8 hours ago, just said:

Apparently it was going really well until a week or two ago. Deluded. 

Speaking after the match, Maresca told BBC Sport: "It is difficult when you don't have a proper number nine. In the last third we struggled doing things that until a week or two ago we were doing well.

 

 

On 13/02/2025 at 01:35, Scott Harris said:

Looking forward to Maresca's excuse for the next two months of bad form and him putting it down to Jackson being out......like December and January didn't happen when Jackson was fit.

I knew this excuse was coming, but for him to use it just 1 day after I wrote this post is incredible.

5 hours ago, Scott Harris said:

 

I knew this excuse was coming, but for him to use it just 1 day after I wrote this post is incredible.

He is nothing if not predictable -

Unfortunately that also goes for style, team sheets and tactics….

Can read him like a book - and not a very good one. Certainly not Bravo Two Zero by Andy Mcnab

Maresca is Oasis to Pep's Beatles.

2 hours ago, dermott said:

Maresca is Oasis to Pep's Beatles.

Arteta is Oasis to Pep's Beatles and Enzo Maresca is more like an Oasis cover band Foasis to Arteta's Oasis.

On 15/02/2025 at 07:09, dermott said:

Their philosophy is, to say the least, illogical. The focus is on player trading. Buy young and cheap, sell for a profit. A long-term strategy that doesn't guarantee anything at all. CL is the key. Profile, buckets of money, et al. Get their money back at the very least. The mismanagement of the playing squad - GK, CBs, striker, etc - involving failing SDs on top of a suspect coach will be their undoing.

Aha, but this was not their original philosophy when they took over the club - they bought really sh1t older players at that time. My point being I think the idea that they have any kind of philosophy or player trading strategy is a bit misleading. They are a lot more incompetent than that. They do not know what they are doing. They have 'tacked on' a player trading strategy but they have also paid over inflated prices for mediocre players that they are unable to sell on and can barely loan out. This idea they they are in it for the 'buckets of money' is a bit much.  They are not that smart.  They had the clever financial idea of the long contract and that was about it really.

There is also this popular idea - a misconception imho - that they do not care about success on the pitch and winning trophies, etc. They do care. They would love to win. All the ego and arrogance points that way. They are just so fcucking clueless and incompetent. Again, there is no coherent strategy for the future. . .oh, the Vision 2030* plan?   In all honesty I am not seeing a long-term plan with our current owners and sporting directors.  I wish there was one.

 

*Conceptualised in 2019 and publicly unveiled in 2021, Vision 2030 is the title Chelsea have given to their plan for the academy.

17 hours ago, loz said:

Someone like Allegri if he was interested might be a shout 

Zidane?

There really isn't anyone available right now.   I guess we have Enzo until the summer.

 

I expect when Maresca loses his job it will be because of his part in devaluing the squad players, rather than what is seen as team performance.

2 hours ago, TheCeleryKing said:

*Conceptualised in 2019 and publicly unveiled in 2021, Vision 2030 is the title Chelsea have given to their plan for the academy.

I'm sure you're misremembering, I definitely heard glowing talk of Project 2025 at the last Clearlake AGM.

Well I’ve kept away for a good while, just wtf has happened since being just a measly 2 points behind the Scousers, scoring for fun, and looking quite decent…..

A precursor to this should have been its coming, I work close to Leicester, with plenty of Foxes fans, and they warned me about the ‘No trick Pony’,  Maresca!!.

Clueless doesn’t scratch at the surface….!!

Edited February 16, 20251 yr by Ballack & Blu

3 hours ago, TheCeleryKing said:

There is also this popular idea - a misconception imho - that they do not care about success on the pitch and winning trophies, etc. They do care. They would love to win. All the ego and arrogance points that way. They are just so fcucking clueless and incompetent.

I think that you’re giving them too much credit regarding their footballing aspirations while disregarding their business shrewdness. They don’t care about winning games and titles, they care about making money. And they are not stupid, they haven’t become millionaires by not knowing their business. Trading young players is their business with Chelsea, not making us compete for titles. If they wanted the latter, they would be building an experienced spine filling gaps with youngsters. Everyone knows what our requirements to compete are, but this window they decided to buy a 19yo midfielder that’s not going to play for us in 3-4 years, with any luck. That basically shows us what their business with Chelsea is. They are buying young potential that they think they can make a profit on, while disregarding the footballing side of things. And they exactly know what and why they are doing it.

16 minutes ago, RMH said:

I think that you’re giving them too much credit regarding their footballing aspirations while disregarding their business shrewdness. They don’t care about winning games and titles, they care about making money. And they are not stupid, they haven’t become millionaires by not knowing their business. Trading young players is their business with Chelsea, not making us compete for titles. If they wanted the latter, they would be building an experienced spine filling gaps with youngsters. Everyone knows what our requirements to compete are, but this window they decided to buy a 19yo midfielder that’s not going to play for us in 3-4 years, with any luck. That basically shows us what their business with Chelsea is. They are buying young potential that they think they can make a profit on, while disregarding the footballing side of things. And they exactly know what and why they are doing it.

I agree but ultimately we can only go off what they have said which is to compete while developing young players. 

3 hours ago, TheCeleryKing said:

Aha, but this was not their original philosophy when they took over the club - they bought really sh1t older players at that time. My point being I think the idea that they have any kind of philosophy or player trading strategy is a bit misleading. They are a lot more incompetent than that. They do not know what they are doing. They have 'tacked on' a player trading strategy but they have also paid over inflated prices for mediocre players that they are unable to sell on and can barely loan out. This idea they they are in it for the 'buckets of money' is a bit much.  They are not that smart.  They had the clever financial idea of the long contract and that was about it really.

There is also this popular idea - a misconception imho - that they do not care about success on the pitch and winning trophies, etc. They do care. They would love to win. All the ego and arrogance points that way. They are just so fcucking clueless and incompetent. Again, there is no coherent strategy for the future. . .oh, the Vision 2030* plan?   In all honesty I am not seeing a long-term plan with our current owners and sporting directors.  I wish there was one.

 

*Conceptualised in 2019 and publicly unveiled in 2021, Vision 2030 is the title Chelsea have given to their plan for the academy.

I'm afraid I can't agree that the owners ' care about winning ' . If they really did, they wouldn't have made decisions they are guaranteed to result in the complete opposite outcome.

I reckon that their idea of "winning" is to simply make money for themselve from their investment.  They actually bought a regular top 4, Champions League  team.with no debt.

They came in, and  instead of standing back, taking stock, getting advice, and trying to actually understand the football business, they blundered in with a wrecking ball and destroyed everything . 

2 minutes ago, Remodez said:

I agree but ultimately we can only go off what they have said which is to compete while developing young players. 

I only trust what people say if it’s backed with actions. And they’re not doing it no matter what they say.

What has happened to the fast flowing counter attacks we had going earlier in the season

24 minutes ago, RMH said:

I only trust what people say if it’s backed with actions. And they’re not doing it no matter what they say.

I think this is where we differ.

The players we have are good enough to compete for top 4 which should be the goal of this season so in that regard they are doing okay even though I disagree with many of the incomings.

In regards to competing for titles well we will have to wait and see who they bring in when that time comes. I don’t believe it’s something that would be achieved in a year or two regardless of our window.

Edited February 16, 20251 yr by Remodez

13 minutes ago, Remodez said:

I think this is where we differ.

The players we have are good enough to compete for top 4 which should be the goal of this season so in that regard they are doing okay even though I disagree with many of the incomings.

In regards to competing for titles well we will have to wait and see who they bring in when that time comes. I don’t believe it’s something that would be achieved in a year or two regardless of our window.

The only players in our squad who i would say are genuinely top four ability (and i mean consistently, not as a one off or as being a weaker player in a stronger squad) are James, Caciedo, and Palmer (possibly Lavia if he can stay fit and develop)

I don't see the rest of them as being players I'd rely on to play regularly in a consistently top four team.

18 minutes ago, Remodez said:

I think this is where we differ.

The players we have are good enough to compete for top 4 which should be the goal of this season so in that regard they are doing okay even though I disagree with many of the incomings.

In regards to competing for titles well we will have to wait and see who they bring in when that time comes. I don’t believe it’s something that would be achieved in a year or two regardless of our window.

As @loz has said, I think that we’ve got just 3-4 players capable of challenging for top four. We can differ on this, but I think that only James, Caicedo and Palmer are of good quality, the rest could be good squad players but that’s all.

3 minutes ago, loz said:

The only players in our squad who i would say are genuinely top four ability (and i mean consistently, not as a one off or as being a weaker player in a stronger squad) are James, Caciedo, and Palmer (possibly Lavia if he can stay fit and develop)

I don't see the rest of them as being players I'd rely on to play regularly in a consistently top four team.

 

8 minutes ago, RMH said:

As @loz has said, I think that we’ve got just 3-4 players capable of challenging for top four. We can differ on this, but I think that only James, Caicedo and Palmer are of good quality, the rest could be good squad players but that’s all.

 

Calendar year of 2024, we were the 4th best side, and by quite some distance from 5th.

 

Surely we wouldn't have been able to deliver this if we only had three players at Top 4 level ?

Whether that Top 4 level is the same "heights" as Top 4 levels in previous seasons is a different matter, but you can only compete against what is in front of you !

 

3 minutes ago, Sexyfootball said:

 

 

Calendar year of 2024, we were the 4th best side, and by quite some distance from 5th.

 

Surely we wouldn't have been able to deliver this if we only had three players at Top 4 level ?

Whether that Top 4 level is the same "heights" as Top 4 levels in previous seasons is a different matter, but you can only compete against what is in front of you !

 

Yet in those two seasons they finished 6th and this season will be lucky to finish top 8.  Getting worse rather than better.  Sign of weak mentalities which has mid table obscurity written all over it

7 minutes ago, loz said:

The only players in our squad who i would say are genuinely top four ability (and i mean consistently, not as a one off or as being a weaker player in a stronger squad) are James, Caciedo, and Palmer (possibly Lavia if he can stay fit and develop)

I don't see the rest of them as being players I'd rely on to play regularly in a consistently top four team.

 

1 minute ago, RMH said:

As @loz has said, I think that we’ve got just 3-4 players capable of challenging for top four. We can differ on this, but I think that only James, Caicedo and Palmer are of good quality, the rest could be good squad players but that’s all.

The only teams in the league that are vastly superior to us players wise are Pool, City and Arsenal. 

The main difference in my opinion between the likes of us and other contenders such as Villa, Spurs, Forrest, Newcastle, etc is the managers. Their players, individually, are not vastly better than ours outside of the problem areas in  striker and goalkeeper.

Maybe I’m being delusional but I have no doubt Poch would get this team top 4. 

1 minute ago, loz said:

Yet in those two seasons they finished 6th and this season will be lucky to finish top 8.  Getting worse rather than better.  Sign of weak mentalities which has mid table obscurity written all over it

Point is, the players are clearly capable ! They have already demonstrated for a whole year that they can gather enough points per game to be Top 4. 

Conclusion : this current malaise is a management issue. He's moved the team away from doing all the things that were working well. 

 

8 minutes ago, loz said:

Yet in those two seasons they finished 6th and this season will be lucky to finish top 8.  Getting worse rather than better.  Sign of weak mentalities which has mid table obscurity written all over it

Another thing that's being overlooked is that those incentivized contracts clearly aren't working. The players look completely disinterested.

1 minute ago, Sexyfootball said:

Point is, the players are clearly capable ! They have already demonstrated for a whole year that they can gather enough points per game to be Top 4. 

Conclusion : this current malaise is a management issue. He's moved the team away from doing all the things that were working well. 

 

I don't disagree that we have a management issue but it's not the only problem.  Other than the squads you mentioned it might be true that no others are materially better than ours from  an ability perspective but i could probably name another 7 or 8 who are mentally stronger than us. When results don't go our way we look like a squad of beaten players. Weak mentally and, in too many cases, no desire to battle for points.  That's why I say they aren't Top four material.

8 hours ago, dermott said:

Maresca is Oasis to Pep's Beatles.

27 minutes ago, loz said:

I don't disagree that we have a management issue but it's not the only problem.  Other than the squads you mentioned it might be true that no others are materially better than ours from  an ability perspective but i could probably name another 7 or 8 who are mentally stronger than us. When results don't go our way we look like a squad of beaten players. Weak mentally and, in too many cases, no desire to battle for points.  That's why I say they aren't Top four material.

Fair enough can’t really disagree from a mentality point of view, they are young players after all so to be expected to some degree. 

Would it be cheeky of me to suggest a better manager would help with this though?