The sackings that have to take place has to be Winstanley and Stewart. Abject failures and continue to undermine every aspect of the club both on the pitch and financially. If Clearlake need a scapegoat then these are definitely it.

• Hire a proper Sporting Director. Maybe keep Shields on for player recruitment.
• Get the Sporting Director to identify and target the correct manager to meet all objectives with the tools available.
• No more buying players. Try our best to sail through FFP selling off whatever pure profit silverware that we can
• Ensure/hope/pray that our player fitness issues are as a consequence of Poch's and his teams regime.
• Bomb Poch when the new guy is ready to come in. (Isthsi Flick? Maybe)
• SD, Chief Scout (Shields?) and new Manager run all football affairs.
• Manager's responsibility to ensure player are at, and can maintain, required fitness levels. Work with what we have and develop an identity. If we can get into Europe next season, and if we are able to avoid FFP sanctions, then start to brign players in taht meet the manager's formation and tactical set up.

22 minutes ago, IliyaKrostin said:

We became a comfort opponent for teams to play against, we lost our winning mentality and players f**king around on the pitch. 

That's the most depressing thing of all. Stamford bridge was once feared even by the top teams as they knew they weren't getting nothing.

Now any team in a bad run of form just needs to see Chelsea among upcoming fixture list and cheer up as they know there are some points for the board a few game(s) away. Not to even talk of teams that are doing well.

9 hours ago, Argo said:

This is what we're suppose to pay scouts for though.

Even if it's not a top class option I refuse to believe there's not a manager lurking somewhere who's philosophy suits these players.

Even if it's someone relatively unknown like Iraola or ironically Poch himself when he arrived at Southampton, we need to get this bunch adequately coached and have us enjoying what we're seeing again. Then once we're settled and producing respectable performances and results we can worry about whether said manager can take the next leap with us.

Yes, that would be ideal, but without a priori knowledge of the names they're assessing, I'm sitting on the fence because I don't trust who they'll bring.

9 hours ago, Argo said:

This is what we're suppose to pay scouts for though.

Even if it's not a top class option I refuse to believe there's not a manager lurking somewhere who's philosophy suits these players.

Even if it's someone relatively unknown like Iraola or ironically Poch himself when he arrived at Southampton, we need to get this bunch adequately coached and have us enjoying what we're seeing again. Then once we're settled and producing respectable performances and results we can worry about whether said manager can take the next leap with us.

Arne Slot at feyernood is tailor made for this group.

And he turned down Tottenham last summer. 

Edited February 5, 20242 yr by bisright1

6 hours ago, Argo said:

Well i was mocked for somewhat defending Potter at the very end and this is why.

As with my response to @RMH there's nothing that can convince me there's not a manager out there who's philosophy suits the players we have. If it's a top one or not is by the by at this point (cross that Bridge when we need to) but if we look hard enough they'll be an Iraola type out there somewhere.

I wouldn't mind to see Valverde here, the current coach at Athletic Club Bilbao. He's got a few managerial titles with Athletic, Barca and Olympiacos. Unknown type like Iraola, so it might not work here. But I think that the type of coach that this lot require at the moment is a Dyche-like bloke who'll rip their balls off for performances like yesterday's. Tactically Dyche might not be top notch, but his teams have fight and spirit and that is what we are sorely missing.

Expecting Poch to get the tin tack today. If the new manager fails as well then the next bullets will be squarely aimed at Stewart and Winstanley. Those two can hide behind Mauricio at the moment ... they deserve a P45 more than he does, but sh*t always flows downhill ... and especially when the new ownership have made the club more "corporate" in how it is structured ... 

Interesting, to me, article on Flick's coaching style. Not sure it would translate to us just now.

https://www.coachesvoice.com/bayern-munich-hansi-flick-bundesliga-coach-watch/#:~:text=Flick inherited a squad that,front of ball-playing defenders.

If he were to be sacked we'd then be in a situation where the new ownership have missed the mark on two managerial appointments (not including Tuchel's dismissal, and ignoring Lampards stint as that was purely as a caretaker).

People point to the hiring and firing of the Roman era and use that as an example of it just being business as usual at Chelsea, but very rarely were the firings not punctuated by periods of success. Now even if you downgrade "success" to mean something other than trophies considering our current circumstances, I don't think we can by even the most generous of definitions call anything that's happened over the last 18 or so months a success. All of which is a roundabout way of saying, should the managers neck be on the line or should the directors?

Personally I'd like at least one appointment at board level of someone already connected to the club. Lampard DoF / involved in recruitment for example would (in my opinion) restore some "Chelsea" feeling to the top end of the club and (admittedly I may be way off here) would work to what seems to be one of Franks strengths which is identifying talent and recruiting.

 

An interesting article probably behind a paywall about Arne Slot's coaching style. As Bisright1 says he does look like exactly the sort of coach that would get the best out of the players. And Feyenoord is a club we probably could get a coach from if we wanted.

https://marclamberts.medium.com/coach-principles-arne-slot-feyenoord-2f1ea00379f4#:~:text=Slot's philosophy is based on,and central through his ideas.&text=There are a few key,seasons in terms of attack.

Have to admit I was moved to check whether he ever played the game himself just now...

seems he did 😁

I think they need to stick with him till the end of the season and I think some of the players need to be dropped: Sterling Silva and Enzo or Caicedo for me.. there is something wrong somewhere.

 

Edited February 5, 20242 yr by Bebe1980

1 hour ago, dansubrosa said:

If it’s a 6 month contract I’m all for it. I’m definitely against hiring him as our long term manager as it won’t work out but to come in and steady the ship, set us up for the next manager, yeah.

The world isn't full of infinite possibilities, though that would be nice.  Jose is available, he knows Chelsea and the Premier League, and from the bio that I just read he's won a fair few trophies.  Jose is a great manger, and I'd like those players to at least have the opportunity to play for a manager who knows what he is doing.

Will leave this here:

YOU CANT DO A LONG TERM BUILD AND HAVE SHORT TERM EXPECTATIONS

 

You should have a listen of Obi One Podcast:

Good guests JOM has and he seems to be a very lovely bloke. 

Anyway if you appreciate Joey Cole this is a good listen. He says the manager needs to have charisma. You can't make anyone do anything if there is no respect towards the person. Tactics are easy and different training methods you can do as much as you want..this is according to Cole. Anyway interesting stuff from him. 

I think Pochettino has charisma and he can turn this 2 game dogsh*te to good. Even against Villa. Win that game and we can forget letting in 8 goals in two outings.

I know pundits and ex-players say what they feel. No problem. I would love the owners to confirm we are in for the long haul with Pochettino and we are willing to let the players grow into these roles. Would love that. Now we are basically hanging on to Roman's empire. We changed every person but the old "we cannot lose" mantra is still in if we go on and change a top manager to another because fans were humiliated in 2 games. 

Edited February 5, 20242 yr by evissy

11 minutes ago, evissy said:

You should have a listen of Obi One Podcast:

Good guests JOM has and he seems to be a very lovely bloke. 

Anyway if you appreciate Joey Cole this is a good listen. He says the manager needs to have charisma. You can't make anyone do anything if there is no respect towards the person. Tactics are easy and different training methods you can do as much as you want..this is according to Cole. Anyway interesting stuff from him. 

I think Pochettino has charisma and he can turn this 2 game dogsh*te to good. Even against Villa. Win that game and we can forget letting in 8 goals in two outings.

I know pundits and ex-players say what they feel. No problem. I would love the owners to confirm we are in for the long haul with Pochettino and we are willing to let the players grow into these roles. Would love that. Now we are basically hanging on to Roman's empire. We changed every person but the old "we cannot lose" mantra is still in if we go on and change a top manager to another because fans were humiliated in 2 games. 

 

The bold part is where I think you're going wrong. I don't think that Pochettino has any charisma at all. You don't see players looking at him for answers or approaching him during the game for tactical advice. He just stands there like a statue and players don't even look at him throughout the game.

3 minutes ago, RMH said:

The bold part is where I think you're going wrong. I don't think that Pochettino has any charisma at all. You don't see players looking at him for answers or approaching him during the game for tactical advice. He just stands there like a statue and players don't even look at him throughout the game.

This is a bit subjective. Overall he has shown to me anyway he is charismatic person. Not Jose or Carlo or even Tuchel but nowhere near Potter or sadly Frankie. 

But he has looked and sounded very uncomfortable after these heavy losses.

Part of me expected him to be sacked this morning.

It's not a position I endorse, but it's surprised me nothing has happened.

6 minutes ago, evissy said:

This is a bit subjective. Overall he has shown to me anyway he is charismatic person. Not Jose or Carlo or even Tuchel but nowhere near Potter or sadly Frankie. 

But he has looked and sounded very uncomfortable after these heavy losses.

It is subjective, I agree, but players do not look up to him for in game management and directions, while you can see players looking and talking continuously with Silva. If he had any charisma, he'd be looked up by players. But we can discuss about this forever and we'd probably never get to agree, as you say, it is a subjective observation.

1 minute ago, Jezz said:

Part of me expected him to be sacked this morning.

It's not a position I endorse, but it's surprised me nothing has happened.

I am hoping Poch has not signed into something like: let's fire everyone and replace them with partly inexperienced players and untested staff and right away win trophies and make Europe. If he said yes to that I hope he looks for the door right away and travels back to Argentina first flight out. 

If the club promised a project that only starts to grow crops somewhere down the line with exciting new surroundings and people he made a good choice and that would mean we continue with him.

I don’t think he’ll be sacked today - Clearlake are on pacific time so by the time they get to a decision business will have closed in UK. Plus, if history is anything to go by they only sack when a successor is already lined up. 

As I said back in December...

And now I read he's got his wife asking for Chelsea to sack Pooch on Twitter ffs!

Since Pooch arrived I've felt that Thiago Silva didn't think it was right.

And with a guy like that in the dressing room what chance does any manager stand ?

How many other's hasn't Thiago Silva approved of ?

 

Edited February 5, 20242 yr by Bebe1980

Feels like an increasingly complex situation. 

I've gone on the fence, for many of the reasons stated above. The eye test isn't great at the moment, stats arent either. We are just treading water and I can't see how much longer it carries on. But the reverse is who realistically improves us? There isnt a slam dunk option, most replacements would be a risk of sorts. Its not like the Hiddink years where we could just look to him to tide us over competantly until the end of the year. 

For me, it becomes complex when looking at what the owners can get out of making/not making a decision. Sticking with him suggests the stability they have been preaching whilst sacking managers left right and centre. They gave excuses for the potter appointment (and booting) and the Tuchel sacking but Poch was meant to be the one where they held their ground after establishing and implementing a sporting structure that had appointed him. Sticking with him implies they have confidence in sticking to the 'project' but more importantly getting rid of him would be an achnowledgement of yet another failure.

But the fan base is going to get toxic real fast if the current trend continues. Cup final loss and top 8 (sigh) rivals pulling away will turn things nasty, they may see it as an easy win to make him the fall guy.

 

15 minutes ago, Bebe1980 said:

As I said back in December...

And now I read he's got his wife asking for Chelsea to sack Pooch on Twitter ffs!

Since Pooch arrived I've felt that Thiago Silva didn't think it was right.

And with a guy like that in the dressing room what chance does any manager stand ?

How many other's hasn't Thiago Silva approved of ?

 

Yeah, no manager has a chance with a natural leader in the dressing room. It really is a wonder that we won anything with that pesky John Terry sticking his nose into peoples business for all those years, upsetting the dressing room by setting standards and being a model professional. 

Maybe Clearlake are right, lets fill the dressing room with unopinionated 15 year olds that dont care for success as long as they can go and griddy on fortnite at the end of the working day.

Theres no evidence at all of Silva doing anything to undermine any manager since he has been here. Granted, Belle shouldn't be as opinionated in a public forum as she is, but there is nothing to suggest he has encouraged this or is in anyway accepting of it. 

Edited February 5, 20242 yr by Niall1905

Out but I think he will survive until the summer, because I don't think the club wants to deal with another interim situation for a second season in a row.

And at the moment no one is available, except Jose, but him, you offer him a long-term deal which I don't think is the brighest idea.

Edited February 5, 20242 yr by Ledgerson

There are not many available managers at this moment.  A Conte return?  Return of the Jose?

It has been suggested that we bring in Mourinho and we 'thug things out until the end of the season'.  Problem is WE DON'T HAVE MEN - let alone thugs.

You cannot thug it out with the children we currently have in the squad.

We have to look at formations - we have to play not to lose. We have to look at playing with 3 CBs and and 5 at the back. We have to look at playing 4 or 5 in the midfield in a 4-1-4-1.

Catenaccio and a rigid tactical system and just trying to win games 1-0 – we have ZERO creativity in midfield. Our players are not creative enough to make a 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1 work.  Caicedo and Gallagher have no goals all season. Enzo has 2.  --- so as a 3-man midfield like that aint working.  The end product is not there.

Then in the summer we need a manager who has a plan and the ability to be more creative
or Poch can stay but only if he convince Harry Kane to join Chelsea.