1 minute ago, nonotnowjim said:

Honestly surprised that you think he was our best player today. One of the worst for me, due to the number of times he stifled our attacks and dallied on the ball over and over again, which let Leeds get in shape. This more often than not ended up with kante  choosing the lazy/easy 5yd sideways or backwards pass. 
 

Very frustrating performance . Even my 9 yr old lad was shouting "pass it forward!" at the tv, directed at kante. 

But that’s because Kante was doing his role, shutting down and recovering the ball, and Jorginho’s, getting the ball ticking and forward. We all know the limitations of Kante, but he was the only midfielder today and he did his role superbly and Jorginho’s not that well because he’s not that skilled.

1 minute ago, nonotnowjim said:

Very frustrating performance . Even my 9 yr old lad was shouting "pass it forward!" at the tv, directed at kante. 

That's a coincidence. My missus shouts the exact same thing at Jorginho every game. Except she puts a "twat" on the end of it.

OK I'll bite Jim. But first you tell me how Jorginho was better than Kante today? Give me a few examples to run with.

2 minutes ago, just said:

That's a coincidence. My missus shouts the exact same thing at Jorginho every game. Except she puts a "twat" on the end of it.

OK I'll bite Jim. But first you tell me how Jorginho was better than Kante today? Give me a few examples to run with.

This isn't a Jorginho vs kante thing. 

If Jorginho would have been as wasteful with the ball today, and as slow to make decisions on it, then I would also be calling him out.  But he wasn't. 

In the system today, jorgi was the one sitting deeper, and kante was the one with the role to drive forward and create, or get it others in advanced positions to create. He failed with that.

Leeds let him do the first bit well, that is getting on the ball and driving forward. But having done so, he was far to slow to spot the runs and pick a pass. Instead  holding up play which allowed Leeds to regroup and reshape - by which point the chance is gone.

He then resorts to the safe sideways and backwards passing that he is comfortable with. 

1 minute ago, RMH said:

But that’s because Kante was doing his role, shutting down and recovering the ball, and Jorginho’s, getting the ball ticking and forward. We all know the limitations of Kante, but he was the only midfielder today and he did his role superbly and Jorginho’s not that well because he’s not that skilled.

Kante did his role because he had someone at the base of the midfield that allowed him to roam and win back some possession further up the pitch but you could put a bet on him being on the bench while Kovacic would have been playing with Jorginho if not for the Atletico game coming up. So any best possible combination you're having Jorginho at the base of the midfield.

If you think that this game means that Jorginho isn't skilled then I guess the same can be said for Mount and Pulisic and both of them were subbed off after not being able to do much in the final third against a team that doesn't care about having clean sheets at all.

8 minutes ago, RMH said:

But that’s because Kante was doing his role, shutting down and recovering the ball, and Jorginho’s, getting the ball ticking and forward. We all know the limitations of Kante, but he was the only midfielder today and he did his role superbly and Jorginho’s not that well because he’s not that skilled.

I don't agree that his role, in this system, is simply shutting down and recovering the ball. This was seen by the number of times he had possession with it moving forward. He was simply too slow in his decision making to be effective.  

Thought some of the football we played in the first 30 minutes was excellent. Great passing and movement and unlucky not to score. But boy are we lacking a player who has the knack of scoring, or at least making the keeper work. 

Disappointed with 1 point but on another day we might have come away with 0. Couple of decent saves from Mendy and he was good today but anyone else sh*tting themselves whenever he has the ball at his feet? Always seems to feel he has more time than he actually has and always takes one too many touches. Don't get me wrong, MASSIVE upgrade on Kepa but I just know one week he is gonna get mugged and the opposition will score.

17 minutes ago, just said:

I don't need to. I will see the same as I did before. Kante was involved in everything. Winning the ball, running with the ball, supporting attacks, helping the defence, simply our best outfield player. In contrast you would not have known Jorginho was out there. Complete ghost today. Apparently, according to you, because he was closed down. Really? That's why? Well you have made the point for me, why play someone who can be completely nullified so easily. And if you want to talk about passing, which allegedly is Jorginho's greatest asset, what passing did we see today? Oh, I forgot we couldn't see it because they closed him down? Not his fault. Give me a break.

I’m not sure where you’ve got the idea that I’ve made this out to be a Kante vs Jorginho thought. My point is, offensively, Jorginho was completely nullified which left space for Kante, with which he did nothing. Involved in everything? Come on man, there was nothing to be involved in with that pitiful attacking display.

I would agree that he was his normal disruptive self in supporting the defense. Not sure why you’ve become so combative here, but there’s plenty of others who would agree that Kante is left to be on the ball by the opposition and it’s a solid strategy on their part.

16 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

Honestly surprised that you think he was our best player today. One of the worst for me, due to the number of times he stifled our attacks and dallied on the ball over and over again, which let Leeds get in shape. This more often than not ended up with kante  choosing the lazy/easy 5yd sideways or backwards pass. 
 

Very frustrating performance . Even my 9 yr old lad was shouting "pass it forward!" at the tv, directed at kante. 

I think it’s harsh to say he was one of our worst players, there were plenty who played worse than him, but I agree that he stifled many attacks.

20 minutes ago, RMH said:

But that’s the whole thing with Jorginho, they put a man on him and he’s just incapable of doing anything and he doesn’t even try to get into spaces or dribble his man. You out Kova there and he still drives the ball forward dribbling and getting rid of his marker.

As I stated to just, I’m not sure where you and he have gotten this idea that I’m advocating for Jorginho or something. My point is, Leeds completely and easily nullified anything Jorginho tried to do, which left Kante freed up in central areas, and with that, he didn’t do anything. Which, in my opinion, is what Leeds was planning for.

16 minutes ago, just said:

That's a coincidence. My missus shouts the exact same thing at Jorginho every game. Except she puts a "twat" on the end of it.

OK I'll bite Jim. But first you tell me how Jorginho was better than Kante today? Give me a few examples to run with.

Again with the Jorginho vs Kante, where the f**k have you gotten this from?

3 minutes ago, mwblue10 said:

I’m not sure where you’ve got the idea that I’ve made this out to be a Kante vs Jorginho thought. My point is, offensively, Jorginho was completely nullified which left space for Kante, with which he did nothing. Involved in everything? Come on man, there was nothing to be involved in with that pitiful attacking display.

I would agree that he was his normal disruptive self in supporting the defense. Not sure why you’ve become so combative here, but there’s plenty of others who would agree that Kante is left to be on the ball by the opposition and it’s a solid strategy on their part.

The alternative view is, and the one I had from watching the game, is that Kante got the ball forward alright, often by winning it in the first place, but none of our strikers did a lot with it. 

I have just looked up the match stats to make sure I wasn't imaging things.  Kante had one shot, 3 key passes, 5 dribbles, was fouled once and had 3 mis-controls. His pass completion rate was 87.2%, Defensively 3 tackles, 4 clearances, 2 interceptions and 1 blocked shot. He also had the highest out-field player rating at 8.2. So do you accept that he can't have been that bad?

2 hours ago, coco said:

You missed one good moment, Leeds player clears the ball on edge of their box, hits it straight into another Leeds player and the ball loops back over their keeper who is just planted on the spot, ball hits the crossbar and lands in the keepers arms without him moving from that spot.

damn - wish I'd seen that, I'll have to watch MOTD now 

2 minutes ago, carrickblue said:

damn - wish I'd seen that, I'll have to watch MOTD now 

i guarantee it will be shown, or else they would struggle for footage.

Since when is it up to Kanté to be our creative player ? we ditch the back 3 to put an extra attacker and yet some are blaming Kanté for us not creating chances. We had Havertz, Pulisic, Mount and Ziyech up front, its up to them to create chances and Kanté to break up the counter attacks. I thought our left side was  awful with Mount and Chilwell yet no one mentions it ? Pulisic put some good crosses at the start of the game and yet stopped doing it after 30 minutes and it seemed that the game went to fast for Havertz and Ziyech, we need to see more from them.

Like someone said earlier the game Atleti was definitely in the back of Tuchel's mind and maybe the players as well. Leeds might concede a lot of goals but they are still a good team that wants to play and they are more used to their awful pitch than Chelsea.

Still 9 games to go,  somewere saying We haD To WIn thE SoUThaMptoN game to make top 4 i didnt agree with that and i don't agree that we NEEDED to win this one. Im confident in this team but we need more envy at wanting to score goals and win games we should throw all the money we have at Haaland. West Ham have though fixtures for the next month i think we gonna be alright, and lets not forget that Leicester ends the season againts Spurs,United and Chelsea so i think THIS is the game we should absolutely win.

Win against Atletico and that should bring us even more energy and believe for the rest of the season.

46 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

Only if a team outside of the top 4 wins the Europa league as well. If Liverpool were to win the Champions League and we were to finish 4th, without an English side winning the Europa League, 4th would be enough for Champions League.

No mate check the rules. You cannot have 6 teams in the CL and nor can you have 5 unless a Europa league winner finishes outside the top 4. If Liverpool win it. 4th dont get the spot, just like 2012. The rules have no changed since.

3 minutes ago, KonaKai Blue said:

No mate check the rules. You cannot have 6 teams in the CL and nor can you have 5 unless a Europa league winner finishes outside the top 4. If Liverpool win it. 4th dont get the spot, just like 2012. The rules have no changed since.

It's all here in this link

https://www.premierleague.com/european-qualification-explained

Quote

In the event that a Premier League club win the UEFA Champions League and another win the UEFA Europa League and neither of these clubs finish in the top four of the Premier League, the club lying fourth in the table will drop into the UEFA Europa League group stage.

If we finish 4th, we only lose a Champions League spot if the above happens. Liverpool winning it wouldn't be enough on it's own to relegate 4th place to the Europa League. The only way that can happen is if the Europa League is also won by a team that doesn't finish in the top 4.

18 minutes ago, DidierDrogbalala said:

Since when is it up to Kanté to be our creative player ? we ditch the back 3 to put an extra attacker and yet some are blaming Kanté for us not creating chances. We had Havertz, Pulisic, Mount and Ziyech up front, its up to them to create chances and Kanté to break up the counter attacks. I thought our left side was  awful with Mount and Chilwell yet no one mentions it ? Pulisic put some good crosses at the start of the game and yet stopped doing it after 30 minutes and it seemed that the game went to fast for Havertz and Ziyech, we need to see more from them.

Like someone said earlier the game Atleti was definitely in the back of Tuchel's mind and maybe the players as well. Leeds might concede a lot of goals but they are still a good team that wants to play and they are more used to their awful pitch than Chelsea.

Still 9 games to go,  somewere saying We haD To WIn thE SoUThaMptoN game to make top 4 i didnt agree with that and i don't agree that we NEEDED to win this one. Im confident in this team but we need more envy at wanting to score goals and win games we should throw all the money we have at Haaland. West Ham have though fixtures for the next month i think we gonna be alright, and lets not forget that Leicester ends the season againts Spurs,United and Chelsea so i think THIS is the game we should absolutely win.

Win against Atletico and that should bring us even more energy and believe for the rest of the season.

I'm just wondering whether with a better creative midfielder in there (and I mean a Fabregas, or a Fernandes, or a Debruyne type) that you wouldn't see the same effect on our under-performing attack as we saw Mendy having on our under-performing defenders, who now all look top class when previously they all looked gash. The unaddressed issue for me is one of midfield balance, and having someone in there who is "creative", and none of Jorginho, Kante or Kovacic are the answer. Gilmour *might* be but doesn't get a look in ... be interesting to see if we sign any midfielders in the summer, and if we do, whether they make a difference.

1 hour ago, MyBloodIsBlue said:

Cannot believe with such a wealth of attacking options available to us, we can look so toothless! Chilwell is without doubt the most overrated player in the Prem.

I certainly agree that he has not offered what I was expecting from him. His crossing is poor and he doesn't attack his opposite number. 

22 minutes ago, DidierDrogbalala said:

Since when is it up to Kanté to be our creative player ? we ditch the back 3 to put an extra attacker and yet some are blaming Kanté for us not creating chances. We had Havertz, Pulisic, Mount and Ziyech up front, its up to them to create chances and Kanté to break up the counter attacks. I thought our left side was  awful with Mount and Chilwell yet no one mentions it ? Pulisic put some good crosses at the start of the game and yet stopped doing it after 30 minutes and it seemed that the game went to fast for Havertz and Ziyech, we need to see more from them.

Nobody is saying Kante should be our most creative player, but with the role he was given today and the amount of space he had, he should be a much better link with the attackers and wing backs. I also don't think Kante's job today was to break up counter attacks. Breaking up play is just something Kante does naturally because he has so much energy, but the positions he was taking up was not one you would expect of a player put on the pitch to break up counter attacks.

4 minutes ago, Sexyfootball said:

I'm just wondering whether with a better creative midfielder in there (and I mean a Fabregas, or a Fernandes, or a Debruyne type) that you wouldn't see the same effect on our under-performing attack as we saw Mendy having on our under-performing defenders, who now all look top class when previously they all looked gash. The unaddressed issue for me is one of midfield balance, and having someone in there who is "creative", and none of Jorginho, Kante or Kovacic are the answer. Gilmour *might* be but doesn't get a look in ... be interesting to see if we sign any midfielders in the summer, and if we do, whether they make a difference.

Its hard to find a midfielder who has it all, Jorginho is pretty much playing the Fabregas role under Conte but we realize that its really not the same quality of players (Fab could also score goals). Thats why i dont understand the blame on Kanté, its Jorginho's role to distribute the ball and make passes behind the defence, Kanté makes simple passes to the fowards or the full backs, does he miss some ? Of course, but its never been Kanté Forté thats simply not his game. The blame should go the fowards not making themself available for  a pass. You don't hear City fans blaming Rodri of Fernandinho not creating chances, you dont hear United fans blaming Mctomimnay or Fred  not creating chances or Leicester fans blaming Ndidi not creating chances or Liverpool fans blaming Fabinho or Henderson not creating chances because its not their role !

1 hour ago, nonotnowjim said:

This isn't a Jorginho vs kante thing. 

If Jorginho would have been as wasteful with the ball today, and as slow to make decisions on it, then I would also be calling him out.  But he wasn't. 

In the system today, jorgi was the one sitting deeper, and kante was the one with the role to drive forward and create, or get it others in advanced positions to create. He failed with that.

Leeds let him do the first bit well, that is getting on the ball and driving forward. But having done so, he was far to slow to spot the runs and pick a pass. Instead  holding up play which allowed Leeds to regroup and reshape - by which point the chance is gone.

He then resorts to the safe sideways and backwards passing that he is comfortable with. 

OK it isn't a Kante / Jorgingho thing Jim but It always seems to be the case that whenever Jorginho has a really poor game, as he certainly did today, the focus is invariably shifted away from him and on to another player. I also don't accept the view that Kante was given loads of space and time today. That's just rubbish IMO.

Jorginho only touched the ball 67 times today which, I think, tells how completely ineffective he was. It should not be that easy to nullify a supposedly "world class" player especially one who sits deep all the time and adds so little offensively. 

8 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

Nobody is saying Kante should be our most creative player, but with the role he was given today and the amount of space he had, he should be a much better link with the attackers and wing backs. I also don't think Kante's job today was to break up counter attacks. Breaking up play is just something Kante does naturally because he has so much energy, but the positions he was taking up was not one you would expect of a player put on the pitch to break up counter attacks.

he had space yes but not one made himself available for him to create something, the 4 fowards didnt even create enough room for him to take a good shot.

If Kanté is not there to beak up the opponents attack and getting the ball back then whats his role ?

4 hours ago, Paddy said:

£100 million give or take, I’m seeing  Ziyech and pulisic on the team sheet and I’m giving it ???? how ridiculous is that ?!

Hope Tommy’s fired a few f**ks into them (or given them a 21st century cuddle ffs) cause at the very least these pair need to put a shift in today and look interested.

COYB !!!

Well giving them a bollocking or a cuddle doesn’t seem to work , maybe they need the Spanish archer ? 

Pulisic, aside from the first 10 mins, and Ziyech for the entire 90 (give or take the odd pass/cross) weren’t at the races and frankly , Mendy apart, no one else showed up much either (I’m not being entirely fair to Dave , rudi or AC) 

It is so f**king frustrating watching Chelsea play at times, I mean we turn in fantastic performances v Atletico, v the dippers and v Everton and then today - sh*t ! wtf is all that about? 

I was expecting for us to give a really decent account of ourselves today, but we struggled with the wind, we struggled with their press, we struggled with their sh*te pitch, we just struggled ! 

Rubbish in attack, no idea what tuchels doing with some if his team selection, and substitutions. It almost seems he's f**king about to show how amazing he is, he can play anyone anywhere and win. 

just one of those games. Not much more to say

2 points dropped really in the grand scheme of things, a game we should be winning if we want to guarantee that top 4, again no cutting edge which is becoming a regular concern now but the defence is looking solid so TT just needs to find that balance now.