He plays like a school boy playing grown men. 

On 30/03/2022 at 20:14, nonotnowjim said:

Werner said stuff that was factually accurate. He does get more chances in the Germany team, and the style played with the national team does suit him more than us.

We have had the same issue for years - buy strikers that simply don't suit the system we play/played at the time.

Werner, Lukaku, Torres, Batsman, Falcao, Higuain, Sheva. Perhaps Morata.

With Werner, you simply have to play forward quickly, for him to run on to. It is pointless trying to get him to be the all singing/dancing battler like Costa, the powerhouse like drogs, the explosive finisher like Jimmy or the silky finisher like Anelka. He doesnt have it in him....

But closing, chasing and running in behind, he is great at. Lukaku similar.

Closing, chasing and running? None of which involve having a football at his feet.

You need to let it go Jim. All that hope. It must feel like an almighty kick in the gonads at the end of every game Werner plays.

 

 

11 hours ago, just said:

Closing, chasing and running? None of which involve having a football at his feet.

You need to let it go Jim. All that hope. It must feel like an almighty kick in the gonads at the end of every game Werner plays.

 

 

Let it go???....

....Have a read of most of my recent posts on Timo, I fully agree that he has been appalling. In fact, I think I even called him broken? So not sure what you are encouraging me to "let go" of.

My thoughts on Timo being rubbish for us recently does not take away from the fact that he has a number of traits that fit in much better with other styles of play.

Clearly he is awful in the slow, insipid, sideways, technical manner in which we play. He has however proven to be much more effective when playing in a fast, direct manner and has been very successful doing to. Or do you not agree with that? 

I don't believe that Timo has forgotten how to score, how to shoot, how to get into positions etc. Players don't just forget that. And let's not forget that he has never been the best finisher anyway, and has always missed a lot, even in the German league. The difference is that 1) the team he played for in Germany played to his strengths, 2) at chelsea, the number of chances he gets are so low  3) we do  not play to his strengths. When is the last time he was put through on goal? 

It can be debated on whether or not we should try to change the system to play to his (or Lukakus) strengths. But that doesn't change the statement of fact he made about the current situation.

1 hour ago, nonotnowjim said:

Let it go???....

....Have a read of most of my recent posts on Timo, I fully agree that he has been appalling. In fact, I think I even called him broken? So not sure what you are encouraging me to "let go" of.

My thoughts on Timo being rubbish for us recently does not take away from the fact that he has a number of traits that fit in much better with other styles of play.

Clearly he is awful in the slow, insipid, sideways, technical manner in which we play. He has however proven to be much more effective when playing in a fast, direct manner and has been very successful doing to. Or do you not agree with that? 

I don't believe that Timo has forgotten how to score, how to shoot, how to get into positions etc. Players don't just forget that. And let's not forget that he has never been the best finisher anyway, and has always missed a lot, even in the German league. The difference is that 1) the team he played for in Germany played to his strengths, 2) at chelsea, the number of chances he gets are so low  3) we do  not play to his strengths. When is the last time he was put through on goal? 

It can be debated on whether or not we should try to change the system to play to his (or Lukakus) strengths. But that doesn't change the statement of fact he made about the current situation.

Jim, the part I have bolded above. If you read your own post from page 89 of this thread, on 13th March following our last EPL game, you have already answered your own question.

I dunno maybe it's me. I have this completely misguided belief that a professional footballer should be able to control a football more often than not.

In terms of changing our style of play to a system that supposedly "suits" Werner better, that would be a massive risk. Changing the system would not mean he suddenly has a better first touch, or learns how to time a run better, or becomes a better finisher. Apart from some pace I haven't seen anything else in him that marks him out as a potentially top class talent. We all know you didn't rate Tammy Abraham at all and for sure, he had areas of his game that needed to improve hugely, particularly IMO his hold-up play. But in terms of his actual technical ability and natural finishing instincts he was and is light years ahead of Werner. 

2 hours ago, just said:

Jim, the part I have bolded above. If you read your own post from page 89 of this thread, on 13th March following our last EPL game, you have already answered your own question.

I dunno maybe it's me. I have this completely misguided belief that a professional footballer should be able to control a football more often than not.

In terms of changing our style of play to a system that supposedly "suits" Werner better, that would be a massive risk. Changing the system would not mean he suddenly has a better first touch, or learns how to time a run better, or becomes a better finisher. Apart from some pace I haven't seen anything else in him that marks him out as a potentially top class talent. We all know you didn't rate Tammy Abraham at all and for sure, he had areas of his game that needed to improve hugely, particularly IMO his hold-up play. But in terms of his actual technical ability and natural finishing instincts he was and is light years ahead of Werner. 

For what it is worth, I also don't think that changing the team style is appropriate at this time. I think we have missed that opportunity. Werner has clearly regressed this season, and the positive points he offered regularly last season have now reduced....As i said before, he looks broken. 

...But that isn't really the point. We continue to purchase strikers and then refuse to play to their strengths. We have done that with all those I listed. We have certainly done that with Werner, hence I posted (the initial one you quoted) that his comments were factually accurate.

For what it's worth, I also continue to believe that Tammy wasn't/isn't the answer. I also don't think someone like Haaland is the answer. 

Strikers who can operate in tight spaces, hold up, create, have pace, have strength, scare defenders and score regular goals are few and far between. Timo has proven that he can do a number of those things (create, have speed, scare defenders, score regular goals, assist)....He has not done that (and will not regularly) in this system at Chelsea. So if we are not going to play to his strengths then we should sell and get his wages off the books. 

But the same will happen again as/when we roll the dice to buy a new striker (any striker), who we then inevitably fail to set up in a system which optimises their skill set. 
 

The striker who suits how we play is Giroud, now we are trying to get Havertz to be like him. Hopefully Broja will repay my faith in him and be an answer for us.

Would he fit in better at Liverpool who do play a more dynamic style, no one saw how well Jota took his game on when they signed him…

I had enough of this guy. Clearly doesn't want to be here anymore either. 

Broja should take his place. 

5 hours ago, axman2526 said:

The striker who suits how we play is Giroud, now we are trying to get Havertz to be like him. Hopefully Broja will repay my faith in him and be an answer for us.

True. The issue with Giroud was lack of pace/pressing. Our perfect striker is a hybrid of Girouds target man abilities, Werners Pressing and energy, Kai's touch and Lukakus finishing..... Perhaps we should re signs Drogba!

4 hours ago, Ballack & Blu said:

Would he fit in better at Liverpool who do play a more dynamic style, no one saw how well Jota took his game on when they signed him…

Who knows, but if I had to guess, then yes. I think he would also be better at a counter attacking team like spurs.

13 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

True. The issue with Giroud was lack of pace/pressing. Our perfect striker is a hybrid of Girouds target man abilities, Werners Pressing and energy, Kai's touch and Lukakus finishing..... Perhaps we should re signs Drogba!

Giroud has an amazing touch and technique, and a tremendous work ethic. Finishing sure not as great as Ronaldo or Messi and no real pace. Otherwise flawless.

21 hours ago, Gentian said:

I had enough of this guy. Clearly doesn't want to be here anymore either. 

Broja should take his place. 

Broja looked more dangerous in a lesser team on paper, Tuchel should give him the chance next season. At the worst outcome we would have a young striker ready to grow, nothing to lose there!

On 03/04/2022 at 15:44, Ballack & Blu said:

Would he fit in better at Liverpool who do play a more dynamic style, no one saw how well Jota took his game on when they signed him…

Disagree. I think alot of people knew how good Jota had looked at Wolves before his move to Liverpool. His strike rate averaged out at a goal every three games. And again, technically, a much, much better footballer than Werner.

On 03/04/2022 at 22:44, Ballack & Blu said:

Would he fit in better at Liverpool who do play a more dynamic style, no one saw how well Jota took his game on when they signed him…

Yes he will be better. 

On 03/04/2022 at 20:37, nonotnowjim said:

Who knows, but if I had to guess, then yes. I think he would also be better at a counter attacking team like spurs.

Jim, if Spurs were to buy him you are invited to a party round my place that will last a week!

On 03/04/2022 at 22:44, Ballack & Blu said:

Would he fit in better at Liverpool who do play a more dynamic style, no one saw how well Jota took his game on when they signed him…

He would fit better in Pep's City. He is the perfect Sterling replacement

For those old enough to remember Werner is a carbon copy of Robert Fleck in style, structure and inability to stay onside and put the ball in the net.

44 minutes ago, bluehaze said:

For those old enough to remember Werner is a carbon copy of Robert Fleck in style, structure and inability to stay onside and put the ball in the net.

Looks are similar, different strengths yet agree both dismal in front of goal.

3 hours ago, strider6004 said:

Looks are similar, different strengths yet agree both dismal in front of goal.

Different strengths !! Fleck had none and Werner's strength would appear to be scoring when offside I believe it's around the 20 mark.

3 hours ago, bluehaze said:

For those old enough to remember Werner is a carbon copy of Robert Fleck in style, structure and inability to stay onside and put the ball in the net.

😀 He is a bit Fleck like, in all honesty he is better than Fleck but it is all relative. 

28 minutes ago, andy said:

😀 He is a bit Fleck like, in all honesty he is better than Fleck but it is all relative. 

I'm better than Fleck 😁

Werner's best game for a while last night. No mis-controlling the ball and wasn't off-side once.

Playing well against Soho today too

Edited April 9, 20224 yr by BluesPower
typo

Nice confidence booster for Timo.

Amazing what happens when we play to the strengths of our players.....