5 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Lets be honest, Pele won 2 world cups. He barely played in the '62 world cup and at each tournament he was outshone by one of his countrymen. 

The bloke used to knock 8 past Botafogo Ribeirao Preto to boost his numbers. Its the popular choice to just say Pele is the greatest, but when you compare the level he played at and his actual numbers Messi and Ronaldo are much more impressive. 

Its the same whenever you try and compare different eras. I think it would be fair to say that the current England squad would out play and definitely be fitter than the squad of 66...

 

 

1 hour ago, WhiteWall said:

Erectile problems if the adverts are to be believed

I'm confused now! Are you talking about Pele or RIP Mourinho?

47 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Lets be honest, Pele won 2 world cups. He barely played in the '62 world cup and at each tournament he was outshone by one of his countrymen. 

The bloke used to knock 8 past Botafogo Ribeirao Preto to boost his numbers. Its the popular choice to just say Pele is the greatest, but when you compare the level he played at and his actual numbers Messi and Ronaldo are much more impressive. 

I get where you’re coming from but it’s all relative to the time as well. Messi & Ronaldo would be kicked too bits back then, football was definitely a lot more physical. These things change so much it’s had to compare through era’s IMO.

Lionel Messi has disappointed at the International level overall. He has of course had some magical moments but has never managed to consistently find his Barcelona form. Diego Maradona would surely still be held in higher regard by Argentina fans. He almost single-handedly (literally at times) delivered one World Cup in 86 and almost led them to an unlikely repeat in 90. Also that team did not have the supporting talent that Messi has enjoyed.

You could maybe argue more of a case for Ronaldo since he did manage to lead a fairly average Portugal team to the European Championship in 2016.

As others have pointed out it is very difficult to compare players from different eras. Undoubtedly the quality and speed of the game is much higher now, but attacking players received much less protection from refs back in Pele's time. I still think Pele is best in history so far, but I recognize that debate will rage on.

51 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

The bloke used to knock 8 past Botafogo Ribeirao Preto to boost his numbers. Its the popular choice to just say Pele is the greatest, but when you compare the level he played at and his actual numbers Messi and Ronaldo are much more impressive. 

It's nowhere near as simple as comparing records, especially careers that were half a century apart. Would we even know who Messi is without a foreign league to play in? something not available to Pele until he was 35yo and already famous around the planet.

Not going to lie, before the europa game against Malmo where we beat them 3-0, I had lost almost all faith in Sarri. He came across as a stubborn manager who was never going to change his tactics no matter how badly we got humiliated and I thought he was done for. But since the embarrassing defeat to City, he has actually shown that hes willing to drop players and change tactics a little instead of playing the same football over and over. 

Obviously he could have done it sooner, but its better than not doing it at all and I have some faith in him again. Of course its easy to say that we should sell half our team and drop all our regular starters, but the truth is change comes slowly and im happy to see he has already made some decisions we thought we would never see such as dropping Alonso for Emerson. The tactics with Jorg seem to be changing a little and Kante sometimes plays deeper than he did at the beginning of the season. Kovacic is also a good replacement for Jorginho, and thats where Sarri has been playing him as of late. CHO and RLC both also getting much more minutes is also a bonus. 

Im never one to speak too soon, but I feel we are past the worst of the season now, so it can only be up from here (I hope)

4 minutes ago, ENygma said:

Not going to lie, before the europa game against Malmo where we beat them 3-0, I had lost almost all faith in Sarri. He came across as a stubborn manager who was never going to change his tactics no matter how badly we got humiliated and I thought he was done for. But since the embarrassing defeat to City, he has actually shown that hes willing to drop players and change tactics a little instead of playing the same football over and over. 

Obviously he could have done it sooner, but its better than not doing it at all and I have some faith in him again. Of course its easy to say that we should sell half our team and drop all our regular starters, but the truth is change comes slowly and im happy to see he has already made some decisions we thought we would never see such as dropping Alonso for Emerson. The tactics with Jorg seem to be changing a little and Kante sometimes plays deeper than he did at the beginning of the season. Kovacic is also a good replacement for Jorginho, and thats where Sarri has been playing him as of late. CHO and RLC both also getting much more minutes is also a bonus. 

Im never one to speak too soon, but I feel we are past the worst of the season now, so it can only be up from here (I hope)

I agree. Even though I fully expect more bumps along the way it feels as though we may have turned a corner over the last couple of weeks. Not just in our results but in Sarri's willingness to be a bit more flexible in hist strategy. The fact that he is now discussing the plans for next season, suggests that he believes that too. Still a long way to go but some hope for sure. 

1 hour ago, forbzy said:

I agree. Even though I fully expect more bumps along the way it feels as though we may have turned a corner over the last couple of weeks. Not just in our results but in Sarri's willingness to be a bit more flexible in hist strategy. The fact that he is now discussing the plans for next season, suggests that he believes that too. Still a long way to go but some hope for sure. 

Exactly mate. As long as we bring in the right players in and sort out the loan mess we can easily compete for all the top honours next season. As good as we started, this year was always going to be a transitional/rebuilding season

3 hours ago, ENygma said:

Not going to lie, before the europa game against Malmo where we beat them 3-0, I had lost almost all faith in Sarri. He came across as a stubborn manager who was never going to change his tactics no matter how badly we got humiliated and I thought he was done for. But since the embarrassing defeat to City, he has actually shown that hes willing to drop players and change tactics a little instead of playing the same football over and over. 

Obviously he could have done it sooner, but its better than not doing it at all and I have some faith in him again. Of course its easy to say that we should sell half our team and drop all our regular starters, but the truth is change comes slowly and im happy to see he has already made some decisions we thought we would never see such as dropping Alonso for Emerson. The tactics with Jorg seem to be changing a little and Kante sometimes plays deeper than he did at the beginning of the season. Kovacic is also a good replacement for Jorginho, and thats where Sarri has been playing him as of late. CHO and RLC both also getting much more minutes is also a bonus. 

Im never one to speak too soon, but I feel we are past the worst of the season now, so it can only be up from here (I hope)

It would be if they were..... According to what Sarri has said himself across numerous press conference, CHO has already gotten the vast majority of the playing time he should expect this season and he's played 74 minutes in the BPL and only 5 starts in all other competitions...... Sarris also said CHO should expect double that next season..... pretty much saying it's nearly a 5 year plan to make CHO a regular starter.

5 hours ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Lets be honest, Pele won 2 world cups. He barely played in the '62 world cup and at each tournament he was outshone by one of his countrymen. 

The bloke used to knock 8 past Botafogo Ribeirao Preto to boost his numbers. Its the popular choice to just say Pele is the greatest, but when you compare the level he played at and his actual numbers Messi and Ronaldo are much more impressive. 

Difficult to compare era's as modern day footballers have advantage of sports science, diets, bowling green pitches, and a game that is practically non contact, for what it's worth and I can't stand him, but greatest player for me is Diego Maradona

32 minutes ago, chi blue said:

Difficult to compare era's as modern day footballers have advantage of sports science, diets, bowling green pitches, and a game that is practically non contact, for what it's worth and I can't stand him, but greatest player for me is Diego Maradona

Agree on Maradona, cheating git but brilliant player and another who played from 16. Wonder how he'd have been if Sheffield United chose him instead of Sabella?

Edited March 7, 20197 yr by charierre

1 hour ago, Barry Bridges said:

It would be if they were..... According to what Sarri has said himself across numerous press conference, CHO has already gotten the vast majority of the playing time he should expect this season and he's played 74 minutes in the BPL and only 5 starts in all other competitions...... Sarris also said CHO should expect double that next season..... pretty much saying it's nearly a 5 year plan to make CHO a regular starter.

In all fairness to RLC, he was injured and just getting back into the mix. 

CHO i can somewhat agree on, but they are both still improvements since the early parts of the season

3 hours ago, Barry Bridges said:

It would be if they were..... According to what Sarri has said himself across numerous press conference, CHO has already gotten the vast majority of the playing time he should expect this season and he's played 74 minutes in the BPL and only 5 starts in all other competitions...... Sarris also said CHO should expect double that next season..... pretty much saying it's nearly a 5 year plan to make CHO a regular starter.

This x100. My biggest criticism of Sarri is not playing these extremely talented young players and if he doesn’t I’ll really struggle to get behind him. 

 

He’s literally just said you can’t be a top player at 18, has he watched Mbappe and things? Players don’t have to become top players at 22/23, CHO will not wait 5 years to be a regular starter and in all honesty, he shouldn’t have to. He’s good enough, thus he’s old enough.

After tonight's comments it's still an "out" for me if he's going to largely ignore players until their 22 or 23 years old.

I doubt if Ampadu will stick around that long without breaking into the team if that's his thinking, and I don't fancy Reece James' chances here either.

It should be about ability not age when selecting a player.

10 minutes ago, 2211 said:

After tonight's comments it's still an "out" for me if he's going to largely ignore players until their 22 or 23 years old.

I doubt if Ampadu will stick around that long without breaking into the team if that's his thinking, and I don't fancy Reece James' chances here either.

It should be about ability not age when selecting a player.

I don't understand how any manager that can have that kind of mindset after seeing so many of the greatest players in the last 30 years breakthrough before they are 20. Does Sarri even watch football? 

Imagine if he was the manager of Monaco and PSG in the last 2 years, Mbappe wouldn't be a world cup winner, he would still be trying to breakthrough because the manager doesn't think he is old enough for football at the top.

Sarri's comments tonight could be very damaging in the long run. If he's saying they won't be good enough until they are in their early 20's, then every single one of our youngsters may as well start looking for another club, because none of them are getting in.

18 hours ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Lets be honest, Pele won 2 world cups. He barely played in the '62 world cup and at each tournament he was outshone by one of his countrymen. 

The bloke used to knock 8 past Botafogo Ribeirao Preto to boost his numbers. Its the popular choice to just say Pele is the greatest, but when you compare the level he played at and his actual numbers Messi and Ronaldo are much more impressive. 

The Brazilian league wasn't the same Btec league back then it is now. Back then most players were based in their own country and all 3 of Brazil's world cup squads in Pele's era was solely Brazilian league players.

Edited March 8, 20197 yr by Argo

8 hours ago, 2211 said:

After tonight's comments it's still an "out" for me if he's going to largely ignore players until their 22 or 23 years old.

You've taken his quote completely wrong.

9 hours ago, EdinburghBlue said:

This x100. My biggest criticism of Sarri is not playing these extremely talented young players and if he doesn’t I’ll really struggle to get behind him. 

He’s literally just said you can’t be a top player at 18, has he watched Mbappe and things? Players don’t have to become top players at 22/23, CHO will not wait 5 years to be a regular starter and in all honesty, he shouldn’t have to. He’s good enough, thus he’s old enough.

He didn't mean that, he meant most players don't elevate to world class status until that age which is correct, you have literally named one of the few exceptions.

I'm not 100% convinced Sarri is the right man for his development but it is ridiculous how out of context that quote is being taken as.

I think that Sarri should stay as he needs more time. If he gets the players he wants in the summer than we will have a very strong squad that could go for the big trophies.

2 hours ago, Argo said:

You've taken his quote completely wrong.

I don't think I have.

The bottom line is CHO has restricted minutes because of his age, as Sarri is always bringing this up in his interviews.

Why not trust him more and see how he develops rather than publicly banging on about his age and only giving him 10-15 minutes every few games.

IMO he's a special talent and should be getting more game time than he is at present.

He should be in the pecking order based on ability not age, and already for the minutes he does get he's provided decent numbers for goals and assists.

2 hours ago, Argo said:

He didn't mean that, he meant most players don't elevate to world class status until that age which is correct, you have literally named one of the few exceptions.

I'm not 100% convinced Sarri is the right man for his development but it is ridiculous how out of context that quote is being taken as.

Sancho is playing at 18, Sterling was playing more at 18, Rashford as well. There is numerous examples of players who got more minutes on the pitch at the same age. Especially when you consider the two players who tend to play all the minutes are not exactly world class. Particularly Willian who if he’s not standing over a dead ball within shooting range, I never have a real feeling is likely to score.

21 minutes ago, EdinburghBlue said:

Sancho is playing at 18, Sterling was playing more at 18, Rashford as well. There is numerous examples of players who got more minutes on the pitch at the same age. Especially when you consider the two players who tend to play all the minutes are not exactly world class. Particularly Willian who if he’s not standing over a dead ball within shooting range, I never have a real feeling is likely to score.

Thats not exactly true mate,,, Sterlings first season when he was 17/ 18 he had 3 aps... Rashfords debut season he had 18 (at a time when Utds strikers where injured) and many of these were as sub... 

While yes I want CHO to play but the game time he is getting is about right IMO for a player in their debut season

43 minutes ago, EdinburghBlue said:

Sancho is playing at 18, Sterling was playing more at 18, Rashford as well. There is numerous examples of players who got more minutes on the pitch at the same age. Especially when you consider the two players who tend to play all the minutes are not exactly world class. Particularly Willian who if he’s not standing over a dead ball within shooting range, I never have a real feeling is likely to score.

Sancho at the same age CHO is now made 13 appearances , Callum has already gazumped that.

5 minutes ago, Argo said:

Sancho at the same age CHO is now made 13 appearances , Callum has already gazumped that.

Not too fussed about player x, y, z - only really interested in OUR player and that we don't f**k things up.

But Sancho & CHO are BOTH 18. Looks like this season Sancho has played about 33 games and a lot of those he has started in so how are CHO figures gazumping that?

36 minutes ago, Nibs said:

Not too fussed about player x, y, z - only really interested in OUR player and that we don't f**k things up.

But Sancho & CHO are BOTH 18. Looks like this season Sancho has played about 33 games and a lot of those he has started in so how are CHO figures gazumping that?

Because Sancho is a year older in academic terms so the fair comparison if there is going to be one is between Sancho's game time last season to CHO this.

Edited March 8, 20197 yr by Argo