so this guy only plays when we are defending a lead, and hes not even defending.

 

well, maybe he makes it up with his 'great' positioning so he has a higher number of interceptions. oh wait, just checked, he doesnt.

 

i know, its the 'intangibles' he brings to the team. the stuff only the finest football minds can see, right?

 

Curtis Davies made more interceptions per game last season than John Terry and Gary Cahill put together.

 

I suppose according to you, any of the 'finest footballing minds' would be able to recognize that Curtis Davies is a superior defender to Terry and Cahill put together. In fact, if we're basing our evaluation entirely on WhoScored's statistics, we have no reason not to believe that Davies is better than Terry and Cahill because he beats them in every single defensive statistic. Is it just possible that there might be other explanations - that formation, style of play, role in the team might play a role in skewing statistics? On top of that there are things that you cannot measure without watching the game; you can't judge a team's shape, you can't judge a player's defensive positioning, quality of passing...

 

Being one of the 'finest footballing minds' wouldn't mean a great deal if acquiring a full understanding of football was as easy as reading numbers off a spreadsheet. (I think they call that the 'Villas-Boas school of football excellence') In fact, if it's that simple there's no real point in watching the games at all, maybe we can just run a simulator and that will be just as good.

 

Make fun of 'intangibles' all you want, there is more than one explanation to an unfavourable statistic, and there are things in football that you simply can't measure.

Curtis Davies made more interceptions per game last season than John Terry and Gary Cahill put together.

 

I suppose according to you, any of the 'finest footballing minds' would be able to recognize that Curtis Davies is a superior defender to Terry and Cahill put together. In fact, if we're basing our evaluation entirely on WhoScored's statistics, we have no reason not to believe that Davies is better than Terry and Cahill because he beats them in every single defensive statistic. Is it just possible that there might be other explanations - that formation, style of play, role in the team might play a role in skewing statistics? On top of that there are things that you cannot measure without watching the game; you can't judge a team's shape, you can't judge a player's defensive positioning, quality of passing...

 

Being one of the 'finest footballing minds' wouldn't mean a great deal if acquiring a full understanding of football was as easy as reading numbers off a spreadsheet. (I think they call that the 'Villas-Boas school of football excellence') In fact, if it's that simple there's no real point in watching the games at all, maybe we can just run a simulator and that will be just as good.

 

Make fun of 'intangibles' all you want, there is more than one explanation to an unfavourable statistic, and there are things in football that you simply can't measure.

 

 

 

good that you mentioned someone from a team like hull, who are supposed to defend a lot more than chelsea, therefore skewing the stats in his favour.

 

if you want to disregard players playing in a different formation/team/system, then just compare mikel to the rest of chelsea players. hes worse, both in defence and in attack, than every single one of our CMs

 

obviously i have to resort to stats, because we have polarizing opinions that are, of course, subjective. not to mention you were the one who brought up stats first

Edited July 30, 201411 yr by Lane

http://africanfootball.com/news/443812/EXCLUSIVE-Mikel-bags-British-passport-October

 

MIKEL BAGS BRITISH PASSPORT OCTOBER

Sounds like we can only sell him in the Premier League

Mikel barely played last season once Matic joined, and even a defender was preferred to place in Mikel's position ahead of him, I don't consider the Mikel debate one worth continuing when Jose has clearly considered him inadequate for the job.

good that you mentioned someone from a team like hull, who are supposed to defend a lot more than chelsea, therefore skewing the stats in his favour.

 

if you want to disregard players playing in a different formation/team/system, then just compare mikel to the rest of chelsea players. hes worse, both in defence and in attack, than every single one of our CMs

 

obviously i have to resort to stats, because we have polarizing opinions that are, of course, subjective

 

The problem is that until we build a positivist system which creates an objective measure of player quality, statistics are open to interpretation and are thus subjective too. Alex Bruce played for Hull too and has horrendous stats.

 

In my opinion it has more to do with the fact that most of Mikel's appearances last season were off the bench. The value they give for 'Interceptions per game' (for example) is going to be lowered by the fact that Mikel's 'game' generally only lasted about 30 minutes. The season before that Mikel only came off the bench three times, interestingly enough his defensive stats are better in every field, and are also better than Lampard/Ramires'.

The problem is that until we build a positivist system which creates an objective measure of player quality, statistics are open to interpretation and are thus subjective too. Alex Bruce played for Hull too and has horrendous stats.

 

In my opinion it has more to do with the fact that most of Mikel's appearances last season were off the bench. The value they give for 'Interceptions per game' (for example) is going to be lowered by the fact that Mikel's 'game' generally only lasted about 30 minutes. The season before that Mikel only came off the bench three times, interestingly enough his defensive stats are better in every field, and are also better than Lampard/Ramires'.

 

well theres a good reason why most of mikels appearances were off the bench

 

and his defensive stats in 2012/13 arent better than rami's, at least according to whoscored

I tire for some kind argument. The thing dey tire me anyhow. My people e don do abeg. :D

I tire for some kind argument. The thing dey tire me anyhow. My people e don do abeg. :D

What?

I tire for some kind argument. The thing dey tire me anyhow. My people e don do abeg. :D

Que?

Sums up the entire debate for me.

Mikel to me, could still be used especially if Chelsea leads in the game. His defensive skills might be questioned sometimes though. I am not sure if he's being offered around.

I think this like the Torres saga will be down to no one willing to pay him anywhere near his current wage packet.

Can't see him getting much game time this season again and would rather see MVG get the game time when it came along rather than Mikel who never improves but just seems to stay 'average' for what feels like a lifetime.

Is use Mikel over Romeu tbh he is very good when we're shutting up shop

Mikel to me, could still be used especially if Chelsea leads in the game. His defensive skills might be questioned sometimes though. I am not sure if he's being offered around.

 

Stim,

Nothing to worry about, I still like your pun job.

I hope with Romeu's contract extension that he gets an opportunity to stake a place ahead of Mikel, he had a very promising start before his injuries.

                 You mean he is not playing with a injury now? surely not.

 

Stim,

Have you not read about him?

Why do you always answer a question with another question. 

mbh,

Why do you worry about it?

I tire for some kind argument. The thing dey tire me anyhow. My people e don do abeg. :D

Translation required, thanks.

Translation required, thanks.

 

He's too tired to argue. The thing tires him. His people e don do abeg.  :D

Sagey,

Me worry, your a larf a minute, not.

mbh,

You are a hoot.

I tire for some kind argument. The thing dey tire me anyhow. My people e don do abeg. :D

 

 

Sorry, had to be used! I had the urge in my loins 

^ It is English, just Creole English. Presumably the poster is from Nigeria (perhaps a new incarnation of Normal9ja?) and is frustrated at the level of debate which tends to surround Mikel. The last sentence is a plea: I'm pretty sure 'e don do abeg' means 'it is enough please'. (please forgive me if I am wrong about any of that)

 

Personally I think the debate has been pretty reasonable of late, but as I recall the poster (if my assumption regarding his previous identity is correct) got offended by some unreasonable barbs thrown pretty relentlessly towards Mikel. For what it's worth I thought he was a very good poster.

 

 

I tire for some kind argument. The thing dey tire me anyhow. My people e don do abeg.

 

 

 

The official site recently published an interview with Mikel, in which it points out that he is now our third-longest serving player behind JT and Cech. Nothing particularly unexpected, but it reaffirms his commitment to the club as well as his position as a proud club servant who can be counted upon to serve reliably: http://www.chelseafc.com/news/latest-news/2014/08/mikel--with-experience-comes-responsibility.html

 

 

 

On going into his ninth season at Chelsea and potential new responsibilities as a Chelsea veteran:

 

"I’ve been in this team for a long time now, I came when I was 18 and I’m 27 now. Time flies.

I’ve seen the good times and I’ve enjoyed the good times with this team. At the same time I’ve shared bad times with the likes of John Terry and Petr Cech. There have been lots of good times in the nine years I’ve been here. Whenever there was a bad one we’ve always come together as a team and we’ve always managed to turn it around.

The character and the belief that we have in this team, from the players that have been here a long time, I’m sure that will transform into the new players. It’s always a big pressure playing for this club. You always expect to win trophies every year so I’m sure the new players that have come in will help us win more trophies.

They will know what representing this team is all about. Wearing the blue shirt and representing Chelsea is a privilege. I’m sure they will learn from us and we will be able to teach them one or two things."

 

On the return of Didier Drogba:

‘I heard the rumours but I thought there was no way it was going to happen. I thought when he’s gone, he’s gone. But then I thought about it a bit more and I realised it could happen because of the connection that the gaffer and Didier have always had.

I’m glad to have him back. It’s like his home. He’s fitting in perfectly well again. It’s like he never went away. It’s good for the team because he’s a big player and a big personality.

It’s a shame we lost Frank and Ash - two big personalities and two big players – but Didier is back. I think we need a bit of his personality and his physicality in the Premier League, too. He can offer that. He stills gets respect from everybody in the dressing room: the older guys, the younger players, everybody. We are all glad to have him back.’
 

 

On the new season:

‘It’s been five or six days now I’ve been training. I’m getting back up to speed. Training is going very well. It’s been tough but you need this to have a good pre-season, and then we can look forward to the season.

Hopefully it will be a very successful one for the team. Everyone wants to achieve something. We want to win trophies. We didn’t do that last season but this season we are all hoping we can have a good season and win some trophies.’

 

 

 

 

WAGNH quite helpfully pointed out that Mikel is now our equal 29th-highest all-time appearance maker. That is on par with Micky Droy and one more than both Zola and Le Saux - nothing to be sniffed at!

Every time this thread is bumped I can't help but hope it's because we've accepted an offer for him. It's never going to happen though.

 

Obi-Wan!