4 hours ago, Shug said:

Silva will take a massive salary, find it hard in the premiership, where every game is a big one, unlike France where he coasts every week as PSG are so far ahead of everyone else.

Liverpool just won a title 18 points ahead of their nearest, billion-dollar-team rival. But even City is a million miles away from Leicester, Man U or Chelsea. We're spending over £200m to try and address that gap!

The EPL is unfortunately just as uncompetitive as any other league out there.

1 hour ago, SydneyChelsea said:

Liverpool just won a title 18 points ahead of their nearest, billion-dollar-team rival. But even City is a million miles away from Leicester, Man U or Chelsea. We're spending over £200m to try and address that gap!

The EPL is unfortunately just as uncompetitive as any other league out there.

Yeah i find it hilarious that the PL is seen as some bastion of competitivity, especially these days.

Look at the last 6 years, 5 runaway Champions and the one year there was actually a race the two challengers were pushing 100 points nearly 30 points above 3rd place, oh and each of the last 4 Champions have got over 90 points with 30 plus wins.

Any other league produces those type of stats it would be the final proof it's a farmers league that can't match upto the PL!

1 hour ago, SydneyChelsea said:

Liverpool just won a title 18 points ahead of their nearest, billion-dollar-team rival. But even City is a million miles away from Leicester, Man U or Chelsea. We're spending over £200m to try and address that gap!

The EPL is unfortunately just as uncompetitive as any other league out there.

i disagree, theres been 5 different winners in the last 10 seasons in england. 

spain has 3, germany 2, italy 2, and france has 4 although psg have won 7 of last 8 since being taken over. 

Liverpool ran away with it last season, but no one team dominates for an extended period, its alot more competitive than the rest of the big leagues.

4 minutes ago, Argo said:

Yeah i find it hilarious that the PL is seen as some bastion of competitivity, especially these days.

Look at the last 6 years, 5 runaway Champions and the one year there was actually a race the two challengers were pushing 100 points nearly 30 points above 3rd place, oh and each of the last 4 Champions have got over 90 points with 30 plus wins.

Any other league produces those type of stats it would be the final proof it's a farmers league that can't match upto the PL!

Its rarely the same team though, it competitive because theres more teams that compete for titles over here, even if over the course of the season teams have ran away with it. 

In 5 years time it might be arsenal and united back challenging over here, where as in the other leagues it will be the same 1 or 2 sides as it has been for years. 

So the competitive spirit of knowing that if you build a good team you have a chance, is much stronger in this country.

1 hour ago, big blue said:

i disagree, theres been 5 different winners in the last 10 seasons in england. 

spain has 3, germany 2, italy 2, and france has 4 although psg have won 7 of last 8 since being taken over. 

Liverpool ran away with it last season, but no one team dominates for an extended period, its alot more competitive than the rest of the big leagues.

That's not really what the poster is arguing though, they're implying that the league is more competitive on a game-by-game basis when reality shows otherwise.  1, maybe 2 big spending teams dominate the league and win most of their games comfortably, which is no different to anywhere else. The last time the league was 'competitive' was when Leicester won it.

Yes, the financial model of the EPL allows for a pool of teams to become competitive, given the right signings etc. but recent history shows that the teams competing for the title have consistently been far ahead of the rest.

 

Edited August 23, 20205 yr by SydneyChelsea

9 minutes ago, SydneyChelsea said:

That's not really what the poster is arguing though, they're implying that the league is more competitive on a game-by-game basis when reality shows otherwise.  1, maybe 2 big spending teams dominate the league and win most of their games comfortably, which is no different to anywhere else. The last time the league was 'competitive' was when Leicester won it.

Yes, the financial model of the EPL allows for a pool of teams to become competitive, given the right signings etc. but recent history shows that the teams competing for the title have consistently been far ahead of the rest.

 

Not at all a competitive league means you don’t know who’s going to win it and in the past 5 years Chelsea, Leicester, City and Liverpool have won it. 
 

Doesn't have to be neck and neck each year to be competitive it has to be that you don’t know who could win it. 
 

Do you know who will win next year or better yet the year after? 
 

Well I’ll tell you in France it will be PSG in Germany it will be Bayern and in Spain only 2 teams can ever win it. Italy is now far more competitive. But no where else. 
 

13 minutes ago, SFL82 said:

Not at all a competitive league means you don’t know who’s going to win it and in the past 5 years Chelsea, Leicester, City and Liverpool have won it. 
 

Doesn't have to be neck and neck each year to be competitive it has to be that you don’t know who could win it. 
 

Do you know who will win next year or better yet the year after? 
 

Well I’ll tell you in France it will be PSG in Germany it will be Bayern and in Spain only 2 teams can ever win it. Italy is now far more competitive. But no where else. 
 

It might mean that to you, however it's not what the original poster was arguing

5 hours ago, big blue said:

Its rarely the same team though, it competitive because theres more teams that compete for titles over here, even if over the course of the season teams have ran away with it. 

In 5 years time it might be arsenal and united back challenging over here, where as in the other leagues it will be the same 1 or 2 sides as it has been for years. 

So the competitive spirit of knowing that if you build a good team you have a chance, is much stronger in this country.

The teams may switch about a bit more often (which is largely down to excessive TV money and excellent owners willing to put their money were there mouth is, take those away United would be walking the PL every year to an even bigger extent Bayern and Paris do theirs) but in general it's amounts to the same thing, their's 1 or 2 outstanding teams and the rest are okay to smack.

Plus i don't buy the narrative that the quality throughout the league is so much better than the other major league's. Aguero, Silva, Mata, Alonso (Xavi and Marcos), Torres, Cazorla, Drogba, Hazard, Firmino, Salah, Alderwierld, Sanchez, Pulisic, Henry, Bergkamp, Vieira, Pires, Auba, Kante, Cech, Essien, Carvalho, Diego Costa, Fabregas, Son, Yaya Toure all examples of players who did better in the Prem than the so called easier league's they were in before and/or after and that's just off the top of my head, if our league was so much better, it just wouldn't happen so often.

In my opinion both the competitive and (overall) quality elements of the PL are and always have been hugely overrated.

If we sign him, it's either the greatest short-term signing in our history, or a complete was of money. He will be be the leader in the back, even at 45. I'm sure we will do better in dealing with set pieces etc. He won't be spring chicken, but will be able to hold his own against most attackers, if our defence system is build around his strength. I could see Zouma, James etc be better defenders with Silva around, they just need to do what the experienced man tells. On the downside, he played in a team that never had to worry about defence on most weekends. PSG has never been a great defensive team, and they never need to be. The EPL will be a big challenge to him, especially at the tender age of 35. It's a long tough season, he won't have the winter break, won't have the luxury of those 'easy games'. Once in a while, he will be on his own against a Rashford of Mane, whether he still has the legs in him it's a big unknown.

4 hours ago, Argo said:

The teams may switch about a bit more often (which is largely down to excessive TV money and excellent owners willing to put their money were there mouth is, take those away United would be walking the PL every year to an even bigger extent Bayern and Paris do theirs) but in general it's amounts to the same thing, their's 1 or 2 outstanding teams and the rest are okay to smack.

Plus i don't buy the narrative that the quality throughout the league is so much better than the other major league's. Aguero, Silva, Mata, Alonso (Xavi and Marcos), Torres, Cazorla, Drogba, Hazard, Firmino, Salah, Alderwierld, Sanchez, Pulisic, Henry, Bergkamp, Vieira, Pires, Auba, Kante, Cech, Essien, Carvalho, Diego Costa, Fabregas, Son, Yaya Toure all examples of players who did better in the Prem than the so called easier league's they were in before and/or after and that's just off the top of my head, if our league was so much better, it just wouldn't happen so often.

In my opinion both the competitive and (overall) quality elements of the PL are and always have been hugely overrated.

I think the big thing you missed, and I get to an extent what you’re saying, is a bottom half team will regularly beat a top 4 team throughout the year, so every game is a challenge.

This just isn’t the case in other Leagues. So when you have a 4 or 5 team balance of power through say a 5 year cycle and the fact every game is potentially a banana skin it’s just far harder and more competitive.

That is down to one thing and you touched on it, tv money, we distribute it so even bottom teams get enough to be competitive, whereas is other leagues, especially Spain the top team or two gets the lion share and everyone else gets a trickle. 

10 hours ago, big blue said:

i disagree, theres been 5 different winners in the last 10 seasons in england. 

spain has 3, germany 2, italy 2, and france has 4 although psg have won 7 of last 8 since being taken over. 

Liverpool ran away with it last season, but no one team dominates for an extended period, its alot more competitive than the rest of the big leagues.

This.

Even the relegation zone teams can beat the top 6 on any given week. In Spain the smaller teams play Barca or Real and they often rest players as know they are going to lose and want to make sure they win against similar teams the following week.

Liverpool ran away last season. Same as others have done other years, but it’s their first win for 30 years.

Spain is normally one of two teams, Germany BM or one other, France PSG, but like Scotland where it’s nearly always Celtic or Rangers with the odd random winner very occasionally.

 

 

Edited August 23, 20205 yr by Shug

Compare the Real Madrid results this season and Liverpool's, where has been the competition?

 

Well this is an endless discussion. Even tho you made a good point about the competition and the bottom teams,  the better teams in Spain, Germany, France and Italy are far more often way better than the best English clubs. Liverpool was the exception for the last 13 years. They were indeed the best club in the world for one year. Even when we lifted CL we were total underdogs with the greatest forward and one of the greatest seasons by a legendary goalie. And this pretty much sums up all the success in ECT. I don't count our Europa League trophies as an achievement of PL, we were too good to be in EL at first place and we got there after a failure in CL. Also every time a club of mid table caliber in PL goes to Europa, they are a laughing stock - Arsenal, Everton, Southampton, Newcastle, Stoke, Tottenham, Wolverhampton. They had so many 'runs' in Europa League some even in CL, they are laughing stock each time. Clubs like Atletico, Sevilla, Villareal, Eintracht, Leverkuzen, Napoli - I remember them being knocked out by teams like that more often than the other way around. 

IMO Premier league is the best to watch but far from the best in quality. 

PL used to have the big 4 and that changed a bit in recent years when Spurs finished in top 4 for a couple of seasons, also the spending of Man City and the end of an era for ManUtd and Arsenal influenced that.

Serie A used to have the 2 Milano teams, Juventus and 1 team from Rome but Juventus has now won for so many years, in the past every Italian team used to have a legend, now they rely on foreign players and they missed out on the recent World Cup which is a big sign that something is wrong.

La Liga is all about Barca and Real Madrid, Atletico spends a lot and managed to win once but mainly Barcelona won the league and Real Madrid won in Europe.

Bundesliga is basically Bayern just like Juventus in Serie A, a long time ago Dortmund won 2 times in a row and that's it.

The French league used to have different winners but PSG just overspent and they are also like Juventus and Bayern.

The simple fact that it's hard to defend the PL title makes the PL a much harder competition.

1 hour ago, RMH said:

Compare the Real Madrid results this season and Liverpool's, where has been the competition?

 

That is the exception to the rule. 

La liga hasnt had a champion with less than 90 points since 2009. 

Over here we have had 5 champions with less than 90 points in the same period. 

So for the last decade, the winners of our league usually dropp more points than in spain. 

Didn't Leicester win the league a couple of years ago?

Imagine something like that happening in Spain.

Silva is quality, but a 35 year old in the highline? I'm not sure he's going to do the job here. Lampard needs fast defenders. 

2 hours ago, Shug said:

This.

Even the relegation zone teams can beat the top 6 on any given week. In Spain the smaller teams play Barca or Real and they often rest players as know they are going to lose and want to make sure they win against similar teams the following week.

 

 

I have no idea where you got this info from, but its almost a complete opposite to reality. In spain especially in recent seasons everyone is beating everyone. 

13 hours ago, big blue said:

i disagree, theres been 5 different winners in the last 10 seasons in england. 

spain has 3, germany 2, italy 2, and france has 4 although psg have won 7 of last 8 since being taken over. 

Liverpool ran away with it last season, but no one team dominates for an extended period, its alot more competitive than the rest of the big leagues.

The sad thing about France is that they have a really good national first 11 but almost all of them plays outside of France

36 minutes ago, Slojo said:

Silva is quality, but a 35 year old in the highline? I'm not sure he's going to do the job here. Lampard needs fast defenders. 

We have fast defenders we don’t have organised ones, that’s his role, organising the back line with fast defenders round him.

If he managed to get to the CL final as captain of one of the top teams in Europe we can’t say he won’t do a job in the PL, let alone improve one of the worst defences in the league, doesn’t make sense. 

End of the day, if we sign him it will either be a great success, a question mark or a Winston Bogarde.

 

We can all have opinions but only time will tell

I think people are thinking he will come in and play all 38 PL games, I reckon he comes in and plays approximately 20 games. Games against physical teams where we will need organisation from set pieces and maybe against the better teams where we are more likely to be on the back foot. 

Giving players like Tomori, Gueyi & the new lad Muyamba another year to develop will be invaluable. 

I’m all for steadying the ship and his experience would be great however as others have correctly pointed out, he is not a player who is going to flourish in a high back line. He would be more suited to a low block defence and it is unlikely we will use this approach often. 

7 hours ago, SFL82 said:

I think the big thing you missed, and I get to an extent what you’re saying, is a bottom half team will regularly beat a top 4 team throughout the year, so every game is a challenge.

This just isn’t the case in other Leagues. So when you have a 4 or 5 team balance of power through say a 5 year cycle and the fact every game is potentially a banana skin it’s just far harder and more competitive.

That is down to one thing and you touched on it, tv money, we distribute it so even bottom teams get enough to be competitive, whereas is other leagues, especially Spain the top team or two gets the lion share and everyone else gets a trickle. 

But it does happen in other league's, one major example would be Barcelona going just shy of 11 years without a win away to Real Sociedad (including four losses on the spin), for context that's longer than any unbeaten run we've had against a big six side at The Bridge in the Roman era bar Spurs.