On 17/04/2022 at 13:00, Ballack & Blu said:

I was reading an interview with TT and G Hoddle, and he likened Havz to the very players I see in him, Bergkamp, Van Persie and Berbatov, I really hope the kid kicks on every season, we have a fine cut diamond in our ranks…

Wow that is some praise, for me he reminds me of someone much less celebrated yet effective for a season or two at Swansea, Michu.

His game still needs a lot of polishing but I'm glad he's ours. 

Still lacks the ruthlessness of a top player. He literally just needs to slide the ball to the left or right of the keeper but he hits it straight at them all of the time. Is this a modern day German footballer thing? Michael Ballack must look at the modern German footballer and wince, they are so soft. 

He was dogsh*t tonight. Mount laid it on a plate for Havertz to feast on, for some reason he stopped running. Plus 2 chances he should have scored.

If only we had a competent striker on the bench that may have kept Havertz on his toes.

11 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

Still lacks the ruthlessness of a top player. He literally just needs to slide the ball to the left or right of the keeper but he hits it straight at them all of the time. Is this a modern day German footballer thing? Michael Ballack must look at the modern German footballer and wince, they are so soft. 

He's a clever player until the last touch is needed to score or assist, then looses his cool, he just needs to somehow convert his ability into goals, he's not a lost cause like most we have up front.

When he's not having a good day he'll miss clear cut chances. That's something he needs to work on, he probably spent too much time with Werner because he was more ruthless before.

He has his moments. Sometimes he finishes like a ruthless striker. Like his goal against Newcastle. Other times he is useless in front of goal.

Honestly he has not been the same since the international break. He got the header against Real be he has declined game by game.

He’s come to justify his place in the team over the past few months, but I just don’t know if his finishing is good enough to be our first choice 9/false 9. He should have got at least a brace tonight but he’s not a ruthless finisher.

5 minutes ago, timetowaste said:

He’s come to justify his place in the team over the past few months, but I just don’t know if his finishing is good enough to be our first choice 9/false 9. He should have got at least a brace tonight but he’s not a ruthless finisher.

Agreed. I don't think he is anywhere near clinical enough to be played as first choice striker. It begs the question just where would he be playing if Lukaku had worked out and scored 20+ goals this season? He hasn't really thrived when played in the wide roles, and I don't see him in central midfield. If we had a reliable goalscorer I suspect Kai would be warming the bench most games, and he is probably expecting regular starts at this stage of his career. Unless we change our style and play 2 strikers, but I don't see TT doing that.

Like many of our forwards, he has flashes but has not yet done it consistently.  Work rate, movement and overall play is excellent, but must add more goals. I tend to agree with comments he is Bergkamp like (just not as good yet).

Similar brand of player to Firmino for me. I have no issue with him being our focal point but we need a ruthless player next to him, sadly we have Werner there. I'm happy with him getting 15 goals a season all comps because his clever movement and link up play is a nightmare for defences. 

The 1v1 miss tonight was poor but for me he did the right thing with the header to direct it back across goal. Certainly 100x better than anything else we have available. 

5 hours ago, forbzy said:

Agreed. I don't think he is anywhere near clinical enough to be played as first choice striker. It begs the question just where would he be playing if Lukaku had worked out and scored 20+ goals this season? He hasn't really thrived when played in the wide roles, and I don't see him in central midfield. If we had a reliable goalscorer I suspect Kai would be warming the bench most games, and he is probably expecting regular starts at this stage of his career. Unless we change our style and play 2 strikers, but I don't see TT doing that.

I actually think Kai has the movement to play second striker yet at the moment we lack a clinical finisher in any position.

7 hours ago, timetowaste said:

He’s come to justify his place in the team over the past few months, but I just don’t know if his finishing is good enough to be our first choice 9/false 9. He should have got at least a brace tonight but he’s not a ruthless finisher.

If he isn't a striker though what is he? because his performances in the the two inside positions behind the CF he's ass.

14 minutes ago, jack_super_class said:

If he isn't a striker though what is he? because his performances in the the two inside positions behind the CF he's ass.

I actually don’t know, I haven’t known since he got here, I thought we’d figured it out during his purple patch but he missed far too many chances to be someone we can rely on in that position. He is a very talented player though

10 minutes ago, timetowaste said:

I actually don’t know, I haven’t known since he got here, I thought we’d figured it out during his purple patch but he missed far too many chances to be someone we can rely on in that position. He is a very talented player though

The trick is to scout a clinical wide forward to compliment him, it's easier said than done though ofcourse as on paper Werner was perfect for that role.

Him upfront facilitates some really good and fluid football and we've already seen what happened when we just looked at the top line for a 'solution' in that position.

1 hour ago, Argo said:

The trick is to scout a clinical wide forward to compliment him, it's easier said than done though ofcourse as on paper Werner was perfect for that role.

Him upfront facilitates some really good and fluid football and we've already seen what happened when we just looked at the top line for a 'solution' in that position.

Cough* Gnabry Cough

2 hours ago, Argo said:

The trick is to scout a clinical wide forward to compliment him, it's easier said than done though ofcourse as on paper Werner was perfect for that role.

Him upfront facilitates some really good and fluid football and we've already seen what happened when we just looked at the top line for a 'solution' in that position.

In theory that is a good approach, especially if we can find a wide player that chips in with a decent number of goals. However I'm still not convinced that Kai will be the long term option as the main striker unless he can be more clinical. If we have another striker who scores more regularly I think he may find his starting position challenged.

It's why I want us to go after Gabriel Jesus or Gnabry. 

Jesus is laughed at which I find astonishing considering the value he brings to City. Played 2nd fiddle to Aguero and still managed two 20+ goal a seasons whilst contributing in the build up and off the ball press. 

Only hope Kai has a good restful summer and kicks on again next season.

Getting tired of saying he has it ALL but doesn't produce it often enough. He can be brilliant one game and then invisible in the next. 

At least he has shown he is a big game player when je puts his mind to it. The winning goal in the FA Cup Final would be one to add to that list.

 

4 hours ago, Sconnie Blue said:

It's why I want us to go after Gabriel Jesus or Gnabry. 

Jesus is laughed at which I find astonishing considering the value he brings to City. Played 2nd fiddle to Aguero and still managed two 20+ goal a seasons whilst contributing in the build up and off the ball press. 

13 hours ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Similar brand of player to Firmino for me. I have no issue with him being our focal point but we need a ruthless player next to him, sadly we have Werner there. I'm happy with him getting 15 goals a season all comps because his clever movement and link up play is a nightmare for defences. 

The 1v1 miss tonight was poor but for me he did the right thing with the header to direct it back across goal. Certainly 100x better than anything else we have available. 

One is 22 years old and still adjusting to the league. The other is 30 and considered the best 'false 9' in the game. Havertz' development is going well and I hope he stays there long-term if for no other reason than - we suck at buying strikers. He still made some poor decisions yesterday including not playing Timo through on more than one occasion.

I pray hourly that we find some way to play him with Mbappe and Chiesa. I'm an atheist though so we'll see how it goes. 

8 hours ago, venom2011 said:

One is 22 years old and still adjusting to the league. The other is 30 and considered the best 'false 9' in the game. Havertz' development is going well and I hope he stays there long-term if for no other reason than - we suck at buying strikers. He still made some poor decisions yesterday including not playing Timo through on more than one occasion.

I pray hourly that we find some way to play him with Mbappe and Chiesa. I'm an atheist though so we'll see how it goes. 

You've got a different season (last year) for Firmino ... plus he's bound to be more green in absolute numbers when his pitch time is 2852 minutes vs 1623. These comparisons are better on a "per 90" basis.

Kai wasn't a striker in Leverkusen, he was mostly the AM behind the striker. Which is why Lampard wanted to play two 8's in Mount and Havertz and wanted Rice to be the anchor for them. So this false 9 that he has been playing is mainly due to him being so much talented that he could play there but clearly he still lacks some level of consistency. 

I think to unleash the potential of Havertz, we want a midfielder like Fabregas.

Kai is probably the most intelligent player I’ve ever watched in terms of movement, he always see the opportunity to attack space and often he doesn’t get the pass. With a player like Fabregas, Kai can be devastating.

22 hours ago, forbzy said:

In theory that is a good approach, especially if we can find a wide player that chips in with a decent number of goals. However I'm still not convinced that Kai will be the long term option as the main striker unless he can be more clinical. If we have another striker who scores more regularly I think he may find his starting position challenged.

The problem is goals don't exist in a vacuum. I mean if we can get a forward who offers what Kai does in general play and the goal rate fine but if it's a player who's good at stat padding but poor in the build up we will actually regress as was shown this season when you know who was up top (thankgod Tuchel saw the light reasonably quickly).

What's gone under the radar a bit is despite our problems infront of goal we're actually on course to beat 3 of our 5 title scoring tally's (Jose's three, there's a small chance we may even beat Conte's if we have another stat padding session like vs Saints/Norwich) and those teams had reliable scorers so while we don't have a player hitting 20 by themselves we have a lot spread out around the team.