40 minutes ago, axman2526 said:

Honestly Kai is so, so bad at leading the line I honestly would rather have Romelu Lusulku back up front.

Wow ... let's not get ahead of ourselves here. I am pretty sure most would prefer playing with 10 men instead of having Lukaku in the team.

8 minutes ago, reparto corse said:

Wow ... let's not get ahead of ourselves here. I am pretty sure most would prefer playing with 10 men instead of having Lukaku in the team.

Yup is true.

 

I would sooner play with nine than see Kai carry on up there.

I miss Timo....

The entire point of a false nine is that the have to be good at false...nining.

When it comes time to execute a critical pass, shot, cross - I have never seen a forward at this club with such a low rate of success. Please, for the love of God, when Sterling is fit I hope he plays there. 

5 hours ago, reparto corse said:

Wow ... let's not get ahead of ourselves here. I am pretty sure most would prefer playing with 10 men instead of having Lukaku in the team.

Lukaku would actually be way better up top for us in this team. 

We have three specialist strikers on the books, one of whom, Broja,  is out for the season. The other two remained fit and available for selection, and yet D.Fofana has been afforded just 60 minutes since he signed, despite looking bright in those brief outing, and Aubameyang has been marginalised and now ostracised completely, despite being the guy that scored goals in Potter's only decent run of results with us to date.

Surely Fofana or Aubameyang have to be a better option up front than Havertz ? Especially with Felix playing behind them, and with Chilwell and James back to supply crosses ?

We need goals, and Havertz simply isn't cutting it ... 

Havertz just too often shys away/cuts back instead to battle it out with the defender. He got the tools and strenght but he just doesn't really use it. Somebody has to show him some Drogba videos to remind him there is a different side to the game. 

Stick Aubameyang, Lukaku or Sterling up top and you'll see goals. Kai up front just doesn't work, plus it's not his natural position.

6 hours ago, nonotnowjim said:

I miss Timo....

I miss Kezman 

Potter showed he's not worried about dropping players who are underperforming when he dropped mount, let's hope he does the same with Havertz. Fofana or Aubameyang would 100% be an improvement on Havertz, he's shocking. I'm begging we can offload him in the summer.

Yeah, time must be up for Kai now. Problem is that we don't really have a natural replacement with Aubayemang seemingly ostracized and DDF still very raw. 

This season is mostly gone, though -  might as well let DDF develop in the team 

I do wonder though, with a lack of world class strikers on the market and the lack of interested buyers, if Lukaku might be the answer for next season while we continue to search for the right profile. New ownership, new management, new squad - is it enough to motivate him to give it a third go? Is there too much bad blood between him and the fans? One to watch out for...

3 hours ago, venom2011 said:

The entire point of a false nine is that the have to be good at false...nining.

When it comes time to execute a critical pass, shot, cross - I have never seen a forward at this club with such a low rate of success. Please, for the love of God, when Sterling is fit I hope he plays there. 

I suppose the issue is that a false nine creates space/links up/otherwise enables other forwards who will attack the penalty box. These are things which Havertz generally does well, and that is fine if the two players either side are Ronaldo/Bale, Mané/Salah, Henry/Eto'o (etc.), however at the moment we don't really have players who are doing that. Ziyech generally stays wide and Mudryk stays deeper when Félix and Havertz both play. Using a false nine when you are playing (for all intents and purposes) a 4-4-2 doesn't really get the best out of the players available to you; your wide players will be deeper and wider, and all the pressure is on the second forward (Félix). 

I'm not saying I have an answer exactly, but it's not too hard to understand why what we're doing now isn't working. 

4 hours ago, Nevamind said:

Havertz just too often shys away/cuts back instead to battle it out with the defender. He got the tools and strenght but he just doesn't really use it. Somebody has to show him some Drogba videos to remind him there is a different side to the game. 

He doesn't really use it because he doesn't have the tools to begin with. 

We saw last night what happens when Havertz tries to dribble through opposition. He gets bullied off the ball due to his lack of agility, dribbling ability and center of gravity. It's why it makes him completely useless in tight areas as well as when defenders are on his back. 

This is just a sample of the hundreds of instances of Havertz trying to work around opposition. 

 

 

 

Edited February 16, 20233 yr by Sconnie Blue

11 hours ago, axman2526 said:

He also still had Timo to do the... donkey work (pun intended).... for him as well. Timo made Kai a much better player.

I would take the donkey, not because he is any good in our shirt, but because Havertz is somehow more useless.

Has there been one match in his entire career (especially against elite opponents which Dortmund certainly are on current form) where a team with Lukaku leading the line created as many chances as we did last night with Havertz leading the line? We can add the likes of Real, Atletico, City, United, Liverpool to that aswell.

How are we forgetting already how our performances instantly improved around this time last year after Tuchel finally dropped Lukaku?

For all Havertz faults and ultimate disappointment he is infinity times a better fit than that clown, especially at supplementing tactical shapes and performances around him.

2 hours ago, AndyDowsleftflank said:

Yeah, time must be up for Kai now. Problem is that we don't really have a natural replacement with Aubayemang seemingly ostracized and DDF still very raw. 

This season is mostly gone, though -  might as well let DDF develop in the team 

I do wonder though, with a lack of world class strikers on the market and the lack of interested buyers, if Lukaku might be the answer for next season while we continue to search for the right profile. 

How the hell has there be an absence makes the heart grow fonder stuff with Lukaku?

We've already seen he not only won't be the answer but will butcher anything good we may or may not have set up come May ready for the next season.

I would sort of understand these questions if he was doing well at Inter but he's got even worse which I predicted would happen as Inzaghi also likes a possession based football.

I really really really hope similar questions aren't being asked in the boardroom or training pitch. If we become that desperate for a "tradition number 9" then do what United did and get a low egoed low price one that won't cause problems when we once again realize our error and drop him.

Edited February 16, 20233 yr by Argo

 

57 minutes ago, Argo said:

How the hell has there be an absence makes the heart grow fonder stuff with Lukaku?

We've already seen he not only won't be the answer but will butcher anything good we may or may not have set up come May ready for the next season.

I would sort of understand these questions if he was doing well at Inter but he's got even worse which I predicted would happen as Inzaghi also likes a possession based football.

I really really really hope similar questions aren't being asked in the boardroom or training pitch. If we become that desperate for a "tradition number 9" then do what United did and get a low egoed low price one that won't cause problems when we once again realize our error and drop him.

You sound a little worried there mate.

1 hour ago, Argo said:

How the hell has there be an absence makes the heart grow fonder stuff with Lukaku?

We've already seen he not only won't be the answer but will butcher anything good we may or may not have set up come May ready for the next season.

I would sort of understand these questions if he was doing well at Inter but he's got even worse which I predicted would happen as Inzaghi also likes a possession based football.

I really really really hope similar questions aren't being asked in the boardroom or training pitch. If we become that desperate for a "tradition number 9" then do what United did and get a low egoed low price one that won't cause problems when we once again realize our error and drop him.

Lukaku is the answer.....

 

....If the question is 'who is the sweatiest big lump we ever put up front?'

 

To all other questions, he is ALWAYS the wrong answer.

4 hours ago, Argo said:

Has there been one match in his entire career (especially against elite opponents which Dortmund certainly are on current form) where a team with Lukaku leading the line created as many chances as we did last night with Havertz leading the line? We can add the likes of Real, Atletico, City, United, Liverpool to that aswell.

How are we forgetting already how our performances instantly improved around this time last year after Tuchel finally dropped Lukaku?

For all Havertz faults and ultimate disappointment he is infinity times a better fit than that clown, especially at supplementing tactical shapes and performances around him.

No, he's not, they're equally as bad. At least with Lukaku he actually got us 10 goals last season, Havertz literally offers nothing. This whole attribute of "he's good off the ball" can literally be done by any winger, midfielder, or non-striker if they are put in a false 9. I've never seen any player get so many excuses like Havertz, even the Pulisic fans don't go that far with him.

4 minutes ago, Frankie8Lampard said:

No, he's not, they're equally as bad. At least with Lukaku he actually got us 10 goals last season, Havertz literally offers nothing. This whole attribute of "he's good off the ball" can literally be done by any winger, midfielder, or non-striker if they are put in a false 9. I've never seen any player get so many excuses like Havertz, even the Pulisic fans don't go that far with him.

Funnily enough the one time l had little complaints about Pulisic in the last couple of years was when he was actually playing at false 9.

Re Kai I fully accept it's got to the better to move him on point now especially with Felix here and Nkunku coming but I'll ask this.

When has a team with Lukaku leading the line created chances at will against the likes of Real Madrid, City, Dortmund, United etc? Even in Inter 1.0 when he was a supposed changed player he still played hide and seek against Juventus.

7 minutes ago, Argo said:

Funnily enough the one time l had little complaints about Pulisic in the last couple of years was when he was actually playing at false 9.

Re Kai I fully accept it's got to the better to move him on point now especially with Felix here and Nkunku coming but I'll ask this.

When has a team with Lukaku leading the line created chances at will against the likes of Real Madrid, City, Dortmund, United etc? Even in Inter 1.0 when he was a supposed changed player he still played hide and seek against Juventus.

Chances don't win games though, goals do. Not arguing for Lukaku to be our striker just arguing against the fact that somehow Havertz is supposedly a better option than him. The writing is on the wall, ever since Havertz began starting for us regularly this season our goals have declined massively. We also have had more wins and goals when players like Auba/Broja start compared to Havertz. Havertz imo is at the bottom of the barrel below even Lukaku. 

Just now, Frankie8Lampard said:

Chances don't win games though, goals do. Not arguing for Lukaku to be our striker just arguing against the fact that somehow Havertz is supposedly a better option than him. The writing is on the wall, ever since Havertz began starting for us regularly this season our goals have declined massively. We also have had more wins and goals when players like Auba/Broja start compared to Havertz. Havertz imo is at the bottom of the barrel below even Lukaku. 

I mean ofcourse in an ideal world we will find a player who can do both but my point is if we're going to be an incredibly inconsistently flawed team I'd rather go down the ways we did In Tuchel's first half season and the Burnley home game and both United games last season, league cup final etc than the soul destroying ways we dropped points/lost games pretty much every time we did when Rom started. 

We went from the Tuchel side of 20/21 hoping multiple players will finish 1 or 2 out of many chances to then hoping Lukaku would finish 1 or 2 of very few chances then as soon as Lukaku got injured like magic we were back to creating at will. 

Hopefully it's neither going forward but if it was one or the other, Havertz all day long and twice on Sunday.

Started playing Football Manager and my word if Havertz was as good in real life as he is on the game, we would be challenging for everything.

10 hours ago, Frankie8Lampard said:

No, he's not, they're equally as bad. At least with Lukaku he actually got us 10 goals last season, Havertz literally offers nothing. This whole attribute of "he's good off the ball" can literally be done by any winger, midfielder, or non-striker if they are put in a false 9. I've never seen any player get so many excuses like Havertz, even the Pulisic fans don't go that far with him.

And while I am not accepting Lukaku will be a perfect fit, I actually think in our current team, Havertz has more creative players around him compared to what Lukaku did. If Lukaku was in this team he offers more pace and more lethality imo. Havertz has slowed down our attacks too many games this season and does not offer a dominating presence. I actually think he would have done better than Havertz in that role this season.

23 hours ago, Sexyfootball said:

We have three specialist strikers on the books, one of whom, Broja,  is out for the season. The other two remained fit and available for selection, and yet D.Fofana has been afforded just 60 minutes since he signed, despite looking bright in those brief outing, and Aubameyang has been marginalised and now ostracised completely, despite being the guy that scored goals in Potter's only decent run of results with us to date.

Surely Fofana or Aubameyang have to be a better option up front than Havertz ? Especially with Felix playing behind them, and with Chilwell and James back to supply crosses ?

We need goals, and Havertz simply isn't cutting it ... 

Agree. I think Potter has been very harsh on Aubameyang. I would also start Fofana over Havertz. It`s basically a no-brainer at the moment considering Havertz doesn`t seem to fit into our current playstyle (whatever that is) at all.