2 months into Potter's reign, curious to see what people think

I think it’s almost immaterial. There are so many things that have gone wrong in SW6 in the last year or more that whoever the coach is right now wouldn’t make a lot of difference.

Probably Tuchel is the better coach, but there is such a problem with bad attitudes, ability levels, squad player position and role imbalance, ridiculous amounts of injuries (and that’s only the problems on the pitch) that it’s very hard to see any coach that could do any better with this lot.

Best just to accept that we’re not contenders for trophies any more and that this is conceivably our last CL campaign for a while.

Yes it was. We would be no better off in the table than we are now. Same results and same turgid football. We would all be saying 13 games in with dross performances, it's time to go. We couldvd been out of the CL too. The Milan double was a new manager bounce effect. 

Problem is, this Potter guy doesn't seem built for this big job early doors. His team selections are so worrying. 

11 minutes ago, Snedger said:

I think it’s almost immaterial. There are so many things that have gone wrong in SW6 in the last year or more that whoever the coach is right now wouldn’t make a lot of difference.

Probably Tuchel is the better coach, but there is such a problem with bad attitudes, ability levels, squad player position and role imbalance, ridiculous amounts of injuries (and that’s only the problems on the pitch) that it’s very hard to see any coach that could do any better with this lot.

Best just to accept that we’re not contenders for trophies any more and that this is conceivably our last CL campaign for a while.

I wouldn't say for a while. 12 months ago Arsenal fans would never imagined the position they are in now. 

39 minutes ago, KonaKai Blue said:

I wouldn't say for a while. 12 months ago Arsenal fans would never imagined the position they are in now. 

True. So on that basis I now think that the manager change was definitely correct and that this time next season we’ll be running away at the top of the table and RLC will be nailed on for the Ballon d’Or.

Problem is it's a situation that's more than just what's happening on the pitch, Boehly etc are in the process of building the club how they want to, new director of football, new recruitment process, new transfer policy etc. We have no idea how much of a pain in the arse Tuchel was to work with and just how different Tuchel's vision for the club was to the new owners.
 

The last thing we need is an ongoing feud behind closed doors so, as much as I was gutted to see Tuchel go, maybe the owners didn't see it as a workable situation and wanted to start implement their vision as soon as possible, a transition period was always inevitable whether Tuchel was sacked when he was or at the end of the season.

 

I'm not trying to be condescending or anything but I think as a fanbase we aren't used to a long term project being implemented here, it's been a revolving door of managers for 20 years where we get short term success followed by a sacking, rinse and repeat.
 

It has been great to witness it happen, we've had so many good times but the fact that we haven't been anywhere a near league title in 6 years, overtaken by 2 teams that DO have a long term project, shows that maybe the old way of doing things had come to an end and a change is needed. Yes we've won the champions league recently, but tournament football is a lot different to league competition. 
 

That all being said, is Potter the right man? I personally think he is and he needs time to get his system the way he wants it, people do seem to forget he's only been here for 10 games. Would someone like Pochettino have come in and started better? Possibly, but he would have been another 18 month manager of quick success and then sacked. Boehly identified Potter as a progressive manager that in the long term will be an important part of a successful future for the club and I for one will be backing him 100%.

 

3 minutes ago, timetowaste said:

Problem is it's a situation that's more than just what's happening on the pitch, Boehly etc are in the process of building the club how they want to, new director of football, new recruitment process, new transfer policy etc. We have no idea how much of a pain in the arse Tuchel was to work with and just how different Tuchel's vision for the club was to the new owners.
 

The last thing we need is an ongoing feud behind closed doors so, as much as I was gutted to see Tuchel go, maybe the owners didn't see it as a workable situation and wanted to start implement their vision as soon as possible, a transition period was always inevitable whether Tuchel was sacked when he was or at the end of the season.

 

I'm not trying to be condescending or anything but I think as a fanbase we aren't used to a long term project being implemented here, it's been a revolving door of managers for 20 years where we get short term success followed by a sacking, rinse and repeat.
 

It has been great to witness it happen, we've had so many good times but the fact that we haven't been anywhere a near league title in 6 years, overtaken by 2 teams that DO have a long term project, shows that maybe the old way of doing things had come to an end and a change is needed. Yes we've won the champions league recently, but tournament football is a lot different to league competition. 
 

That all being said, is Potter the right man? I personally think he is and he needs time to get his system the way he wants it, people do seem to forget he's only been here for 10 games. Would someone like Pochettino have come in and started better? Possibly, but he would have been another 18 month manager of quick success and then sacked. Boehly identified Potter as a progressive manager that in the long term will be an important part of a successful future for the club and I for one will be backing him 100%.

 

Good points. Todd and Co don't care what the fans think unless the stadium is mostly empty and the merch is not being bought, and that won't happen. And to be fair Roman, for the most part, did not care what we thought either, bar the super league reaction.

Most of the time Roman and Co were right as well. 

I expect Todd to stick to his plan. He did not spend what? 40mill to sack TT and appoint Potter only to sack him so quickly.

I reckon he will want all his background staff, football director, technical director and all their staff, in place for a while to work with Potter. Unless they come out and say "yeah that Potter, not good enough" he won't be going.

How is this even a question? We didn't improve at all and it doesn't even seem like the players respect the guy. He hasn't won over the dressing room. We spend all this money in the summer to get players Tuchel wanted and then we don't give him time to actually play them. Clueless owners because apart from Tuchel we also sacked basically everyone else including Cech, Marina etc etc. 

I remain to be convinced of Potter but Tuchel unfortunately did not look happy and the performances and players were also unhappy. Gutted to see Tuchel go because “he got it”. But it seemed he didn’t like the new structure and wanted to be left alone. The mood was like Jose 2.0 in pre season - very unhappy and messy. 
 

I’m more annoyed that Tuchel didn’t try to make it work. I don’t believe Bohley would have sacked if he felt Tuchel tried and was engaging with the overall vision. 

These 2 things are not mutually exclusive.

33 minutes ago, dkw said:

These 2 things are not mutually exclusive.

Agreed.

I think sacking Tuchel was probably correct as the football and results were dire and had no indication of improving. Loved the bloke but the last 6-12 months of him were a bit crap really.

Jury is still out on Potter, i'll judge him more after a year. Look how long it took Arteta to get his team playing how he wants and the players he wanted. 

1 hour ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Agreed.

I think sacking Tuchel was probably correct as the football and results were dire and had no indication of improving. Loved the bloke but the last 6-12 months of him were a bit crap really.

Jury is still out on Potter, i'll judge him more after a year. Look how long it took Arteta to get his team playing how he wants and the players he wanted. 

An Arsenal side that have won nothing at all should not be the measuring stick with all due respect. Go back five months and you'd be laughed out of the country if you claimed we should aspire to be like Arsenal. 

What Tuchel achieved or even what Lampard achieved in his first season should be the actual measuring stick. They both had to deal with difficult circumstances as well and delivered when it mattered. Both achieved Top 4 in their first seasons despite squads that were lacking and one achieved the biggest title of them all on top of it.

I would strongly disagree with anyone suggesting Potter should have a free shot for a whole year. Maybe you get that at clubs who's won nothing for 20 years like Arsenal or Brighton. Not here.
Because we know what we are and we are better than Arsenal despite Potter claiming we aren't anymore yesterday. 

2 minutes ago, Droy said:

An Arsenal side that have won nothing at all should not be the measuring stick with all due respect. Go back five months and you'd be laughed out of the country if you claimed we should aspire to be like Arsenal. 

So we should never build for the future? This expensive run and gun approach that leaves us with a disjointed squad for a cup trophy every year to show for it is what we want? It was clear Arsenal were building for something better and this year its shown just what that is. The foundations they've put in place have them challenging City for an actual league title, something we've not managed to do for 5-6 years. I hate City but you have to admire the way they stuck to their guns with Arteta and now they look like they're ready to dominate for a good few years with their young squad.

5 minutes ago, Droy said:

What Tuchel achieved or even what Lampard achieved in his first season should be the actual measuring stick. They both had to deal with difficult circumstances as well and delivered when it mattered. Both achieved Top 4 in their first seasons despite squads that were lacking and one achieved the biggest title of them all on top of it.

Lamps didn't win anything with us. We can still very easily still finish top 4 which would match Lampard's achievements. I understand he came in with a transfer ban but Potter came in to a very disheartened squad left behind by Tuchel and didn't lose any of his first 9 games. We were one of the most in form teams in the league until 2 games ago. Tuchel won us the CL which was an incredible achievement, but also lost every other final he got to and didn't challenge for a title. This slip has only happened since we lost our best player (James) to injury, is that not a challenge for Potter?

8 minutes ago, Droy said:

I would strongly disagree with anyone suggesting Potter should have a free shot for a whole year. Maybe you get that at clubs who's won nothing for 20 years like Arsenal or Brighton. Not here.
Because we know what we are and we are better than Arsenal despite Potter claiming we aren't anymore yesterday. 

I'm not supporting Chelsea just for the short term silverware to brag to my mates about, I want to see the club in the best way it can be and clearly it hasn't been working recently with no battle for a title in years now. City/Liverpool are the bench mark and both teams have had a long term manager that built a team they want and they had their rewards. It took Klopp two years to achieve anything, Pep a year which was helped with the spending he had available. Arsenal have come to the end of their 2 year build and look at them now. They have better players in most positions but most importantly know how the manager wants them to play together. 

1 minute ago, RIP Mourinho said:

It was clear Arsenal were building for something better and this year its shown just what that is. The foundations they've put in place have them challenging City for an actual league title, something we've not managed to do for 5-6 years.

At this point last season we were where they are right now. So if Arsenal are challenging right now, then we were for the first half of last season.

I am all for building for the future. But you better have the right man in charge then and I think many fear Potter isn't. Arteta may or may not succeed at Arsenal but he learned from the best in the business. Potter I would compare to Solskjaer who had three whole years at United and took them nowhere except backwards.

1 hour ago, Droy said:

At this point last season we were where they are right now. So if Arsenal are challenging right now, then we were for the first half of last season.

I am all for building for the future. But you better have the right man in charge then and I think many fear Potter isn't. Arteta may or may not succeed at Arsenal but he learned from the best in the business. Potter I would compare to Solskjaer who had three whole years at United and took them nowhere except backwards.

Potter did a very good job at Swansea and then Brighton. Solskjaer was absolutely hopeless at Cardiff.

1 hour ago, RIP Mourinho said:

So we should never build for the future? This expensive run and gun approach that leaves us with a disjointed squad for a cup trophy every year to show for it is what we want? It was clear Arsenal were building for something better and this year its shown just what that is. The foundations they've put in place have them challenging City for an actual league title, something we've not managed to do for 5-6 years. I hate City but you have to admire the way they stuck to their guns with Arteta and now they look like they're ready to dominate for a good few years with their young squad.

Lamps didn't win anything with us. We can still very easily still finish top 4 which would match Lampard's achievements. I understand he came in with a transfer ban but Potter came in to a very disheartened squad left behind by Tuchel and didn't lose any of his first 9 games. We were one of the most in form teams in the league until 2 games ago. Tuchel won us the CL which was an incredible achievement, but also lost every other final he got to and didn't challenge for a title. This slip has only happened since we lost our best player (James) to injury, is that not a challenge for Potter?

I'm not supporting Chelsea just for the short term silverware to brag to my mates about, I want to see the club in the best way it can be and clearly it hasn't been working recently with no battle for a title in years now. City/Liverpool are the bench mark and both teams have had a long term manager that built a team they want and they had their rewards. It took Klopp two years to achieve anything, Pep a year which was helped with the spending he had available. Arsenal have come to the end of their 2 year build and look at them now. They have better players in most positions but most importantly know how the manager wants them to play together. 

When did we last play well in the league?

1 hour ago, RIP Mourinho said:

So we should never build for the future? This expensive run and gun approach that leaves us with a disjointed squad for a cup trophy every year to show for it is what we want? It was clear Arsenal were building for something better and this year its shown just what that is. The foundations they've put in place have them challenging City for an actual league title, something we've not managed to do for 5-6 years. I hate City but you have to admire the way they stuck to their guns with Arteta and now they look like they're ready to dominate for a good few years with their young squad.

Lamps didn't win anything with us. We can still very easily still finish top 4 which would match Lampard's achievements. I understand he came in with a transfer ban but Potter came in to a very disheartened squad left behind by Tuchel and didn't lose any of his first 9 games. We were one of the most in form teams in the league until 2 games ago. Tuchel won us the CL which was an incredible achievement, but also lost every other final he got to and didn't challenge for a title. This slip has only happened since we lost our best player (James) to injury, is that not a challenge for Potter?

I'm not supporting Chelsea just for the short term silverware to brag to my mates about, I want to see the club in the best way it can be and clearly it hasn't been working recently with no battle for a title in years now. City/Liverpool are the bench mark and both teams have had a long term manager that built a team they want and they had their rewards. It took Klopp two years to achieve anything, Pep a year which was helped with the spending he had available. Arsenal have come to the end of their 2 year build and look at them now. They have better players in most positions but most importantly know how the manager wants them to play together. 

Didn't Arteta win the FA cup another cup in his first 6 months? That lay the foundation for Arsenal to build on. Potter should and would be judged by what he achieves in his first season

Will Chelsea be going backwards or forward?

3 hours ago, Droy said:

 

Because we know what we are and we are better than Arsenal despite Potter claiming we aren't anymore yesterday. 

We never beat Arsenal at home under Tuchel, Sindre.

Last two matches under his control we conceded eight goals.

Some of Tuchel's post match comments: 

"It's a very, very difficult pitch here. It's not in our favour. The ball bounces awkwardly".

"The worrying part is that the level of commitment physically and mentally for this match was far higher for Arsenal than for us.

"It  was surely not our strongest line-up. This is a part of an explanation but only a little part and the other part is worrying. I cannot guarantee we will be ready in two weeks.’

You have to live in the now and be honest Sindre. At the moment Arsenal are a better team than us. 

We also have to accept we are not Roman's Chelsea anymore, and things are done differently. 

I maintain that, even though we spent loads in the summer, thar did not keep us as one of the top sides. Forrest spent a lot too, where are they?

Clearlake Chelsea are a different animal, and in my opinion not one of the top sides anymore. We best accept things are different now. Roman is gone sadly, so is his Chelsea.

27 minutes ago, just said:

Arsenal are a better team than us. 

And Brighton.

1 minute ago, coco said:

And Brighton.

And Newcastle 

11 minutes ago, axman2526 said:

Clearlake Chelsea are a different animal, and in my opinion not one of the top sides anymore. We best accept things are different now. Roman is gone sadly, so is his Chelsea.

You've been blowing this tune mate for a good while now and I will continue to disagree with it. We went after the highest prospects last summer and are rumored to continue doing so. Boehly also manages two of the biggest sports franchises in the United States and continues to invest heavily in them.
 

How on earth do you still believe Boehly and Clearlake don't intend on making Chelsea one of the top sides?

11 minutes ago, Sconnie Blue said:

You've been blowing this tune mate for a good while now and I will continue to disagree with it. We went after the highest prospects last summer and are rumored to continue doing so. Boehly also manages two of the biggest sports franchises in the United States and continues to invest heavily in them.
 

How on earth do you still believe Boehly and Clearlake don't intend on making Chelsea one of the top sides?

I don't doubt they want that to happen, I do doubt their ability to achieve it. At present we are not a top side on the pitch.

8 hours ago, JM7 said:

I’m more annoyed that Tuchel didn’t try to make it work. I don’t believe Bohley would have sacked if he felt Tuchel tried and was engaging with the overall vision. 

Sure but that's like leaving your partner after your first fight and saying they didn't try to make it work. You need the time/possibility to do it - to change if needed. I don't blame Tuchel at all because he never changed during his tenure, and he wasn't given the time to adapt to the new ownerships demands. All he got during his time here was a 5th choice striker in Lukaku, and a few weeks of time with players he actually wanted. 

Boehly wanted a company man and Potter is the very definition of a company man. He won't rock the boat, scream at players, be ridiculously demanding, and be stand-offish if he doesn't get his way. 

I will know in two years time if it was the right decision