2 hours ago, bisright1 said:

A week ago it seemed no one was paying that money. 

Now one club has suddenly decided to pay that money. 

And we've just happened at exactly the same time to overpay for a player by maybe 8-10m. Who happens to be at that very club.

All this just before the 30 June deadline. 

It's incredibly obvious what has happened. I'm surprised you can't see it. 

This would make sense if Maatsen had gone for more than he's worth though? If we were money laundering we'd have used an asset a lot less valuable. Less than 40m for such a high potential youngster was always going to be snatched up, Shaw went for around that price about a decade ago ffs.

As for Kellyman, it certainly fits our recruitment style. We were saying the exact same about Chukwuemeka when we signed him. 

Take off the tin foil hat. 

53 minutes ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

This would make sense if Maatsen had gone for more than he's worth though? If we were money laundering we'd have used an asset a lot less valuable. Less than 40m for such a high potential youngster was always going to be snatched up, Shaw went for around that price about a decade ago ffs.

As for Kellyman, it certainly fits our recruitment style. We were saying the exact same about Chukwuemeka when we signed him. 

Take off the tin foil hat. 

Looking at the profile, i wonder if Kellyman essentially came in to Villa to fill the gap made by Carney coming to us.

29 minutes ago, WhiteWall said:

Looking at the profile, i wonder if Kellyman essentially came in to Villa to fill the gap made by Carney coming to us.

He's Villa academy.

2 hours ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

This would make sense if Maatsen had gone for more than he's worth though? If we were money laundering we'd have used an asset a lot less valuable. Less than 40m for such a high potential youngster was always going to be snatched up, Shaw went for around that price about a decade ago ffs.

As for Kellyman, it certainly fits our recruitment style. We were saying the exact same about Chukwuemeka when we signed him. 

Take off the tin foil hat. 

Well I respectfully disagree. I wouldn't call it a tin hat opinion, it's quite widely viewed that these are mutually beneficial deals. 

I don't think for a second Villa with their financial problems are spending 37m on a full back

I also don't think this lad is going to see first team football for us. 

Edited June 24, 20242 yr by bisright1

1 hour ago, dermott said:

He's Villa academy.

What i meant was, as Carney was and then after we took him this lad was the next cab on the rank coming through the academy as well. Its what I thought although i may well be wrong.

 

4 hours ago, bisright1 said:

Well I respectfully disagree. I wouldn't call it a tin hat opinion, it's quite widely viewed that these are mutually beneficial deals. 

I don't think for a second Villa with their financial problems are spending 37m on a full back

I also don't think this lad is going to see first team football for us. 

My issue with all of this is that creative accounting is fine and Chelsea along with others are not actually breaching any rules, they are just bending their way around the edges.

The thing is that most of us, in the industries and markets that we work in, are prevented from similar practices because regardless of the actual law we are also bound by a set of conduct rules and codes of ethics which are overseen by our regulators. 

The fact that these loopholes exist is not the issue. There are holes in the fabric of every market system. The issue is that the regulator is so sh*t or worse, that they have consistently failed to introduce an overarching ethics and conduct framework that would prevent financial accounting sharp practices to dodge around a set of rules intended, rightly or wrongly,  to bring a level playing field to this market place.

9 hours ago, WhiteWall said:

My issue with all of this is that creative accounting is fine and Chelsea along with others are not actually breaching any rules, they are just bending their way around the edges.

The thing is that most of us, in the industries and markets that we work in, are prevented from similar practices because regardless of the actual law we are also bound by a set of conduct rules and codes of ethics which are overseen by our regulators. 

The fact that these loopholes exist is not the issue. There are holes in the fabric of every market system. The issue is that the regulator is so sh*t or worse, that they have consistently failed to introduce an overarching ethics and conduct framework that would prevent financial accounting sharp practices to dodge around a set of rules intended, rightly or wrongly,  to bring a level playing field to this market place.

This is all down to the feckless PL and UEFA have created this situation without having a fully fledged plan in place, its all Ad Hoc, making changes as clubs find ways round it all as the rules are so poorly defined. But its no different to whats gone on for decades in football, theres been loads of loopholes used, from Arsenal's offshore image rights and parking fees at some random Belgian club (I think), Utds and Liverpools tax overseas tax set ups etc. The difference now is its "smaller" clubs using them against the big clubs rules, this is all about keeping them dickheads at the top. So frankly, f**k the lot of them.

16 hours ago, WhiteWall said:

Looking at the profile, i wonder if Kellyman essentially came in to Villa to fill the gap made by Carney coming to us.

They snatched him on the cheap when Derby went through all their troubles, he was being named in Championship match day squads at 16.

Been nominated for PL2 player of the month and been named player of the tournament at international tournaments. Its obviously money laundering though. Spending millions on teenagers is only okay if they're not English. 

He is ours

3 hours ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

They snatched him on the cheap when Derby went through all their troubles, he was being named in Championship match day squads at 16.

Been nominated for PL2 player of the month and been named player of the tournament at international tournaments. Its obviously money laundering though. Spending millions on teenagers is only okay if they're not English. 

Seeing Arsenal f**kwits whining about Us, Villa, Newcastle etc circumventing the ffp bullsh*t is ridiculously hypocritical, they did it last year by pretending to loan David Raya for a year, then buy him this season. But no doubt thats ok because of reasons...

So does he stay with the first team or does he go on loan?  Kellyman or Marc Guiu? which player gets first to be in the first team squad or do we put both in the squad for this season?

 

48 minutes ago, dkw said:

Seeing Arsenal f**kwits whining about Us, Villa, Newcastle etc circumventing the ffp bullsh*t is ridiculously hypocritical, they did it last year by pretending to loan David Raya for a year, then buy him this season. But no doubt thats ok because of reasons...

Simon Jordan shot it all down this morning on Talksport, Jim White thought he was going to say it was all a con, instead Jordan said if a club asks for x then another team pay it, whose to say he's not worth it, as an example he used Walcott bought from Southampton by ARSENAL for 12 million when he had only appeared in 6 games

7 hours ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

They snatched him on the cheap when Derby went through all their troubles, he was being named in Championship match day squads at 16.

Been nominated for PL2 player of the month and been named player of the tournament at international tournaments. Its obviously money laundering though. Spending millions on teenagers is only okay if they're not English. 

Player of the tournament at which international tournament? 

On 25/06/2024 at 16:19, bisright1 said:

Player of the tournament at which international tournament? 

2023 HKFC Soccer Sevens

Now official !

https://www.chelseafc.com/en/news/article/chelsea-complete-omari-kellyman-signing 

Now we actually need to remember his name. Welcome Omari. 

Sell one Omari, buy another.

1 hour ago, evissy said:

Now we actually need to remember his name. Welcome Omari. 

Sell one Omari, buy another.

I'm going to hold off swotting until the transfer window has closed everywhere. I don't want to waste time and precious brain space on players who at the last minute go on loan to Ulan Bator United because the Cobham dressing room is full.

Omari Kellyman hails 'dream come true' after completing £19m transfer. Will he be in the first team squad or will his dream be a loan?  We know all about the financial loopholes but it will forever be said that we paid £19 million quid for this lad.   £19 Million quid.

wow.

1 hour ago, TheCeleryKing said:

Omari Kellyman hails 'dream come true' after completing £19m transfer. Will he be in the first team squad or will his dream be a loan?  We know all about the financial loopholes but it will forever be said that we paid £19 million quid for this lad.   £19 Million quid.

 

wow.

19 million that didnt need to be spent for a player never going to see the first team because he's not needed. 

i wonder how many in the academy are as good or better at this stage of their careers?! Why would you promote one of those? 

 

 

5 hours ago, TheCeleryKing said:

Omari Kellyman hails 'dream come true' after completing £19m transfer. Will he be in the first team squad or will his dream be a loan?  We know all about the financial loopholes but it will forever be said that we paid £19 million quid for this lad.   £19 Million quid.

 

wow.

It still amazes me that clubs like Newcastle, Villa and even Man United are struggling with their finances.  Yet we seem to be throwing money around willy nilly and even help other clubs out with their financial struggles by overpaying for their youth players.

39 minutes ago, DarkMata said:

It still amazes me that clubs like Newcastle, Villa and even Man United are struggling with their finances.  Yet we seem to be throwing money around willy nilly and even help other clubs out with their financial struggles by overpaying for their youth players.

It could not be any different for Manchester United as their awful decisions have led to this situation. Finance is very simple at this level - you either buy big, sell low, but have big performances on the pitch, or you also buy big, but also sell big to balance everything.

United does the worst combination of all of this - they spend ridiculous amounts of money on awful players, rarely win any trophy, they have only made it twice to the UCL QF for the past 14 years, could not get past group stages last season and two seasons before and they are probably the worst big club when it comes to selling the deadwood. Di Maria, Lukaku and Henrik Mkhitarian are the only three players that United have sold above 30M. All their other departures are in the region of 20M or lower. Absolutely shocking for a big club.

It is simply not a susteinable recipe unless you are at the top all the time and they are not. That is why Barcelona is also desperate for on pitch success, because their finances are way worse than United's and if they keep crashing out in the group stages or in the Last 16 of UCL just like they did for the last seasons, then they are in way bigger trouble. But if there is any club in this world that deserves to go bankrupt and never come back to glory days, it is Barcelona. Truly a despicable institution.

2 hours ago, DarkMata said:

It still amazes me that clubs like Newcastle, Villa and even Man United are struggling with their finances.  Yet we seem to be throwing money around willy nilly and even help other clubs out with their financial struggles by overpaying for their youth players.

This is clearly just a deal between the clubs to help with the profit rules.  Both need to get over line by tomorrow.   We get pretty much full profit for Maatsen as do they for Kellyman.  And both write off the fees over contract length.  Probably puts £30m towards what we need to reach.

PSR has created a market wide open for dodgy deals 

9 hours ago, TheCeleryKing said:

Omari Kellyman hails 'dream come true' after completing £19m transfer. Will he be in the first team squad or will his dream be a loan?  We know all about the financial loopholes but it will forever be said that we paid £19 million quid for this lad.   £19 Million quid.

 

wow.

The poor guy is delusional. If Villa didn't buy Maatsen, we wouldn't have bought Kellyman. He will be loaned out and then sold in a year or two so we can make some profit.

4 hours ago, petre ispirescu said:

It could not be any different for Manchester United as their awful decisions have led to this situation. Finance is very simple at this level - you either buy big, sell low, but have big performances on the pitch, or you also buy big, but also sell big to balance everything.

United does the worst combination of all of this - they spend ridiculous amounts of money on awful players, rarely win any trophy, they have only made it twice to the UCL QF for the past 14 years, could not get past group stages last season and two seasons before and they are probably the worst big club when it comes to selling the deadwood. Di Maria, Lukaku and Henrik Mkhitarian are the only three players that United have sold above 30M. All their other departures are in the region of 20M or lower. Absolutely shocking for a big club.

It is simply not a susteinable recipe unless you are at the top all the time and they are not. That is why Barcelona is also desperate for on pitch success, because their finances are way worse than United's and if they keep crashing out in the group stages or in the Last 16 of UCL just like they did for the last seasons, then they are in way bigger trouble. But if there is any club in this world that deserves to go bankrupt and never come back to glory days, it is Barcelona. Truly a despicable institution.

We could easily end up in the Man Utd situation pretty soon if we don’t start performing on the pitch.

So many young lads being signed as well as this OK, the club can have as many as they like out on loan if under 21 but only 6 over 21. 3 years goes fast in football.