18 minutes ago, didierforever said:

If we shift Willian to the center, who replaces willian on the wing? Moses? Pedro? Oscar? None are as good as willian. I think the first change that needs to be done is getting cesc back in the team in place of Oscar and adding a pinch of creativity to the team.

We'd have to buy someone good.

2 hours ago, Van Butsen said:

I must seriously be watching a different game, I think he is really valuable, willing to try different things in games and force the issue.

Was an ever present in the premiership winning team (which says something) and was arguably our best last season.

Have to agree, while he may not be the best player in the world in his position there are certainly a lot of other areas we need to strengthen before considering dropping Willian, who could easily be a prominent part of another title winning team.

Ivanovic, Oscar and to a lesser extent Matic for example are players who should be far closer to the door, I find the vitriol being directed at our reigning player of the year very confusing.

2 hours ago, Zeta Orionis said:

We'd have to buy someone good.

 

Or play Boga or Musonda, oh wait there youngsters silly me yeah we will have to buy someone.

16 minutes ago, jack_super_class said:

 

Or play Boga or Musonda, oh wait there youngsters silly me yeah we will have to buy someone.

DOn't think Boga is going to be good enough. Musonda i'm not sure about, he's got skill, but i'm not sure he's consistent enough yet. Though I've only seen bits here and there.

'Consistency' is an illusion at the best of times and should be largely irrelevant when talking about giving a youth player a chance. 

 

Musonda will never prove his consistency until he gets an extended run in the first team at Chelsea. It shouldn't be a criteria that we use to decide which players get a chance because no youth players ever demonstrate 'consistency'.

7 hours ago, SydneyChelsea said:

'Consistency' is an illusion at the best of times and should be largely irrelevant when talking about giving a youth player a chance. 

 

Musonda will never prove his consistency until he gets an extended run in the first team at Chelsea. It shouldn't be a criteria that we use to decide which players get a chance because no youth players ever demonstrate 'consistency'.

THIS. 

By the way is Hazard "consistent"? Is oscar? If we can invest 4 years (this is our 5th, right?) along with sacrificing world class player like KDB in someone as sh*te as Oscar, then musonda deserves a season too.

Awful start to the season from Willian. Hopefully Moses might get some starts ahead of him soon enough.

33 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Awful start to the season from Willian. Hopefully Moses might get some starts ahead of him soon enough.

Yep. Hes been shocking.

Hes been riding the coat tails of that 6 week purple patch last year where he banged in a few free kicks and seemed to stand apart from the rest of the team as their games completely collapsed. Since then he has been no better than mediocre. I think his poor form has been largely ignored and he seem to be getting a bit of a free pass for some reason. Whilst its not the critical area of the team that currently needs looking at , i think hes been shocking.

He's played 101 premier league games for Chelsea over the last few years and only managed to achieve 12 goals and 15 assists. That would be a good turn over for one season but over 101 games its shocking for a top team. That's a goal every 0.11 games and an assist every 0.14 games. 

8 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

He's played 101 premier league games for Chelsea over the last few years and only managed to achieve 12 goals and 15 assists. That would be a good turn over for one season but over 101 games its shocking for a top team. That's a goal every 0.11 games and an assist every 0.14 games. 

I wonder how many of them 12 goals have been in open play as well. Can remember 1 this season against Burnley, 1 last season against Palace and his first goal against Norwich - surely the rest can't all be free kicks?

I have been killed on other forums for suggesting Willian is just not good enough in attack. His output speaks for itself I guess.

7 minutes ago, JoseBlues said:

I have been killed on other forums for suggesting Willian is just not good enough in attack. His output speaks for itself I guess.

I've been saying from the very start he isn't good enough. A lot of people on here disagree because he runs a lot and scored a few free kicks when we were sh*t.

Willian´s output is not good enough but who will replace him?? Pedro, looked like pure sh*tE ever since he came over from Barcelona. He has really been shocking. Just awful.

Moses is ok but his role should be impact player coming into games during the 2nd half trying to beat tired defenders with his pace. That´s the role in which he is most effective.

Willian´s output is not good enough but who will replace him?? Pedro, looked like pure sh*tE ever since he came over from Barcelona. He has really been shocking. Just awful.
Moses is ok but his role should be impact player coming into games during the 2nd half trying to beat tired defenders with his pace. That´s the role in which he is most effective.

He is irreplaceable now because the board hasn't sanctioned anyou replacements. But he should not be a first teamer come Jan or June next year. We should still keep him as he has his uses in big games and is a very good backup.

his mother is in hospital with cancer.  

https://www.instagram.com/p/BKEpPVIg22n/

23 hours ago, bjd said:

Yep. Hes been shocking.

Hes been riding the coat tails of that 6 week purple patch last year where he banged in a few free kicks and seemed to stand apart from the rest of the team as their games completely collapsed. Since then he has been no better than mediocre. I think his poor form has been largely ignored and he seem to be getting a bit of a free pass for some reason. Whilst its not the critical area of the team that currently needs looking at , i think hes been shocking.

I usually always jumped to his defense, but he indeed has been shocking.

Only player who takes on the game consistently 

45 minutes ago, Van Butsen said:

Only player who takes on the game consistently 

............and fails.

 

 

55 minutes ago, Nibs said:

............and fails.

 

 

So are you suggesting he's not good enough for the premier league?  That his past performances mean nothing and that any attempt to break the game open and conjure a few attacks are fruitless and he will never be able to score or create a goal and that he should stop trying?

41 minutes ago, Van Butsen said:

So are you suggesting he's not good enough for the premier league?  That his past performances mean nothing and that any attempt to break the game open and conjure a few attacks are fruitless and he will never be able to score or create a goal and that he should stop trying?

 

I guess I measure it on whether he would get in better recent times Chelsea teams. To be honest, not many of the current Chelsea side would when you compare them to players like Gallas, Ashley Cole, Joe Cole, Essien, Lamps, Maka, Drogba etc. But Hazard (when he's fit and in form) probably would. Willian on the other hand, definitely wouldn't.

He has his good points but I just don't see the team benefiting. A lot of running about, lot of huff & puff, but little in the way of end result. We have players like Kante, Matic, Mikel etc to do unsung / unglamorous (but important) work - Willians job, yes, great he tracks back but he contributes nowhere near enough of a threat, and right now, I would prefer to see Moses start ahead of him.

  

8 minutes ago, Nibs said:

 

I guess I measure it on whether he would get in better recent times Chelsea teams. To be honest, not many of the current Chelsea side would when you compare them to players like Gallas, Ashley Cole, Joe Cole, Essien, Lamps, Maka, Drogba etc. But Hazard (when he's fit and in form) probably would. Willian on the other hand, definitely wouldn't.

He has his good points but I just don't see the team benefiting. A lot of running about, lot of huff & puff, but little in the way of end result. We have players like Kante, Matic, Mikel etc to do unsung / unglamorous (but important) work - Willians job, yes, great he tracks back but he contributes nowhere near enough of a threat, and right now, I would prefer to see Moses start ahead of him.

  

Very harsh to compare Willian to a team that arguable had 6 legends of the club playing for them at one time.  And yet he's still done well to win a european trophy and a title for the club.  I think if he had that caliber around him his contribution would be more noticed though.  

A lot of running, creating, huffing puffing for sure.  It's a shame players rarely get on the end of his balls or his dribbles.  He is huffing and puffing with no support.  I don't know what Matic's role is in the team at the moment?  What is it?  I don't mind unglamorous roles, I just don't see what his is at all.  And if you're describing Willian as huff and puff, does Kante differ much from that?  In the last two games he's barely laid a tackle and just done a lot of running around for mine, with absolutely zero impact when on the ball to go with that.

12 minutes ago, Van Butsen said:

Very harsh to compare Willian to a team that arguable had 6 legends of the club playing for them at one time.  And yet he's still done well to win a european trophy and a title for the club.  I think if he had that caliber around him his contribution would be more noticed though.  

A lot of running, creating, huffing puffing for sure.  It's a shame players rarely get on the end of his balls or his dribbles.  He is huffing and puffing with no support.  I don't know what Matic's role is in the team at the moment?  What is it?  I don't mind unglamorous roles, I just don't see what his is at all.  And if you're describing Willian as huff and puff, does Kante differ much from that?  In the last two games he's barely laid a tackle and just done a lot of running around for mine, with absolutely zero impact when on the ball to go with that.

He hasn't won a European trophy for Chelsea though?

 

You don't mind a lot of running in the middle of the pitch, not on the wing where you're supposed to be creating chances. There is a reason a player never gets on the end of the ball and that's because his balls aren't very good. 

Just now, RIP Mourinho said:

He hasn't won a European trophy for Chelsea though?

 

You don't mind a lot of running in the middle of the pitch, not on the wing where you're supposed to be creating chances. There is a reason a player never gets on the end of the ball and that's because his balls aren't very good. 

Did he not win the Europa league with us?  My mistake, it wasn't a major point in my argument anyway.

His balls are great and he gets in excellent position on the byline, not much he can do with one striker to aim for sometimes.

Willian puts in great balls, haha he gives Ivan a good run for his money.

I hope he can recapture his old form as i like him as a player.Also thoughts for his mother.