Just now, big blue said:

 

The reason I brought up Lampard is because you are saying Tuchel is treating 3 players worse than Lampard did when I dont think that is the case at all, 

No I didn't, I never once mentioned lampard. I was saying the way he is treating our young local academy graduates compared to the other players is completely different and unfair.

Today was probably a one off, I'm generally not too worried about our defence. The place to improve on for the past season and a half has been the attack. I don't know if there will be any signifcant improvements until he has a pre season though..

1 minute ago, big blue said:

Wish i could. Wish i could tell the players that aswell. 

Although I was being pithy, I do think you have a point and it's a worry. We didn't have anyone in the first half that was willing to battle with West brom, we were so lackadaisical and blasé almost as if we felt we just had to rock up and we would win. Even our best team under Jose didn't have that attitude, they always outworking and outfought any team.

4 minutes ago, dkw said:

No I didn't, I never once mentioned lampard. I was saying the way he is treating our young local academy graduates compared to the other players is completely different and unfair.

The problem is that you sound a bit silly in general when you realize Mount, James and CHO who you use as one of your examples are three of the players Tuchel have used more then anyone else so far:

So how the hell is he treating the graduates unfair and differently? If anything he use them more then anyone else.

Edited April 3, 20215 yr by Sindre

5 minutes ago, dkw said:

Although I was being pithy, I do think you have a point and it's a worry. We didn't have anyone in the first half that was willing to battle with West brom, we were so lackadaisical and blasé almost as if we felt we just had to rock up and we would win. Even our best team under Jose didn't have that attitude, they always outworking and outfought any team.

I think that has been an issue for a long time. Im just hoping this a kick up the arse thats needed. I agree some of the performances going forward have been woeful, but on the balance of things, Tuchel coming in mid season, with none of his own players, I think the good is massively outweighing the bad, and im pretty optimistic for the end of the season, and especially next season. 

What we dont want is for this to be the start of a bad run, like we are all too well accustomed to here.

9 minutes ago, Sindre said:

The problem is that you sound a bit silly in general when you realize Mount, James and CHO who you use as one of your examples are three of the players Tuchel have used more then anyone else so far:

So how the hell is he treating the graduates unfair and differently? If anything he use them more then anyone else.

Sad to see that the 5 players he used the most have in total 5 goals and 2 assists.

56 minutes ago, big blue said:

City, Liverpool, United didnt beat them with 11.

Man City beat then 5-0, Utd 1-0 and none of those teams got spanked by a championship quality team. 1 point against West Brom and 8 goals conceded, not sure many teams will have that bad of a record against WB.

1 minute ago, Ernie_blue said:

Man City beat then 5-0, Utd 1-0 and none of those teams got spanked by a championship quality team. 1 point against West Brom and 8 goals conceded, not sure many teams will have that bad of a record against WB.

United lost at home to the one team that's below WBA and that was with 11.

31 minutes ago, Sindre said:

The problem is that you sound a bit silly in general when you realize Mount, James and CHO who you use as one of your examples are three of the players Tuchel have used more then anyone else so far:

So how the hell is he treating the graduates unfair and differently? If anything he use them more then anyone else.

The way CHO was treated with being subbed was pretty awful tbh.

Just now, Ernie_blue said:

The way CHO was treated with being subbed was pretty awful tbh.

Sure, and then he started the biggest game of the season three days later.

Why focus on the one instance Tuchel was harsh and disregard when he trusted him in massive games after?

1 minute ago, Argo said:

United lost at home to the one team that's below WBA and that was with 11.

Chelsea got spanked by the second to bottom team and played sh*t against most others.

Just now, Sindre said:

Sure, and then he started the biggest game of the season three days later.

Why focus on the one instance Tuchel was harsh and disregard when he trusted him in massive games after?

Im not disregarding nothing, just that one incident was pretty awful and bad management, plus his in and out the team like a yo-yo.

1 hour ago, Sindre said:

He was fit since mid November. Played 90 minutes against Krasnodar in early December and after that he didn't start again until Morecambe and then Luton in Lampard's last game.

So let's not use Gilmour as a stick to beat Tuchel with as well shall we. If anything Gilmour should have performed far better then he did against Barnsley and Sheffield United. Who knows how much he might have played if he did but he didn't perform and looked like the youngster he is in both games. So Tuchel's decision in regards to that have been sensible in every sense.

 

No, he had a big injury and Lampard was managing his coming back. He couldn't have rushed him back. Now, he was our best player against Barnsley, with one assistst and what should have been an assist for Tammy's penalty. He did better than most players. And against Sheffield Utd he did well, especially in the first half. He had great pass ranges and he did not as bad as Jorginho today. I would not say he is our worst option in midfield, and he would not have certainly be worse than Jorginho today. Not a stick to hit Tuchel with, but certainly he is a good option Tuchel is underplaying, especially after the first half sh*t show.

59 minutes ago, jack_super_class said:

Didn't realise we drawn so many.

That we haven't been losing games has disguised how little we've been winning. 

The cup games have helped cover up our generally average form in the league under Tuchel as well. 

If you look purely at our league form we've drawn to Wolves, Southampton, Manchester United, Leeds and lost to WBA with wins in the other 6 games. 

So we're almost as likely to drop points under Tuchel as we are to win but when you look at the nature of the wins we've been very reliant on penalties to get results. 

Spurs and Sheffield United needed a penalty to win. Southampton a penalty salvaged a draw. Everton an own goal and a penalty. 

We've been really poor at winning games by our own creation under Tuchel and I think his constant rotation has played a part in that. 

1 hour ago, Sindre said:

Neither did we under Lampard funnily enough...

 

Are you comparing our first leg when we came back from 3 down playing great entertaining football (and we could have beaten them given the 5 minutes injury time given today) with the sh*t show served today? Because you're way off with the comparison.

1 hour ago, Argo said:

Yeah Lampard nearly let CHO walk to Bayern, didn't give Lamptey any chances so he walked (could/should have started every single game Lampard went with wingbacks and got chances when Reece was injured) and has likely lost us Tomori. He also dropped Gilmour after his two MOTM displays Vs the scousers to shoehorn an out of sorts Kante back in. He also never gave Cumming a chance despite Kepa and Willy looking like ametuers. 

I mean don't get me wrong Lampard's policy all in all with the young players was great but if every little decision he made with them got micromanaged like is happening with TT he'd have been getting critisised very regularly.

Lamptey wanted to play and he left because he was never going to be playing in front of James.

I still think TT is a top baller, not to mention the current manager of the month. After finally losing a league match for the first time since November 2019 its time to start a new record with the boys in blue.

I'm hoping he will let the attackers a bit more loose now that the defensive game plan has been beaten finally. Nothing to say we can't stick with a defensive structure but our lack of attacking edge has been there for us all to see for the whole tenure.

We haven't scored more than 2 goals and for a coach known for attractive attacking football I can only imagine he has some sort of system in mind to get more attacking output.

1 minute ago, RMH said:

Lamptey wanted to play and he left because he was never going to be playing in front of James.

He could have got chances when James was injured at the start, he should have then been rewarded for his performance at Arsenal with at the very least a start in the next game, he should have started every game we went 3atb especially the ones Azpi played there.

There was a good 20 appearances in it for him last season given the regular use of 3atb RJ's early season injury (and loss of form after the restart) and Azpi often needed on the left.

Long term is a different matter but if he was here now and TT preferred even Azpi at wingback he'd get slaughtered.

TBH Tuchel, despite the rotation, will have his favourite players like any other manager. Jorginho and Rudiger appear to be two, Silva too when he is fit. 

DKW has a valid point on today's game IMO. I don't think many people would believe that if CHO, Gilmour, Anjorin or any other young player had performed like Jorginho did today, they would have stayed on the pitch for 73 minutes.

1 hour ago, dkw said:

Tell Tuchel that.

You definitely have an agenda against Tuchel like you cant wait for him to fail to prove that there was no point sacking Lampard. I've noticed this from your comments ever since he was appointed. 

And some of you have an agenda defending anything Tuchel does just to prove that sacking Lampard was the right thing.

Maybe, just maybe, Lampard was doing as much as it could be done with this team and sacking him was not the right thing to do. Just like sacking Tuchel after this string of draws and loses against mid-low table teams would not be fair.

Now is the time to change to 4 at the back, And play James wide right, he oozes class, delivers great crosses and balls into players as fit as a fiddle strong and pacy, without the Burden of being that wingback i think he'll thrive.

Spend what it takes for some midfield creativity, i'd rather we spent money on Grealish maybe, than Haaland, atm, or do we believe we create enough, but Werner in the PL is dogsh*te?

Well WHAT a wake up call that was for TT. Got totally outdone by Big Sam and his very average WBA side.

I have been full of praise for TT since he took over from SFL. He seemed to have that golden touch in whatever he did and whatever team he selected, came up trumps. But boy how that came crashing down today. That is as embarrassing a result as we have suffered in a long time. He got it wrong today and what's more disappointing was the game management and subs. Down to 10 men yes, but sorry, you don't get humiliated by a side as sh*t as WBA.

But we move on. Draw a line under that and it's what TT learns from today and how he gets the team to react. Not the end of the world but he'll know more than anyone that he can't afford too many sh*t-shows like today as he'll just join that very long list of EX Chelsea managers. 

3 minutes ago, RMH said:

And some of you have an agenda defending anything Tuchel does just to prove that sacking Lampard was the right thing..

As that was clearly aimed at me here we go.

The only reason I brought up Lampard up was to point out the double standards regarding the youth thing, Tuchel is literally getting battered for anything that could even be slightly regarded as not pro the youth while Lampard froze Tomori (who was probably the main reason he got the Chelsea job in the first place) out for an entire year and received little to no criticism for it and still isn't despite the early signs showing he could be another KDB/Salah level error.

For the record i sympathise with him a bit with that one, while I didn't want him totally frozen out he wasn't nearly as good as he's showing now at Milan but the point I'm making is TT does the same to an academy player and the reasonable best case scenario is he's chased out of London with a gun.

Just now, Nibs said:

Well WHAT a wake up call that was for TT. Got totally outdone by Big Sam and his very average WBA side.

I have been full of praise for TT since he took over from SFL. He seemed to have that golden touch in whatever he did and whatever team he selected, came up trumps. But boy how that came crashing down today. That is as embarrassing a result as we have suffered in a long time. He got it wrong today and what's more disappointing was the game management and subs. Down to 10 men yes, but sorry, you don't get humiliated by a side as sh*t as WBA.

But we move on. Draw a line under that and it's what TT learns from today and how he gets the team to react. Not the end of the world but he'll know more than anyone that he can't afford too many sh*t-shows like today as he'll just join that very long list of EX Chelsea managers. 

He just needs to understand that in the Prem, going down to 10-man is one thing but you don't pull out your attackers