said:

I watched this last week, quite interesting for anyone who has a spare hour. 

In relation to our situation, Neville talks about how it felt going up against the better coaches in la liga, and how he was tactically under prepared, with the likes of Simeone and Valverde almost toying with him, and how their teams were always one step ahead of every change he would make. 

I feel that is what is happening with Lampard now, we have lost that element of the unknown we had last season, and alot of the better managers with good players, are finding ways to nullify us, and hurt us. 

I agree that other teams figured us out, by all means we're struggling... But G.Neville really sucked hard, it's not comparable to Lampard. I think he had 30% win rate or something with less than 10 games won in total before he got the boot.

1 minute ago, Gol15 said:

I agree that other teams figured us out, by all means we're struggling... But G.Neville really sucked hard, it's not comparable to Lampard. I think he had 30% win rate or something with less than 10 games won in total before he got the boot.

Maybe watch the video for context.  

Make of it what you will. 

4 minutes ago, big blue said:

Maybe watch the video for context.  

Sure, I apologize I only watched around 8-10 minutes lol

12 minutes ago, big blue said:

I watched this last week, quite interesting for anyone who has a spare hour. 

In relation to our situation, Neville talks about how it felt going up against the better coaches in la liga, and how he was tactically under prepared, with the likes of Simeone and Valverde almost toying with him, and how their teams were always one step ahead of every change he would make. 

I feel that is what is happening with Lampard now, we have lost that element of the unknown we had last season, and alot of the better managers with good players, are finding ways to nullify us, and hurt us. 

I think Frank has had difficult periods in both of his previous seasons and managed to change things around and finished the seasons strong. The difference this time is that he is making changes but they are just not coming off for him, in the last 2 games he has tried 3 different formations (4-3-3, 4-2-3-1 and 4-4-2). The players are just not performing at the level which is required and him making numerous changes to personnel and formation could be the reason for the player performance.

Personally I think he needs to maybe do what Arteta did and go with the younger players who will offer him that energy especially in midfield and slowly reintegrate the experienced players. Give CHO, Billy, Anjorin, James, Tammy and Mount an extended run in the team and see if that works it certainly can't get any worse.

Just now, JM7 said:

Make of it what you will. 

 Very credible source. 

28 minutes ago, yorkleyblue said:

As someone else has said above, the man has a 3 year contract and that should be honoured.  15th or below is neither here nor there.

I don't get all creamed in the jeans about top four or finishing above Arsenal, my position has consistently been get to 40 points and avoid relegation and anything over and above that is a bonus.  Don't get me wrong, the recent rollercoaster years have been amazing, but even if we got relegated again, it wouldn't change my love of and support for the club.

As I see it, and tried to explain in my previous post as nicely as I could, I think the knee-jerk demands for Frank to be sacked are, for the most part,  a result of a more modern, I want it all and I want it now, twattering class of fan who has a sense of entitlement and exceptionalism, and are forever wanting the latest shiny shiny thing, be it a manager they know very little about but has been mentioned on Sky Sports, some 17-year old winger that they have seen a youtube compilation of or Declan f**king Rice, FFS.

I disagree with that attitude mainly because we are ONLY halfway through the season, we have won 8 and drawn 5 out of 19 matches and are in a bit of a slump at the moment.  I see no logical reason why we must sack a manager for a short run of matches that we have lost in a time of the year when, traditionally, Chelsea have performed badly, for whatever reason.  We lost 12 matches last season and finished 4th. 

We are currently at           P            W        D          L           F             A            GD         Points

Chelsea

19

8

5

6

33

23

10

29

 

On match 19 last year we had lost more, had a worse goal difference and were 3 points better off.

Chelsea

19

10

2

7

33

27

6

32

To my mind, Frank was appointed to develop youth, and install a long-term project, and, at the time, the vast majority of posters in here, and at the Bridge, were saying forcefully that they would take a year or two without silverware and challenging for the title as long as the youth were brought through and we we "weren't playing f**king Sarriball."  Now the fickle f**ks have turned and gone all squirrelly because we have lost 3 out of the last 5.

Sometimes, and I may have mentioned this before once or twice, our online fanbase embarrass the f**k out of me.

And to be fair, if anyone is entitled to be demanding of success  now it is Yorkley. Yet he continue to back Lamps to the hilt, a stance I fully agree on. He does so even though he may never see us win a trophy again. I mean he is catching dear old Methuselah up in years who knows how many more seasons the old boy has left to enjoy...🤣

2 hours ago, EdinburghBlue said:

I’ve nae idea how to split them when on my phone.

 

1. Are you factoring in the bigger picture though? The 5 new first team players? The lack of any proper off season? The lack of pre-season? The large amount of injuries we had early in the season? The lack of time between matches to work on things? Fixture congestion? Lack of a market to get rid of unwanted players who want game time? You sure you’re taking everything with the “bigger picture”? Find it strange you’re so unhappy given all the mitigating circumstances & no one in the league being particularly impressive.

 

2. That’s exactly what I said, AVB spouting pish to journalists, all you’ve done is add the context of where it was so I’m not sure what your point is? The Matt law reference was to Franks three year plan etc.

"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth". - Mike Tyson.

Of course, every newly hired manager has a plan, which he presents to the board, that's how it works everywhere. What else is he supposed to say? "I know things can go wrong in a hurry and I may very well get the sack before we even reach halfway point of my plan, but for now let's hope and pray it won't come to that"? Frank knew the deal coming in, he played under a bunch of various managers at Chelsea and is fully aware how fast things can deteriorate for a manager if the team starts losing and performing poorly.

5 new players is a good thing. Last season we were praising Frank for doing well without getting any new players in, then he got backed with more money than any other manager in the world, and suddenly it's a burden? Of course, some players settle faster than others and there are some that never adapt. But when they all struggle, chances are the manager is at fault. All teams didn't have preseason, not just us. Our injury situation was never critical, we have a deep squad and our last few matches we had almost everybody available, yet it didn't make things better, not one bit. Don't see the issue with unwanted players still being at the club, it affected other teams because they couldn't buy new players without selling. We did.

Last, but not least. Matt Law is just another journo. He doesn't have any inside info on what's going at the club so let's not take his word as the ultimate truth.

Last season we arguably had a worse run in the league around the same time, starting in late November with defeat at City. From that point until we beat Spurs in late Feb we went W4-D3-L7. That included defeats at Newcastle, along with home losses against strugglers like Bournemouth. 

My point here is that Frank still found a way to turn things around then, so as long as he is in charge he could still do the same now. Even if things look pretty desperate for him at present. Understandably the main difference between this season and last season is the expectation level that comes from the money spent on new signings. However it is not unusual for new signings to take a while to settle in. Look at how well Ndombele is playing for Spurs now. He was written off as a flop last season with the same manager. 

I personally cannot see Frank lasting beyond the end of the season unless some clear progress is shown. Our board is unlikely to show much sentiment and he may well go before then. However I still think he can turn the corner in the short term if he is given some more time.

The moment we appointed Frank we all seemed to agree that for this to work we needed to give him time to grow as a manager, and instant success was unlikely.  We had to maybe make sacrifices like trophies, CL qualification and that we may hit some bad patches along the way before we saw improvements.  This is exactly what you have to expect when you have an inexperienced manager, if we are not willing to ride out the bad times why on earth did we appoint an inexperienced manager to begin with?  If we don't see this through then it was a pointless experiment that we did even give a chance.  

Just look how many times Ole was going to be sacked with one more defeat, and they stuck with him and now look at them now.  People saying the only reason he's still in a job is because he's Frank Lampard well I say 'too right he's Frank f@ck1ng Lampard and he deserves more than 18 months'.  We're lucky to have a manager that loves the club and bleeds blue blood, the feeling of success with Frank in charge will be immense.  I'm willing to give him his 3 years rather than giving the job to the next manager looking for a big pay check.  

3 minutes ago, Munkworth said:

 Very credible source. 

Why would he do that and not take a payout? If he resigns or is sacked his own CV reads the same.

10 minutes ago, Munkworth said:

 Very credible source. 

Yeah exactly.

3 hours ago, coco said:

Imagine if a new manager came in, someone with vision and a plan, then he goes and puts Kepa and Rudiger back in the defence, you can see it happening 😅

A new manager would almost certainly have different favoured players. I saw an article in the Express today that suggested Pulisic could be one of several players under threat if we get a new manager.

There is no doubt we were abject last night. There is clearly a lot of work that needs to be done and Frank will hopefully get the time to show that he is the man to do it. I agree with Yorkley - let him see out his contract. If he fails, at least he was given the time. 

At the moment my overwhelming feeling is one of sadness. A successful Chelsea with Frank at the helm would be a dream. 

 

 

22 minutes ago, JM7 said:

Make of it what you will. 

Don’t know if this is true but I said before the board will not sack him they due to fan’s backlash they will let him continue until it’s untenable then it’s down to Lampard to leave if he seems he’s not progressing the club we are becoming a midtable team that way board keeps face and no fans can accuse them of sacking Lampard. They will not invest anymore money though so he will have to make due with what he has as they probably don’t trust him with anymore funds.

now that’s the board Roman may have a different view and he’s ruthless can’t visit here anymore so he probably doesn’t care about backlash so if he says get rid Lampard is gone.

2 hours ago, Slojo said:

To win it 3 times in a row takes "luck" out of the picture don't you think? That's never been done before by just one manager. 

Accomplishments wise absolutely, probably unrepeatable but whenever I watch that rm team they were not exactly great team. There is a reason why they won only one league title at that time. I can say that this pool team is harder to play against but that RM team has many what you called "clutch" player. Ramos, ronaldo, bale.

The problem with ucl luck play a very2 big factor, lucky decision can change everything. It is a knock out competition after all. One game, I remembered when Bayern absolutely destroyed them, it was one sided game but Ronaldo scored two clear offsides goal and Vidal got sent off for perfectly good tackle. 

2 hours ago, Sindre said:

Jan Aage Fjortoft who's well connected in German says Tuchel is the man the club will go for if we sack Lampard. Talks between his agents and the club have been held.

 

omfg please no

Tuchel will clash with the board in less than 3 months, his tactical ability is no match to a lot of manager, but Chelsea is too complicate for him to manage

2 minutes ago, cfcforeverfan said:

omfg please no

Tuchel will clash with the board in less than 3 months, his tactical ability is no match to a lot of manager, but Chelsea is too complicate for him to manage

Whoever comes in will likely not last more than 2 years. We've seen many different types of managers come and go during Roman's time in charge and turnover is the only consistency we can be sure of.

1 hour ago, axman2526 said:

Funny cause other articles came put saying we would never consider him as he clashed with the board too often.

The end of his 3 year contract. That is the line for me. That is the time I would like to see him given. If we have not got back to the level where we are close to the top then no new contract and we go our separate ways.

so no CL football for 2 years is completely fine? Including wasting 2 years of Chilwell, Kai Havertz and Werner career?