Hopefully next season Conte can iron out the defensive errors of this season, there has been far too many.

Edited May 12, 201610 yr by Malcolm9

Hopefully next season Conte can iron out the defensive errors of this season, there has been far too many.

 

I can't remember the last game we played where there wasn't a big error in defense this season.

It's easy to act like the club have easy decisions, with a fan base demanding success but also demanding the youth be blooded whilst not wanting to be beaten by a rival.

We can't go an put 11 youths on the park, I struggle to see how having more than 3 would be beneficial to any of them really.  Maybe he would have been a better option than Matic for developments sake last night from the beginning, but you have to remember we now have a new manager on board with some tough decisions to make and needs to be certain players like Matic are just having a blip.  But then again, we were down on centre halfs last night so having a more senior midfield duo would probably help Mikel so that we didn't lose to a rival and give the fans another reason to be unhappy.

The reasoning is endless, the club can hardly have a problem with development.. they've pumped more money into development than any other club.

i thought we were terrific last night.

 

I can't really speak for anyone else but i would happily take a season without any silverware and just a top 4 finish next year if it meant 1 or 2 of our academy players (not Kenedy or players we've signed young, but local lads who've been at the club since they were 8) breaking into the actual starting 11 and showing what they can do. 

I can't really speak for anyone else but i would happily take a season without any silverware and just a top 4 finish next year if it meant 1 or 2 of our academy players (not Kenedy or players we've signed young, but local lads who've been at the club since they were 8) breaking into the actual starting 11 and showing what they can do. 

Happily take top 4?  Like that is a given ?  If we were lucky enough to have two youth players cement themselves in the senior squad and finish 4th that would be an outstanding year in my books.  It is no where near as easy or simple as that.

Not that I don't feel similiar to you, but aren't you just saying you'd like to see the club become an academy club?  Producing quality youth who push onto the senior side but who never actually contend for silverware?

I can't really speak for anyone else but i would happily take a season without any silverware and just a top 4 finish next year if it meant 1 or 2 of our academy players (not Kenedy or players we've signed young, but local lads who've been at the club since they were 8) breaking into the actual starting 11 and showing what they can do. 

When we made our disastrous start, I was more than willing to write this season off in terms of silverware and see some of our young talent properly integrated into the team. What we have seen has been the worst of both worlds, with zero success but a pitiful failure to give younger players a proper run in the side. Yes we've thrown in RLC, Kenedy, Traore, Miazga, Abraham (I'm not counting Baba or Zouma here), but they haven't had the games needed to develop as players. 

When we made our disastrous start, I was more than willing to write this season off in terms of silverware and see some of our young talent properly integrated into the team. What we have seen has been the worst of both worlds, with zero success but a pitiful failure to give younger players a proper run in the side. Yes we've thrown in RLC, Kenedy, Traore, Miazga, Abraham (I'm not counting Baba or Zouma here), but they haven't had the games needed to develop as players. 

 

I completely agree. After it looked like we were no longer going to get relegated i would've liked to have seen a full 90minutes for youngster quite often. Instead we stuck with Mikel, Matic, Ivan etc. How Aina still hasn't has a look in with our full back options this year has amazed me. 

 

Happily take top 4?  Like that is a given ?  If we were lucky enough to have two youth players cement themselves in the senior squad and finish 4th that would be an outstanding year in my books.  It is no where near as easy or simple as that.

Not that I don't feel similiar to you, but aren't you just saying you'd like to see the club become an academy club?  Producing quality youth who push onto the senior side but who never actually contend for silverware?

Fair point about the top 4. I don't believe Chelsea would become an academy club and not compete for silverware. If anything, the players we're developing should help us compete for silverware more so. Aina could have arguably done a better job than Baba or Ivan this season. Palmer could probably have matched Oscar's output. Same goes for RLC and Matic. 

It's easy to act like the club have easy decisions, with a fan base demanding success 

Sorry mate. But there is hardly ANYONE here who would be demanding success since the end of Feb.

Anyone else reckon ruben is going to be put through his paces by conte? His work rate needs to go through the roof. I can't see him getting away with pondering through games like he occasionally does. I think conte will be fantastic for him actually.

Anyone else reckon ruben is going to be put through his paces by conte? His work rate needs to go through the roof. I can't see him getting away with pondering through games like he occasionally does. I think conte will be fantastic for him actually.

It's a possibility and I think exactly what he needs

I think conte will be fantastic for him actually.

 

Pessimism/negativity alert 

 

I hope so, certainly I hope Conte sees something in him that I don't... for me he falls into the category of 'eccentric player'... he has the physicality without question, i'm just not convinced he has the raw talent to reach the same heights of other eccentric players (Gazza, Ballack, Pogba, Zidane, etc). For me he shares similar traits to Ravel Morrison ("potential to be world class", "coaches critical of effort" etc), I just hope his career doesn't follow the same path.

 

Edited May 13, 201610 yr by the special one

Anyone else reckon ruben is going to be put through his paces by conte? His work rate needs to go through the roof. I can't see him getting away with pondering through games like he occasionally does. I think conte will be fantastic for him actually.

Think it could be the kick up the ass the boy needs tho saying that I would rather him given games in beside matic instead of playing as a number 10. he played well against MK Dons in the FA cup but didn't seem match fit and looked like he was saving himself. I'd defiantly like to see him impose himself on games more next season if given a chance

Edited May 14, 201610 yr by Belfast_blue5

Premier League loan for him please. 

Premier League loan for him please.

They don't work.

Teams playing to a standard that we need him to play won't give minutes to a loan sighing.

So you send them to relegation candidates instead but when things go wrong they default to experience rather than the youthful loanee.

He's best off staying at Chelsea but we need to back him.

Get rid of Mikel, Matic or Oscar and promote RLC so he's 2nd choice and making sub appearances almost every game and playing in the event of injuries and suspensions.

We have to stop delegating the responsibility of youth development to other clubs because it's not working.

Waltzed around without doing much last night. Jose's criticism from the end of last season is still very relevant.

What we need in midfield is more energy. He has had the chance to prove he could add that. Yet time and again he hasn't shown it.

I'm all for keeping him in the squad and giving him a chance but you can't drift through games like he does. He risks ending up in the Josh situation if that's the case.

Being given the odd minute here and there by Guus the fraud over past five months hasn't helped, especially after scoring at villa...would have been buzzing after that, Hiddink quickly drained him of all belief by leaving him out again and again...needed a run of games, not bits and pieces

I think its more a matter of his tactical acumen than him being lazy. He'll never be a runner like Ramires but even while he was playing with the reserves and such he wasnt either. His physical gifts alone wont carry him at this level like they did before. In youth games he could get by with poor positioning because the players around him were doing the same thing or not on his level physically or both. A good summer of work and experience will do him good. I expect to see a different player next season

Being given the odd minute here and there by Guus the fraud over past five months hasn't helped, especially after scoring at villa...would have been buzzing after that, Hiddink quickly drained him of all belief by leaving him out again and again...needed a run of games, not bits and pieces

He got way more than he would have under Jose. And arguably more than he should have based on performance and effort.

Among our youth players, RLC "deserved" less than Traore and maybe even Kenedy. The other two were underplayed, not Ruben.

All three were underplayed in my opinion, but as this is a subject about Ruben I was talking specifically about him

Edited May 17, 201610 yr by The Brit

Ruben gets such preferential treatment from Chelsea fans. If any other unestablished player (Pato, Miazga, etc) showed that lack of urgency, fans would be almost unanimously ranting about them and complaining that they got too much playing time not to mention an excessive contract. I'm not saying fans are wrong. Academy players should get some degree of preferential treatment.

Look at this clip.

https://streamable.com/w70v

If his attitude during the matches reflects his attitude during training, then I'm surprised Guus gave him as much as he did, and Conte will likely not be as generous.

the new prem strategy as we just witnessed this season is to play a hard pressing game (preferably up the pitch), run til you bust a lung and never give up for 9 months

 

Leicester demonstrated this superbly, Spuds also made it a cornerstone of their limited success, Dippers have admirably played that way in some games since Klopp came,

along with other surprise teams like Soton & the pikeys

 

Chelsea failed miserably all season at this, the statuesque Ruben displaying this trait admirably in the clip

 

no longer can a mega rich club buy marquee players on silly money and rely on their superior technical skills, the successful teams must have both-

technical prowess and an unsurpassed work ethic coupled with very high fitness levels  (these 3 things were absent for most of Chelsea's season) as demonstrated

superbly by the champions. If Chelsea DOF & board fail to change and adapt - then no more success for a long time, as Leicester and Co are only going to 

improve and surely City & United will get this, so yes RLC (and whomever else makes next seasons 1st team squad) needs to improve in this facet of the game. 

Edited May 17, 201610 yr by General

the new prem strategy as we just witnessed this season is to play a hard pressing game (preferably up the pitch), run til you bust a lung and never give up for 9 months

 

Leicester demonstrated this superbly, Spuds also made it a cornerstone of their limited success, Dippers have admirably played that way in some games since Klopp came,

along with other surprise teams like Soton & the pikeys

 

Chelsea failed miserably all season at this, the statuesque Ruben displaying this trait admirably in the clip

 

no longer can a mega rich club buy marquee players on silly money and rely on their superior technical skills, the successful teams must have both-

technical prowess and an unsurpassed work ethic coupled with very high fitness levels  (these 3 things were absent for most of Chelsea's season) as demonstrated

superbly by the champions. If Chelsea DOF & board fail to change and adapt - then no more success for a long time, as Leicester and Co are only going to 

improve and surely City & United will get this, so yes RLC (and whomever else makes next seasons 1st team squad) needs to improve in this facet of the game. 

This is a rather simplistic view of the league and if it were true Arsenal wouldn't have come second. What we saw with Leicester was a freak case and not the trend, built on a wave of momentum and a lot of their players in the form of their life (almost unrepeatable form), and that not to mention all the fortuitous decisions or close wins which could have gone either way (in particular at the start of the season where they would be 2/3-0 at half time and somehow came back to win).

Tottenham did better points wise under AVB than they managed this season, and that team certainly wasn't built on work ethic, I also don't think Tottenham's current team is built on a high press or high work rate either.

For me the reason they have been "successful" this season is more down to their formation than there work ethic. The only players known for the work rate in that spurs team are the full backs and I suppose Son.

 

Klopps Liverpool have also been very average and inconsistent in the league so I wouldn't be using that as an example of a successful team to replicate at the moment.

I agree we have been very poor this season and have had fundamental problems, again I think this is more to do with how our team was set up and not to do with work ethic. For instance when Cesc was playing at his worst he was one of the players covering the most ground on the pitch. We have lacked fight, desire, passion and Determination which massively hasn't helped but I don't think the solution is to have a team of Ramires'.

  

Edited May 17, 201610 yr by PedroMendez

People wanting rlc to bust a lung yet want cesc to wear the armband. Wow!!!

Gus was absolutely horrendous with his management of Rlc. Our Motm against city by a light year. Have people forgotten that game or are they suffering from selective amnesia. I was at the game and Rlc's work rate was brilliant his touches, his positioning and literally every aspect was great.

And sadly that was his last start.

People can show selective clips and that can be done for any player in the world, be it Ramires, rakitic or kante.

Just wish he had been made a permanent fixture of the team. But thanks to gutless gus, we missed a massive opportunity.

You don't have to take that dig at Cesc, honestly your vendetta against certain players is boring.

People wanting rlc to bust a lung yet want cesc to wear the armband. Wow!!!

Gus was absolutely horrendous with his management of Rlc. Our Motm against city by a light year. Have people forgotten that game or are they suffering from selective amnesia. I was at the game and Rlc's work rate was brilliant his touches, his positioning and literally every aspect was great.

And sadly that was his last start.

People can show selective clips and that can be done for any player in the world, be it Ramires, rakitic or kante.

Just wish he had been made a permanent fixture of the team. But thanks to gutless gus, we missed a massive opportunity.

 

Cesc isn't in the team to be a runner so its harsh to compare him, he controls the play and tempo of the game with his passing. Ruben doesn't have that trait so he's expected to do more of the leg work. Don't get me wrong, i think Ruben has been fantastic on the ball this year but he seems to shut off during games. I don't think its his attitude that he can't be bothered to run. I think he has lapses of concentration and forgets his role within the team. Something that should fade with age, experience and playing time.

Cesc isn't in the team to be a runner so its harsh to compare him, he controls the play and tempo of the game with his passing. Ruben doesn't have that trait so he's expected to do more of the leg work. Don't get me wrong, i think Ruben has been fantastic on the ball this year but he seems to shut off during games. I don't think its his attitude that he can't be bothered to run. I think he has lapses of concentration and forgets his role within the team. Something that should fade with age, experience and playing time.

You are spot on mate. But that's my point, is it fair to expect rlc to be a runner? You can put iniesta and he would look average if you judge his role as a runner, same goes for kroos. But these are big names that I am throwing out so let's bring it down a notch.

When I look at rlc playing, I can draw so many comparisons with one player in recent time and that is Saul niguez. Both are good on the ball, have a good first touch, are good physically. Intact I would say rlc is better than what Saul was a year or 2 ago. But can rlc have that development? Can he get that faith from the manager and the fan base?

I also bring cesc into it (while some people would think its vendetta, I am sure atleast some would like to here me out). Let's look at atm's midfield, koke-gabi-Saul. Is either of them a "runner"? For me No. Not even close. And yet they are one of the best pressing teams. You don't need runners to have a high press. the different between us and atm is that each of those players can hold their own and more defensively. Can the same be said for cesc? For me, cesc can only play successfully with 2 defensive minded "runners". For me, rlc and cesc can't co exist. And it's very unfair to even judge the kid on a role he certainly is not suited for. So the choice is between a 29 year old with flaws that the world is aware of, or a 20 year old who is showing great signs and can yet be molded in different ways.

For me the answer is rlc. A long term solution from the academy. There is no vendetta. People might not like what they read but let's be clear everyone is here because they love the club. But some fans might want different things from others. No need to go about belittling others opinions just because they don't match yours