11 hours ago, drjonesy1994 said:

I don’t want to derail the Mount thread, but for what it’s worth my opinion on Jorginho is that he was one of our best performers under Tuchel, and was much better than he was under Sarri and Lamps, and I said as much to another poster ina private message earlier. 

Completely agree, Jorgi is much better player under Tuchel than under Sarri n lamp. Sarri wanted to run the offense through jorgi and he is simply not good enough to be such player. Under Lamp fast octane football, jorgi was a disaster. 

Tuchel on the other hand utilized jorgi perfectly. Reduce his role and protect him. 

12 hours ago, Bob stark said:

Aren't you the one who keep saying that we should sign Enzo.

With Enzo this is our midfield 

Enzo, Kova, Ruben, probably jorgi 

Unless I've watched about 25 outliers there's absolutely nothing wrong with Enzo defensively.

The lad will answer his critics .. was just remembering his goal against AM.. he has missed some absolute sitters recently- with a bit of luck he would have burried them. 
his best position is that of a 8 or as an AM.

Tuchel and GP for some reason have been hell bent on playing players out of position so far.. hope that changes.

14 hours ago, Bob stark said:

Aren't you the one who keep saying that we should sign Enzo.

With Enzo this is our midfield 

Enzo, Kova, Ruben, probably jorgi 

Enzo and Rice. 

Essentially, I want this midfield next season. 

Enzo/Caicedo--Rice/Kovacic

Nkunku/Mount

Enzo is genuinely a full package deal. Technically gifted and good defensively, which makes him a valuable asset in all thirds of the pitch. 

Edited December 22, 20223 yr by Sconnie Blue

 

Lovely goal and good performance. Would like to see an extended run in that role/formation - think that’s his best place 

A very good performance and a brilliantly taken goal by him tonight.

Capable of hitting the ball so beautifully, just needs to be more consistent.

2 minutes ago, axman2526 said:

Capable of hitting the ball so beautifully, just needs to be more consistent.

Hopefully playing him in his correct position will help. Progression stalled for a while. 

15 minutes ago, Sconnie Blue said:

Hopefully playing him in his correct position will help. Progression stalled for a while. 

Absolutely. He needs to be in the middle and allowed a free role more or less. Him being out as a wide forward is a waste. 

On 21/12/2022 at 15:06, Sconnie Blue said:

I’m assuming this is aimed at me so when insulting someone please have the decency to at least @ them. 
 

I criticize players as I see fit. Mount hasn’t been good for almost a year now and he is supposedly our talisman. To add insult to injury, there’s speculation he wants to earn as much as Reece James when it’s completely unwarranted. Mount isn’t some special case either. I’ve been equally critical towards Havertz. 
 

Chelsea fans, more than any other set of fans, have a tendency to hold on to past events to sway their perception. We saw it with Oscar which bought him an extra 2 seasons because of his ‘Juventus goals’. We saw it with Ruben which bought him half a decade because of his performance against Europa league opposition. And now we are seeing it with Mount where I’ve now seen about 300 times people using that night in Porto as justification along with stat padding against bottom half clubs. 

I’m still waiting for your response by the way where you claimed I said we don’t need a midfield that can defend. 

I was talking about you, not to you. If i was talking to you i would have @'d you.

I assume you were one of the fans at the Bridge under Mourinho with the 3 rat signs hounding Hazard, Costa and Fabregas out of the club because of their underperformance for a year? Luckily the club ignored you and we got to keep Hazard once he regained form and not just swapped him for the new flavour of the month. Mount has won back to back POTY awards, he's not just stealing a living off the back of one game in Porto like you claim. 

Just now, RIP Mourinho said:

I was talking about you, not to you. If i was talking to you i would have @'d you.

I assume you were one of the fans at the Bridge under Mourinho with the 3 rat signs hounding Hazard, Costa and Fabregas out of the club because of their underperformance for a year? Luckily the club ignored you and we got to keep Hazard once he regained form and not just swapped him for the new flavour of the month. Mount has won back to back POTY awards, he's not just stealing a living off the back of one game in Porto like you claim. 

I actually wanted Mourinho gone given how toxic he made the club. 

Strange how you never bring up Jorginho’s Uefa player of the year and being third in the Balon d’Or. 

On 21/12/2022 at 15:59, drjonesy1994 said:

I think defence of him is warranted though when he’s the one getting the majority of stick, despite everyone else being as bad if not worse. If we were running away with the league and mount was playing as badly as he is, then yeah by all means I think criticism of him on his own is warranted. The fact that everyone else is underperforming then it strikes me as bizarre and lazy to just single one player out. 

You might not praise him for that. Fine. Plenty do though. If it’s the bare minimum why don’t we press as efficiently when he’s not in the team? If it’s the bare minimum, then the minimum expectation should be that when he’s not playing we press as efficiently as when he is playing. That obviously doesn’t happen. 

Your last paragraph is where the problem lies. You think just because we’ve been successful for the last 20 years we have a right to be successful forever? It doesn’t work like that. No football club on the planet has that right. Mount has been a part of one of the most successful nights in the clubs history, and played a massive part in it as well. Given the chance I’d like to think he will be involved in plenty more. 

This is what happens with the new wave Chelsea fans that started supporting once we had the cash injection and started picking up silverware. As likely to go start supporting City as they are to stick by the club if all goes south for a few years. No identity with the club, just a use for bragging rights when accolades are won. Once they dry up, as does their 'support'.

2 minutes ago, Sconnie Blue said:

I actually wanted Mourinho gone given how toxic he made the club. 

Strange how you never bring up Jorginho’s Uefa player of the year and being third in the Balon d’Or. 

Weird, i thought this was the Mason Mount thread. Must have posted in the wrong one. 

Keep deflecting though champ.

1 minute ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Weird, i thought this was the Mason Mount thread. Must have posted in the wrong one. 

Keep deflecting though champ.

Deflecting or pointing out your inconsistencies? 

4 minutes ago, Sconnie Blue said:

Deflecting or pointing out your inconsistencies? 

Deflecting, quite clearly. @ me over on the Jorginho thread and i'll happily talk about his deficiencies over a 38 game league season if you wish. 

3 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Deflecting, quite clearly. @ me over on the Jorginho thread and i'll happily talk about his deficiencies over a 38 game league season if you wish. 

I mean the parallels are uncanny. You have a gripe with Jorginho allegedly not performing for 38 games and I have a gripe with Mount being bang average for all of 2022 and the latter parts of 2021. 

Only difference is that I am not justifying either of them on the back of their deserved or underserved player of the year/Uefa Player awards/

14 minutes ago, Sconnie Blue said:

I mean the parallels are uncanny. You have a gripe with Jorginho allegedly not performing for 38 games and I have a gripe with Mount being bang average for all of 2022 and the latter parts of 2021. 

Only difference is that I am not justifying either of them on the back of their deserved or underserved player of the year/Uefa Player awards/

pretty sure we were top of the league towards the back end of 2021? Reece and Chilly injuries derailed the season.

As mentioned before, Hazard had a year off and rightfully stayed and proved his worth. Mount hasn't been anywhere near that bad, just hasn't performed to his usual high standards. 

Jorginho on the other hand has several deficiencies in his game that have been evident over the 5 years he's been here, which aren't going to change at age 31.

1 minute ago, RIP Mourinho said:

As mentioned before, Hazard had a year off and rightfully stayed and proved his worth. Mount hasn't been anywhere near that bad, just hasn't performed to his usual high standards. 

To be honest you're not doing Mount any favours by comparing him to Hazard intentionally or otherwise.

For the avoidance of doubt I'm not "hating" on Mount but he will never reach that level.

2 minutes ago, RIP Mourinho said:

Jorginho on the other hand has several deficiencies in his game that have been evident over the 5 years he's been here, which aren't going to change at age 31.

Lucky we're (hopefully) upgrading his position in the next few days then.

I'd say I couldn't believe how poor he was today but I can. My main issue is he's a Chelsea lad through and through plus had the added motivation of the Forest fans on his back the whole game because of the Derby County connection, so surely he should be playing with a point to prove but nope, a rubbish weak performance yet again, almost like he doesn't give a toss. At least when he was underperforming previously he would at least put the effort in but now he doesn't even do that.

He's nothing more than a utility player for the standards we should be setting for our players, he needs to be replaced asap, along with pretty much everyone else if we're honest.

23 minutes ago, timetowaste said:

I'd say I couldn't believe how poor he was today but I can. My main issue is he's a Chelsea lad through and through plus had the added motivation of the Forest fans on his back the whole game because of the Derby County connection, so surely he should be playing with a point to prove but nope, a rubbish weak performance yet again, almost like he doesn't give a toss. At least when he was underperforming previously he would at least put the effort in but now he doesn't even do that.

He's nothing more than a utility player for the standards we should be setting for our players, he needs to be replaced asap, along with pretty much everyone else if we're honest.

When Mason Mount has lost faith in the team/coach and is half a$$ing it, we know we have a real problem. 

7 hours ago, axman2526 said:

When Mason Mount has lost faith in the team/coach and is half a$$ing it, we know we have a real problem. 

It could be put down to losing faith in the coach if this was recent, but he's looked like he's downed tools way before Potter joined, I think we do need to just accept the possibility that he was never that good to begin with

2 minutes ago, timetowaste said:

It could be put down to losing faith in the coach if this was recent, but he's looked like he's downed tools way before Potter joined, I think we do need to just accept the possibility that he was never that good to begin with

And/or there is so little in quality in addition around him that he has been overused and is burnt out. He has probably played double the amount of matches that he should have done by now.

Watching Mount, Sterling and Havertz give up halfway through the first half was worrying. They kept making runs, but other than the first few mi uses when he had a chance he pulled none of them received a pass, just kept running into space only to turn round and see the ball "recycled" back from midfield to centre backs, again and again and again. 

Attack is not the problem, a non existence midfield is.

7 minutes ago, dkw said:

just kept running into space only to turn round and see the ball "recycled" back from midfield to centre backs, again and again and again. 

Suspect it was instructions from the manager yesterday because why would Jorginho stay on for almost the entire game otherwise? We had good options on the bench in Kovacic and Gallagher who can both break forward with it. Or even Carney who's also capable of it.

On Mount i've noticed he's been subbed off quite a lot lately when we are chasing the game. Don't think the lad is particularly happy about that.

Edited January 2, 20233 yr by OriginalS