1 hour ago, Argo said:

Jermaine Beckford and Akinfenwa haven't had the chance to play for Chelsea, maybe they are good enough? 

Messi hasn't had a chance to play for Chelsea either, he must be sh*te too. 

Constructive argument, this.

Absolutely baffling to think that one might have different expectations for different individuals.

1 hour ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Messi hasn't had a chance to play for Chelsea either, he must be sh*te too. 

I’ve only ever watched him play against Chelsea. Never scored once. Spent most of his time trying to get out of Ashley Cole’s pocket. Tosh. 

14 minutes ago, Munkworth said:

I’ve only ever watched him play against Chelsea. Never scored once. Spent most of his time trying to get out of Ashley Cole’s pocket. Tosh. 

He's just a Youtube player, mate. 

On 2/6/2018 at 00:18, startedwithglenn said:

I think Hazard is overrated quite a bit by Chelsea fans and even outside of the club by other fans and pundits.

He still frustrates me at times, but blimey, he is without doubt, one of the best natural footballers to ever to pull on a Chelsea shirt. He is capable of things others players can only dream about and when he doesn't play, you realise how average some of our players actually are.

 

7 minutes ago, Nibs said:

He still frustrates me at times, but blimey, he is without doubt, one of the best natural footballers to ever to pull on a Chelsea shirt. He is capable of things others players can only dream about and when he doesn't play, you realise how average some of our players actually are.

Think that's a bit unfair on our other players. Hazard is just that good he can make some of the best players look average.

This relates to most English football clubs.

 

I find it a disgrace the way James McClean is treated by the crowds, booing him at every touch or even throwing stuff at him, I agree with the poppy stance but I think he goes a bit far with how he behaves in the national anthem.

 

It reminds me of the England Spain game in 2005. These clubs are always going on about how they are against all forms of abuse but this is completely ignored.

 

I try to imagine a reverse scenario, lets say Irish Gaelic Football teams wore an Easter lily to commemorate the republican dead, imagine if an English player in the London team (they do exist) refused to wear one I doubt many Irish fans would care, we would hardly expect an Englishman to wear one given that there have been bombs in London in the past. Wearing a poppy does show support for the British Army in all decades, it may officially represent the World Wars but in general society it represents the British Army in the 1970s and 80s too.

Edited February 8, 20188 yr by LiamNeeson

11 minutes ago, LiamNeeson said:

. Wearing a poppy does show support for the British Army in all decades

No it doesn't, its absolutely nothing of the sort. 

1 minute ago, dkw said:

No it doesn't, its absolutely nothing of the sort. 

It does, the money still goes to the Royal British Legion.

 

Regarding WW1 soldiers, I have relatives who were in WW1 too but I wouldn't wear one, many of the Black and Tans who were in Ireland in the 1920s also fought in WW1, these are men who are legendary in Ireland for their viciousness.

Nope. 

5 minutes ago, dkw said:

Nope. 

You can't disagree with my point that wearing one is still commemorating men who terrorized Irish communities between 1919-1922, wearing a poppy still technically commemorates WW1 soldiers who were Black and Tans a few years later. They fought alongside Irishmen in WW1 then went and abused the families of the Irish WW1 dead.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_and_Tans

 

THE STORY OF THE POPPY
The inspiration behind the poppy as a symbol of Remembrance.

In the spring of 1915, shortly after losing a friend in Ypres, a Canadian doctor, Lieutenant Colonel John McCrae was inspired by the sight of poppies growing in battle-scarred fields to write a now famous poem called 'In Flanders Fields'. After the First World War, the poppy was adopted as a symbol of Remembrance.

HISTORY OF THE POPPY
During the First World War (1914–1918) much of the fighting took place in Western Europe. Previously beautiful countryside was blasted, bombed and fought over, again and again. The landscape swiftly turned to fields of mud: bleak and barren scenes where little or nothing could grow.

Bright red Flanders poppies (Papaver rhoeas) however, were delicate but resilient flowers and grew in their thousands, flourishing even in the middle of chaos and destruction. In early May 1915, shortly after losing a friend in Ypres, a Canadian doctor, Lt Col John McCrae was inspired by the sight of poppies to write a now famous poem called 'In Flanders Fields'.

McCrae’s poem inspired an American academic, Moina Michael, to make and sell red silk poppies which were brought to England by a French woman, Anna Guérin. The (Royal) British Legion, formed in 1921, ordered 9 million of these poppies and sold them on 11 November that year. The poppies sold out almost immediately and that first ever 'Poppy Appeal' raised over £106,000; a considerable amount of money at the time. This was used to help WW1 veterans with employment and housing.

The following year, Major George Howson set up the Poppy Factory to employ disabled ex-Servicemen. Today, the factory and the Legion's warehouse in Aylesford produces millions of poppies each year.

The demand for poppies in England was so high that few were reaching Scotland. Earl Haig's wife established the 'Lady Haig Poppy Factory' in Edinburgh in 1926 to produce poppies exclusively for Scotland. Over 5 million Scottish poppies (which have four petals and no leaf unlike poppies in the rest of the UK) are still made by hand by disabled ex-Servicemen at Lady Haig's Poppy Factory each year and distributed by our sister charity Poppyscotland.

THE POEM
IN FLANDERS FIELDS

In Flanders' fields the poppies blow
Between the crosses, row on row,
That mark our place: and in the sky
The larks, still bravely singing, fly
Scarce heard amid the guns below.

We are the dead. Short days ago
We lived, felt dawn, saw sunset glow,
Loved and were loved, and now we lie
In Flanders' fields.

Take up our quarrel with the foe;
To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high,
If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow  
In Flanders' Fields.

The poppy is

A symbol of Remembrance and hope
Worn by millions of people
Red because of the natural colour of field poppies

The poppy is NOT

- A symbol of death or a sign of support for war
- A reflection of politics or religion
- Red to reflect the colour of blood
- Wearing a poppy is a personal choice and reflects individual and personal memories. It is not compulsory but is greatly appreciated by those it helps – our beneficiaries: those currently serving in our Armed Forces, veterans, and their families and dependants.

 

a poppy in my opinion is for all those men who died in that horror story of the 1st war world. Our lives today are gravy compared to what those poor men went through and how this has become political is beyond me. very sad

1 hour ago, LiamNeeson said:

It does, the money still goes to the Royal British Legion.

 

Regarding WW1 soldiers, I have relatives who were in WW1 too but I wouldn't wear one, many of the Black and Tans who were in Ireland in the 1920s also fought in WW1, these are men who are legendary in Ireland for their viciousness.

Think you've got a bit of an agenda mate this is a Chelsea forum no need for political statements.

1 hour ago, LiamNeeson said:

This relates to most English football clubs.

 

I find it a disgrace the way James McClean is treated by the crowds, booing him at every touch or even throwing stuff at him, I agree with the poppy stance but I think he goes a bit far with how he behaves in the national anthem.

 

It reminds me of the England Spain game in 2005. These clubs are always going on about how they are against all forms of abuse but this is completely ignored.

 

I try to imagine a reverse scenario, lets say Irish Gaelic Football teams wore an Easter lily to commemorate the republican dead, imagine if an English player in the London team (they do exist) refused to wear one I doubt many Irish fans would care, we would hardly expect an Englishman to wear one given that there have been bombs in London in the past. Wearing a poppy does show support for the British Army in all decades, it may officially represent the World Wars but in general society it represents the British Army in the 1970s and 80s too.

You're 'disgraced' that he's being ostracised for his beliefs, are you disgraced that he's earning a good living, in a country that is free because of those people we like to remember when wearing the poppy ? 

 

9 minutes ago, coco said:

You're 'disgraced' that he's being ostracised for his beliefs, are you disgraced that he's earning a good living, in a country that is free because of those people we like to remember when wearing the poppy ? 

 

You have to do a bit of digging to find his personal reasons, but they are their and Valid

On 2/5/2018 at 04:24, Slojo said:

I heard some bad stories about JT in his younger days in London from doormen, he was a right handful apparently, throwing money in their faces when pissed thinking he's untouchable. Not sure how true it is though but I can't say I've always respected him highly as a person, as a player, however, he's a f**king legend. 

i'd heard that too, and wasn't there an incident with a cabbie?  However, he put that behind him and got on with being a captain.  An Arsenal bloke I used to work with said he reminded him of Adamsl poor attitude when young but became a great leader.  I think from there that's maybe why Terry got so involved in the youth team.

28 minutes ago, mad_mac said:

i'd heard that too, and wasn't there an incident with a cabbie?  However, he put that behind him and got on with being a captain.  An Arsenal bloke I used to work with said he reminded him of Adamsl poor attitude when young but became a great leader.  I think from there that's maybe why Terry got so involved in the youth team.

Cabbie= Dennis Wise

2 minutes ago, Coral Snake said:

Cabbie= Dennis Wise

ah, yes.  Thanks.  Terry was club bouncers, right?

15 minutes ago, mad_mac said:

ah, yes.  Thanks.  Terry was club bouncers, right?

found not guilty

Still paid a heavy price  

Terry was suspended from England duty and subsequently missed out on the 2002 World Cup. He and team-mate Jody Morris had been out celebrating the birth of Morris’ first child.

Terry was cleared of all charges.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/picturegalleries/9228389/John-Terrys-on-and-off-field-controversies-in-pictures.html?frame=2203778

Edited February 8, 20188 yr by Coral Snake

1 hour ago, Coral Snake said:

found not guilty

Still paid a heavy price  

Terry was suspended from England duty and subsequently missed out on the 2002 World Cup. He and team-mate Jody Morris had been out celebrating the birth of Morris’ first child.

Terry was cleared of all charges.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/picturegalleries/9228389/John-Terrys-on-and-off-field-controversies-in-pictures.html?frame=2203778

yes i remember now, it tarnished his rep though, and eventually I'm glad Terry told the English FA to stick it.

12 hours ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Messi hasn't had a chance to play for Chelsea either, he must be sh*te too. 

No it would be quite evident he would have been good enough, the point is i won't need to see him in Chelsea first team action numerous times on the spin to work it out ( just like i don't need to see Dabo play for the first team to know he isn't good enough, for example).

15 hours ago, Stim said:

The overwhelming consensus was that AC was ready because he had first team experience in germany and the CL with good performances everyone actually watched. As opposed to other youth players who don't shine in the championship but get touted to be better than half the first team.

I barely saw anyone who would have been happy buying VVD over him. a Chelsea fan NOT saying youth player x is better? pull the other one

I dont know if it was the VVD transfer thread or maybe the AC thread itself, but people like me (who had the opinion that AC would come good and we dont need VVD), were ridiculed no end. Which most of the times ended up with the debate of foreign supporters having no real knowledge of football and our unreal infatuation with youth players.

I would say a small faction had the opinion that AC would be a great addition, but it definitely was not an "overwhelming consensus".

7 hours ago, Argo said:

No it would be quite evident he would have been good enough, the point is i won't need to see him in Chelsea first team action numerous times on the spin to work it out ( just like i don't need to see Dabo play for the first team to know he isn't good enough, for example).

Both arguments are as daft as eachother. You can't argue someone isn't good enough until they've had an extended run in the team. I don't want to point out the obvious ones like KdB who was given 10 minute cameos then discarded when his talent was obvious from a teenager. Look further afield like Rashford. At youth level he was nothing special for Utd. An injury crisis and an extended run of games with proper minutes under his belt and he gets an international callup and is one of the most promising youngsters in the gane. Same with RLC, goes on loan and gets PROPER game time and he's there getting MOTM awards for the England team. 

12 hours ago, LiamNeeson said:

This relates to most English football clubs.

 

I find it a disgrace the way James McClean is treated by the crowds, booing him at every touch or even throwing stuff at him, I agree with the poppy stance but I think he goes a bit far with how he behaves in the national anthem.

 

It reminds me of the England Spain game in 2005. These clubs are always going on about how they are against all forms of abuse but this is completely ignored.

 

I try to imagine a reverse scenario, lets say Irish Gaelic Football teams wore an Easter lily to commemorate the republican dead, imagine if an English player in the London team (they do exist) refused to wear one I doubt many Irish fans would care, we would hardly expect an Englishman to wear one given that there have been bombs in London in the past. Wearing a poppy does show support for the British Army in all decades, it may officially represent the World Wars but in general society it represents the British Army in the 1970s and 80s too.

I think you win the 'most unpopular opinion award' here.