14 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

More than happy to let him go and bring Colwill back. Saves us 290k a week and we get an upgrade. Knowing Juventus they'll want a loan deal with no obligation to buy. 

Terry and Rudiger are benchmark defenders, this guy isn't good enough ... no passion just going through the motions ... 

Herein lies the problem with assessing quality across different leagues. Koulibaly was outstanding at Napoli for a long time. But Chris Smalling is currently ranked one of Serie A's best defenders at Roma. Ditto Tomori at Milan. But the fact is that Serie A, for the most part, doesn't play at anything like the tempo of the PL. The pressure is less intense. Koulibaly, at his age, had to be problematic, which made his purchase price, salary, and length of contract just bizarre. 

It was the previous admin's decision to sell the likes of Guéhi that contributed to the problem. The noises about keeping Colwill are at least promising.

I feel like KK is one of the only players fans have been a bit too critical off. He was terrible at the beginning of the season but has been decent in recent months, even good at times. Selling him makes a lot of sense but if we can`t find any suitable team to take him off our hands he will probably be a decent contributor next season.

Reports that he is out for the season....

...what are the chances that he has played his last game of us?

Edited May 2, 20233 yr by nonotnowjim

On 25/04/2023 at 19:07, dermott said:

Herein lies the problem with assessing quality across different leagues. Koulibaly was outstanding at Napoli for a long time. But Chris Smalling is currently ranked one of Serie A's best defenders at Roma. Ditto Tomori at Milan. But the fact is that Serie A, for the most part, doesn't play at anything like the tempo of the PL. The pressure is less intense. Koulibaly, at his age, had to be problematic, which made his purchase price, salary, and length of contract just bizarre. 

It was the previous admin's decision to sell the likes of Guéhi that contributed to the problem. The noises about keeping Colwill are at least promising.

Or Koulibaly was signed to play mostly as ccb where he has been very good

 

A loan may to buy may be our best way to move on Koulibaly, a popular method for Italian clubs.

Unless they sell a defender I don't think Napoli would look to take him back, however both Milans, Juve and Roma would likely be options.

Given he signed a 4 year deal, with an option of 1 more year, our FFP remaining value on him is 25.5mill, a cost of 8.5mill a season. His near 300k a week wages are a huge block no side will match.

Now it depends on how much he would like to return to Italy. If he does he might be willing to cut his wages and be sold for 18mill or so, and see us take a hit on FFP for 7.5mill or around that. 

If not a loan to buy could work. Loan club pays a 4mill loan fee, agrees to buy for 17mill, and we cover part of his wages for the next 3 years. Costing us 4mill in fees and the first year, nothing after.

So there are ways to get it done, see how good Winstanley and Stewart are.

We really f**ked ourselves here. 

4 minutes ago, Sconnie Blue said:

We really f**ked ourselves here. 

Yes but as I said above we can at least limit the damage. This is where Winstanley and Stewart earn their salaries.

Everyone thought Rudiger was sh*t when we signed him. Error prone ... unreliable ... turned out a new manager with better defensive organisation was all that was needed to turn him into an untouchable. There is surely a chance the same could apply to Koulibaly under Pochettino ? I don't even think he's been that bad,  bearing in mind the context of not one outfield player having played to potential this season. Having said that, I think KK misses Italy, so it would not surprise me if we have another "Werner" scenario whereby he is prepared to take a significant wage cut to facilitate a move to somewhere he prefers to be.

35 minutes ago, Sexyfootball said:

Everyone thought Rudiger was sh*t when we signed him. Error prone ... unreliable ... turned out a new manager with better defensive organisation was all that was needed to turn him into an untouchable. There is surely a chance the same could apply to Koulibaly under Pochettino ? I don't even think he's been that bad,  bearing in mind the context of not one outfield player having played to potential this season. Having said that, I think KK misses Italy, so it would not surprise me if we have another "Werner" scenario whereby he is prepared to take a significant wage cut to facilitate a move to somewhere he prefers to be.

No, because unlike Rudiger, Koulibaly doesn't have the athleticism. Put him against a single player with a bit of pace or dribbling ability and Koulibaly is in big trouble, we have seen it countless times this season. He can't turn and he can't run. Play a high line with Koulibaly and it's going to end in disaster. The only thing Koulibaly is useful for now is teams that like to sit back and hit on the counter. His positional play around the box is still good and tackling from a standing position and on the edge of the area, but push him up a few yards and he is a liability.

26 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

No, because unlike Rudiger, Koulibaly doesn't have the athleticism. Put him against a single player with a bit of pace or dribbling ability and Koulibaly is in big trouble, we have seen it countless times this season. He can't turn and he can't run. Play a high line with Koulibaly and it's going to end in disaster. The only thing Koulibaly is useful for now is teams that like to sit back and hit on the counter. His positional play around the box is still good and tackling from a standing position and on the edge of the area, but push him up a few yards and he is a liability.

JT was crap in a high line as well. If the manager is opting for that system and then selecting players whose attributes don't match, it just means the tactics are wrong for the personnel. 

In a bad year, he has still been better then most, albeit short of what we thought we were getting. Personally I'd have played Colwill at LCB this season, and I'd definitely do it next season. I still think KK would be better next season if he's still here. We always talk about players needing time to acclimatise to the PL.

I'm absolutely staggered he's on nearly £300,000 a week I only just saw it on Twitter I'm speechless goodnight.

Terry made up for his lack of pace with his positioning and awareness when stepping up for a challenge. Not to mention his ball playing ability. 

I struggle to think of one decent thing Koulibaly has. 

2 hours ago, Sexyfootball said:

JT was crap in a high line as well. If the manager is opting for that system and then selecting players whose attributes don't match, it just means the tactics are wrong for the personnel. 

In a bad year, he has still been better then most, albeit short of what we thought we were getting. Personally I'd have played Colwill at LCB this season, and I'd definitely do it next season. I still think KK would be better next season if he's still here. We always talk about players needing time to acclimatise to the PL.

We won't be changing that high line to accommodate one player though, and I don't think we should, not for somebody like Koulibaly who is clearly struggling at this level. Terry couldn't play in a high line because of his pace, but Koulibaly has a lot less going for him than Terry ever did. Terry was so good at everything else that it was worth building that defence around him.

I don't agree that Koulibaly has been better than most either. He's been one of the worst players this season.

Edited May 17, 20233 yr by Scott Harris

2 hours ago, Sconnie Blue said:

Terry made up for his lack of pace with his positioning and awareness when stepping up for a challenge. Not to mention his ball playing ability. 

I struggle to think of one decent thing Koulibaly has. 

For a big strong guy, he's surprisingly timid. I found in a lot defending corners situations, he just stood at the goal line instead of going for the challenge ( as he got paid to do), no wonder we conceded lots of goals and clear cut chances.

12 hours ago, Sexyfootball said:

JT was crap in a high line as well.

Was he, when was this? He wasnt crap in any season he had with Chelsea.

21 minutes ago, dkw said:

Was he, when was this? He wasnt crap in any season he had with Chelsea.

Not the full season but he wasn't good under AVB when we started to play a high line. I remember many people thought Terry was finished and hitting father time, but anyone with a brain could see it was AVB's suicidal high line that was killing the team. But then he gave us 4 excellent seasons after that, especially under Jose. 

13 hours ago, bluehaze said:

I'm absolutely staggered he's on nearly £300,000 a week I only just saw it on Twitter I'm speechless goodnight.

him and sterling both, in fact both are just over 300k a week as well.

This is what happens when its just boehly doing all the negotiating...

There is a stark contrast between our summer window (before the board came in) and our Jan window (winstantly, vivell were all there). The wages are the biggest difference and the sort of targets we went for

On 18/05/2023 at 02:56, Sexyfootball said:

Everyone thought Rudiger was sh*t when we signed him. Error prone ... unreliable ... turned out a new manager with better defensive organisation was all that was needed to turn him into an untouchable. There is surely a chance the same could apply to Koulibaly under Pochettino ? I don't even think he's been that bad,  bearing in mind the context of not one outfield player having played to potential this season. Having said that, I think KK misses Italy, so it would not surprise me if we have another "Werner" scenario whereby he is prepared to take a significant wage cut to facilitate a move to somewhere he prefers to be.

Yes but Rudiger had 5 years to sort his sh*t out and there were certainly periods where you could see his potential. Koulibaly is a year older with far less experience playing at this level.

Wonder if Real Madrid are interested in a swap deal....

Doubt KK misses Italy given how poorly black players are treated there, but Napoli may well be in the market for a defender because it looks like Kim Min-Jae will be hot property.

On 18/05/2023 at 08:20, icecoolguy22 said:

For a big strong guy, he's surprisingly timid. I found in a lot defending corners situations, he just stood at the goal line instead of going for the challenge ( as he got paid to do), no wonder we conceded lots of goals and clear cut chances.

Benitez had the same criticisms of him since his own Napoli days but Sarri and Spalletti's more dominant teams minimised this risk and made him into a quality defender. However, in a side that struggles to control or dominate games such as us this season, Koulibaly is a disaster waiting to happen.

4 hours ago, SydneyChelsea said:

Benitez had the same criticisms of him since his own Napoli days but Sarri and Spalletti's more dominant teams minimised this risk and made him into a quality defender. However, in a side that struggles to control or dominate games such as us this season, Koulibaly is a disaster waiting to happen.

I have never watched him play for Napoli but kouli biggest problem is his speed/agility. He is a much better passer than Rudi and he can read the game quite well (better as ccb) but as wide cb you need to go to the flank and defend large area. 

In europe he did it quite well but in PL the game is faster and he really struggle to keep up. 

Per multiple reports the club want to sell but Koulibaly reluctant to leave. 

I mean something needs to happen as we can't go into next season with 6 centre backs. 

 

Silva

Fofana

Chalobah

Badiashile

Colwill

Koulibaly 

 

 

1 hour ago, Sconnie Blue said:

Per multiple reports the club want to sell but Koulibaly reluctant to leave. 

I mean something needs to happen as we can't go into next season with 6 centre backs. 

 

Silva

Fofana

Chalobah

Badiashile

Colwill

Koulibaly 

 

 

Is simple really, if Pochettino does not want him then he tells him he is not part of his plans and won't play. 

Then is up to Koulibaly, train on his own at home and pick up his wages, but won't get game time so no international football most likely, or he moves so he can play. His call.

Wish he would step up and play the Silva role. He's the only experienced defender who can play regularly. He was the captain of Napoli so he has that in him.
 

His salary is crazy though.

8 hours ago, NestorGarde said:

Wish he would step up and play the Silva role. He's the only experienced defender who can play regularly. He was the captain of Napoli so he has that in him.
 

His salary is crazy though.

Experience counts for nothing if you're not good enough. Silva at 38 is in much better condition than Koulibaly. All you need to get passed Koulibaly is a bit of pace or trickery. I never rated this guy, he won nothing with Napoli and they look better without him. 

If we had to sell one defender, it should be Koulibaly. Even if we sell him for a loss.