10 minutes ago, Sconnie Blue said:

Loans would be ideal for players who are struggling to find any place in the squad. 

As of now, Estevao competes with Madueke at RW and Paez becomes Palmer+Nkunku's understudy. 

Aye I don't think Estevao is the one that will find opportunities hard to come by.

Given he can play anywhere along the front line he could displace Neto or Sancho on the left, or Noni on the right. If he is as good as we hope he is, he likely will.

Paez on the other hand seems like he is more likely running in to Felix, Nkunku and, even worse for him, Cole Palmer.

This is assuming nobody other than Mudryk is moved on of course. If Nkunku stays fit and does not get a decent amount of play time I could see him wanting to go. At his stage of his career he needs to be playing often, these are his prime years.

2 minutes ago, axman2526 said:

Aye I don't think Estevao is the one that will find opportunities hard to come by.

Given he can play anywhere along the front line he could displace Neto or Sancho on the left, or Noni on the right. If he is as good as we hope he is, he likely will.

Paez on the other hand seems like he is more likely running in to Felix, Nkunku and, even worse for him, Cole Palmer.

This is assuming nobody other than Mudryk is moved on of course. If Nkunku stays fit and does not get a decent amount of play time I could see him wanting to go. At his stage of his career he needs to be playing often, these are his prime years.

People should take notice of Liverpool throughout this season and you'll realize just how much football we will be playing if we qualify for the Champions League. 

Liverpool's squad is bleak. 

Edited September 17, 20241 yr by Sconnie Blue

1 minute ago, Sconnie Blue said:

People should take notice of Liverpool throughout this season and you'll realize just how much football we will be playing if we qualify for the Champions League. 

Liverpool's squad is bleak. 

Won't we have as any games as them playing in the conference league. Yes I know levels different but amount of games.

Also our back up defence is Badiashile and Disasi. That's bleak.

1 minute ago, axman2526 said:

Won't we have as any games as them playing in the conference league. Yes I know levels different but amount of games.

Also our back up defence is Badiashile and Disasi. That's bleak.

No we won't. Champions League + Europa League is going to include 2 to 4 extra matches at a minimum squished into fixtures.

Monaco chuckle brothers are 100% gone next summer at this rate. 

I'm going to assume Mudryk leaves and perhaps we don't sign Sancho is Paez and Estevao are going to get any game time at Chelsea. 

Felix signing looks more stupid by the day. 

Imho, I agree with the guys saying loan first.

They will be 18 in a new country, new league, new team, etc...they need to ease into it first and a year at strasbourg will do them good before joining the squad at Chelsea.

 

3 hours ago, Sconnie Blue said:

Loans would be ideal for players who are struggling to find any place in the squad. 

As of now, Estevao competes with Madueke at RW and Paez becomes Palmer+Nkunku's understudy. 

They probably can compete now if given enough game time but that's not possible at Chels. Like Carney...for his next step in development he'll need to play 30-35 games a season according to Maresca. How much game time will these 18yr olds get in our squad. A year at strasbourg won't only help them settle in but will also help their development, confidence, game time and gain as much experience as possible before becoming understudies to the squad the following year. Easing them into PL football is an important part of their development. 

3 minutes ago, Simplymo said:

Easing them into PL football is an important part of their development. 

Which is literally what we would be doing with my post below. 

As of now, Estevao competes with Madueke at RW and Paez becomes Palmer+Nkunku's understudy. 

 

33 minutes ago, Sconnie Blue said:

Which is literally what we would be doing with my post below. 

As of now, Estevao competes with Madueke at RW and Paez becomes Palmer+Nkunku's understudy. 

 

Yep, and that would be great for their second year after a year in strasbourg to tick the game time box. They won't get much game time here in their first year.

Not the 30-35 games to get them settled in.

30 minutes ago, Simplymo said:

Yep, and that would be great for their second year after a year in strasbourg to tick the game time box. They won't get much game time here in their first year.

Not the 30-35 games to get them settled in.

They don't need 35 league games. They will be 18. Just being around the squad is enough education. 

But Estaveo seems so good that it would be criminal to send him anywhere but our first team squad. 

1 hour ago, Simplymo said:

Imho, I agree with the guys saying loan first.

They will be 18 in a new country, new league, new team, etc...they need to ease into it first and a year at strasbourg will do them good before joining the squad at Chelsea.

While I do agree that being in a new country and a new league will be a huge challenge for 18 year olds from South America, they would have to make such big changes twice if first they are sent on loan to France. Wouldn't that double the culture shock?

6 hours ago, charierre said:

I made the same argument about Mudryk a couple of months in, and was told by many you don’t spend this type of money and loan him. His Chelsea career may just have been very different if he had secured a loan. Estevao and Paez both have to adapt to a completely different country and culture not to mention a much harder league. It’s impossible at this stage to guess how each will adapt, both are still extremely young, yes they are full internationals for their relative countries, reality is though international and club football might as well be a different game. As a footnote Vitor Roque was similarly lauded before he arrived at Barcelona, this season the decision has been taken to loan him to Betis, never say never.

I feel they are different scenarios. Murdyk had only played 70 top level games at the top level when we signed him at 21 which should have been a green flag. He wasn’t even on anyone’s radar until he had some standout performances in the CL. Santos we signed from the 2nd division of the Brazilian league where he had only made 30+ appearances. It would have been a huge step up to join our first team but can be done, your Madrid’s, Barca, Bayern & the Italians do it regularly with young talents. Paez & Estevao have both racked up 50+ and 30+ appearances playing in their leagues top level and their version of CL already before turning 18.
Loaning that level of talent  out to Ligue 1 would just be writing them off. 

Tbh I can see Madueke and Mudryk being sold in the summer with Paez getting loaned out with Estevao coming straight into the team 

7 hours ago, Simplymo said:

Imho, I agree with the guys saying loan first.

They will be 18 in a new country, new league, new team, etc...they need to ease into it first and a year at strasbourg will do them good before joining the squad at Chelsea.

 

They probably can compete now if given enough game time but that's not possible at Chels. Like Carney...for his next step in development he'll need to play 30-35 games a season according to Maresca. How much game time will these 18yr olds get in our squad. A year at strasbourg won't only help them settle in but will also help their development, confidence, game time and gain as much experience as possible before becoming understudies to the squad the following year. Easing them into PL football is an important part of their development. 

If they’re good enough then they’re old enough.

8 minutes ago, 19seventyone said:

If they’re good enough then they’re old enough.

I tend to agree, but they also need to be protected from physical and mental burn out. While the likes of Thiago Silva and Cristiano Ronaldo have been able to play at a very high level for many years, it seems the generations below will not be so lucky.

Messi seems to be the exception from a generation that saw Fabregas, Rooney, Aguero etc disappear from the European top-flight in their early 30s. The generation below sees Thiago Alcantara, Eden Hazard and Gareth Bale actually retire before Messi and Ronaldo. 

This is not limited to football either, the same phenomenon is happening in NBA, in Rugby League, in cricket. Either there is a curse on players born after 1990 or something has changed that they do not seem to get the supposed benefits of modern training and sports medicine - the obvious answer being there are just simply too many games.

7 hours ago, Valerie said:

While I do agree that being in a new country and a new league will be a huge challenge for 18 year olds from South America, they would have to make such big changes twice if first they are sent on loan to France. Wouldn't that double the culture shock?

I believe the PL is much faster, stronger and in general more demanding on them physically and mentally. Not even taking into account the pressure of playing for the first team, the scrutiny from the fans, etc.

They are clearly talented and maybe "generational" * I'd take every precaution to bring them up slowly instead of throwing them into the deep end. Even if its a simple case of better safe than sorry.

 

* I keep trying to set alarms to watch these two but I keep failing. I only know what ppl have been saying and youtube clips. There's a lot of hope already by some in these kids. Unfortunately I don't know much about them but the hype warrants nurturing these kids if it's all true.

The more I see of this kid the more excited I am for next season. 
Genuinely believe he’s ready for the first team next year at least in a back up role to Neto/Palmer defendant how we line up.

We’ll have enough games to play to easily give him 25-30 games.

On 17/09/2024 at 19:20, Valerie said:

While I do agree that being in a new country and a new league will be a huge challenge for 18 year olds from South America, they would have to make such big changes twice if first they are sent on loan to France. Wouldn't that double the culture shock?

And I don't know how loaning a South American teenager to a mid to bottom club in the French League is a way to prepare him for the English Premiership.

15 hours ago, The Rising Sun said:

And I don't know how loaning a South American teenager to a mid to bottom club in the French League is a way to prepare him for the English Premiership.

Not agreeing with it but its seemed to work for Savio at City recently and Santos is getting plaudits in France currently. 

I predict a season long loan at Everton working under Dyche. It will works wonders for him.

Can't wait .

just seen he's had a couple of injuries lately.. 

hope the fecking curse doesn't affect the lad.

good luck to any youth team player coming her to dislodge... Nkunku, Noni, Palmer, Felix, Sancho, Neto, Mudryk... We'll probably sign a few more wingers in January and next summer so think these guys are going to be well down the pecking order. Absolutely no need to sign felix, Sancho or Neto if the club thought these guys could come in and do a job. 

5 minutes ago, bluetrooper said:

good luck to any youth team player coming her to dislodge... Nkunku, Noni, Palmer, Felix, Sancho, Neto, Mudryk... We'll probably sign a few more wingers in January and next summer so think these guys are going to be well down the pecking order. Absolutely no need to sign felix, Sancho or Neto if the club thought these guys could come in and do a job. 

Anyone over 23 will be sold. Problem solved.

There's no reason to loan him out. Look at Real Madrid, look at Barcelona. Real Madrid have Endrick and Guler playing games for them, Barcelona have Yamal and Cubarasi. Just let him get used to the club, the league, the country and hopefully watch him become a special player for us.

10 hours ago, Scott Harris said:

There's no reason to loan him out. Look at Real Madrid, look at Barcelona. Real Madrid have Endrick and Guler playing games for them, Barcelona have Yamal and Cubarasi. Just let him get used to the club, the league, the country and hopefully watch him become a special player for us.

It is different though PL is very challenging for player who is not ready physically. 

Edited September 20, 20241 yr by Bob stark

18 hours ago, Ukraine Bolt said:

Not agreeing with it but its seemed to work for Savio at City recently and Santos is getting plaudits in France currently. 

That's great but neither were as highly rated as Estevao. If any other top team had signed this guy they would keep him and use him in their squad.