9 hours ago, charierre said:

 

 

His role on the wing means he suddenly has more defensive duties which will sap his energy, whilst back in Germany his former team mates are enjoying a nice two week break to recharge the batteries.

There is no nice two week break in Germany this year. The last matches were December 23rd and Bundesliga starts again January 2nd. So for the most teams the only holiday was the Xmas days and this weekend. 5 days. Today the most teams should be in team training again.

About his position... In my eyes he is no real centre forward and at Leipzig he usually had a partner in front in person of Poulsen or last year Schick, too. Even for Germany it is usually Gnabry that plays centrally. His main strength is his speed and hanging around the offside line waiting on balls behind it.

 

Edited December 28, 20205 yr by Maldeika

15 minutes ago, Maldeika said:

There is no nice two week break in Germany this year. The last matches were December 23rd and Bundesliga starts again January 2nd. So for the most teams the only holiday was the Xmas days and this weekend. 5 days. Today the most teams should be in team training again.

About his position... In my eyes he is no real centre forward and at Leipzig he usually had a partner in front in person of Poulsen or last year Schick, too. Even for Germany it is usually Gnabry that plays centrally. His main strength is his speed and hanging around the offside line waiting on balls behind it.

 

The issue is here, he's playing as a winger instead of an inside forward. 

With the system we play, we don't really give Werner the space to run onto the ball and run past defenses. He usually has to come deep and it's not playing to his strength. Whereas if he's playing as a striker, he has less responsibility to come back and can make more forward runs. 

At the moment, I don't think Werner fits into the side, he's completely out of form, he needs to sit out for at least two games and reevaluate. 

I made the point in the match thread, but Timo's movement is so good up front - and it is so frustrating to see his players fail to play the pass every time.

Today (against villa), on 3 occasions, he came a deep, drew people out of position, then spun and darted towards goal. Not one player we had even saw the run, let alone play the pass - instead all 3 who had the ball at the time (CHO, Mount, Kante) all took the easy option of either playing sideways/backwards or holding onto the ball too long.

Frustrating is an understatement. We need to play to players strengths. Lobbing crosses into the box for him to fight for is not going to work.

Just now, nonotnowjim said:

I made the point in the match thread, but Timo's movement is so good up front - and it is so frustrating to see his players fail to play the pass every time.

Today (against villa), on 3 occasions, he came a deep, drew people out of position, then spun and darted towards goal. Not one player we had even saw the run, let alone play the pass - instead all 3 who had the ball at the time (CHO, Mount, Kante) all took the easy option of either playing sideways/backwards or holding onto the ball too long.

Frustrating is an understatement. We need to play to players strengths. Lobbing crosses into the box for him to fight for is not going to work.

I noticed that twice myself. 

People comparing him to Torres or Morata are clueless. They were useless for years on end. He's had a bad couple of months, playing as a winger where he's asked to track up and down the line, rather than play to his strengths on the defenders shoulder, using his pace to get in behind them. Give him a run of games up front, with an actual attacking game plan besides crossing 100 times, and i'm pretty sure he'll improve and start scoring again.

He needs a Cesc

1 minute ago, Ballack & Blu said:

He needs a Cesc

Oh my god that would be completely unfair. Even more lethal than the Costa Fab combination imo.

1 minute ago, dansubrosa said:

Oh my god that would be completely unfair. Even more lethal than the Costa Fab combination imo.

We are talking Pirlo- Shevchenko 2004 era

13 minutes ago, Ballack & Blu said:

We are talking Pirlo- Shevchenko 2004 era

At the moment Werner is looking more like Schevchenko 2006-2009!!

He comes on immediately goes in between their CB paring looking for the ball over or through what do we f**king do slow down pass pass pass go the byline and cross FFS. I can see why he scored so many goals in Germany he’s a very clever player because as soon as he was on he split their CB but didn’t get any service us his f**king strengths 

Just now, Nibs said:

At the moment Werner is looking more like Schevchenko 2006-2009!!

I like to remember when he was brilliant, in my mind Roman never bought the once Russia owned Ukriane (Ukrainian plaything)

5 minutes ago, Brutos said:

He comes on immediately goes in between their CB paring looking for the ball over or through what do we f**king do slow down pass pass pass go the byline and cross FFS. I can see why he scored so many goals in Germany he’s a very clever player because as soon as he was on he split their CB but didn’t get any service us his f**king strengths 

At least Tuchel would know exactly how to try and get the best from Timo

5 minutes ago, Brutos said:

He comes on immediately goes in between their CB paring looking for the ball over or through what do we f**king do slow down pass pass pass go the byline and cross FFS. I can see why he scored so many goals in Germany he’s a very clever player because as soon as he was on he split their CB but didn’t get any service us his f**king strengths 

This. Exactly this. SO frustrating.

9 minutes ago, Nibs said:

At the moment Werner is looking more like Schevchenko 2006-2009!!

The thing is, when we were playing to his strengths (i.e him in the middle, playing him in at pace) he looked good. Sure, he still has a miss or 5 in him, but he was getting in enough scoring positions to mitigate against the misses. He was also getting assists, and winning pens.

But there has been a distinct shift in our play over the last 8 - 10 games, and we are no longer playing a game suited to him. We are slow, have stopped playing through balls for him to run on to, and instead taken to tippy tappy, play it around the back, knock it left to right 50 times, hoof it into the box.

This in turn reduced the number of chances he got, which meant that his misses were magnified. This was exacerbated by him playing out wide, and then compounded by a couple of shocking misses which appear to have played on his mind, to the extent that he seemed to have 2 left feet and forgot how to make a run or trap a ball.

When he came on today, he did make the runs again - its just that his team mates didnt see it, or if they did, chose the easier/safer backpass option.

Playing him in the middle alone isnt going to be the solution. We need to play faster, more progressive forward passes, earlier, for him to thrive.

At least he came on upfront, i mean thats something. Hopefully it wont be long for a front 3 of Pulisic Werner and Ziyech, things might click then.

36 minutes ago, jack_super_class said:

At least he came on upfront, i mean thats something. Hopefully it wont be long for a front 3 of Pulisic Werner and Ziyech, things might click then.

Ziyech might be the key here because he thinks quickly and plays quickly Jorginho does like a quick ball over the top but it seems he’s been told to play to the wing

Imagine if he had scored with that shot that he took from inside the box... That's 680+ minutes without scoring and by the looks of it it will only increase in the next game.

By the end of the season Werner will be officially a flop if this continues. 

He still got a long season in front of him, his position is a striker and not a winger.

If Lampard is bought him for the winger, then we could bring much better options. If Lampard was looking for him as a striker, then he has to play there.

So far he's disappointing, but I believe he's a very good player that will give us the goals we have been looking for.

4 hours ago, nonotnowjim said:

I made the point in the match thread, but Timo's movement is so good up front - and it is so frustrating to see his players fail to play the pass every time.

Today (against villa), on 3 occasions, he came a deep, drew people out of position, then spun and darted towards goal. Not one player we had even saw the run, let alone play the pass - instead all 3 who had the ball at the time (CHO, Mount, Kante) all took the easy option of either playing sideways/backwards or holding onto the ball too long.

Frustrating is an understatement. We need to play to players strengths. Lobbing crosses into the box for him to fight for is not going to work.

THIS. Surely Mount has this in his locker? And playing deeper nearer to Kante was supposed to help this.

3 hours ago, nonotnowjim said:

This. Exactly this. SO frustrating.

It is painfully obvious, the players need to be smart enough the recognize the best service for their striker. 

Giroud needs crosses and balla to his head.

Tammy needs to in to chest or feet

Timo needs it in behind. It is not rocket science but our players can be braindead at times as displayed in the game at Arsenal.

13 hours ago, Gol15 said:

magine if he had scored with that shot that he took from inside the box... That's 680+ minutes without scoring and by the looks of it it will only increase in the next game.

He really should have scored. I'd expect top strikers to score from there, or at the very, very least hit the goal and make the goalkeeper work.

He has been a huge let down so far. Wether he’s playing on wing or striker, he missed so many bloody chances. It’s not good enough, especially looking at his record in Germany. I’m fully expecting him and Havertz to do much better in second half of the season, I mean they can’t really do any worse can they?

On 28/12/2020 at 19:56, nonotnowjim said:

I made the point in the match thread, but Timo's movement is so good up front - and it is so frustrating to see his players fail to play the pass every time.

Today (against villa), on 3 occasions, he came a deep, drew people out of position, then spun and darted towards goal. Not one player we had even saw the run, let alone play the pass - instead all 3 who had the ball at the time (CHO, Mount, Kante) all took the easy option of either playing sideways/backwards or holding onto the ball too long.

Frustrating is an understatement. We need to play to players strengths. Lobbing crosses into the box for him to fight for is not going to work.

Lack of a creative midfielder. 

As good as Mount has been, he isn't top drawer like it or not. 

On 28/12/2020 at 19:56, nonotnowjim said:

I made the point in the match thread, but Timo's movement is so good up front - and it is so frustrating to see his players fail to play the pass every time.

Today (against villa), on 3 occasions, he came a deep, drew people out of position, then spun and darted towards goal. Not one player we had even saw the run, let alone play the pass - instead all 3 who had the ball at the time (CHO, Mount, Kante) all took the easy option of either playing sideways/backwards or holding onto the ball too long.

Frustrating is an understatement. We need to play to players strengths. Lobbing crosses into the box for him to fight for is not going to work.

If Jorginho had the ball, he would have made the pass. He's probably one of the few players we have that can see to make a ball like that.

2 minutes ago, driller97 said:

If Jorginho had the ball, he would have made the pass. He's probably one of the few players we have that can see to make a ball like that.

I would agree but not this season, Jorginho looks lost at the moment whenever he plays. Plays well for about 10 minutes and that's it, he can't stop losing the ball.