25 minutes ago, EdinburghBlue said:

De Bruyne is probably one of a handful of players (if that) which can punish you from that range with a free kick. Most of them will be fired in to the wall or the stand. 
 

I would rather he fouled the player than allowed them to back our centre half in the box in a one on one.

Agreed but Christensen was already there to win the ball. 

As you say, De Bruyne is one of the few people who could have scored that, so shouldn't Kante have thought 'hmm perhaps maybe i shouldn't foul here against this team'. 

Just seems a bit senseless to me. He did a few others too throughout the night. 

Season interupted by injury, but has looked poor for the most part when he has played. I think at the moment Kovacic brings more to the team, he has a lot of energy to get around as well, but has the technical and passing ability Kante doesn't. Hopefully next season we'll see a refreshed and injury-free Kante.

26 minutes ago, big blue said:

i agree in principle, although that was the wrong decision last night, Christiansen had already stepped in to win the ball. 

He did the exact same thing against Villa. The defender was winning the ball and Kante fouls. 

The reason for the foul was because each player knew he wasn't going anywhere and started to look for a kick from behind. KDB and Grealish both smart enough to know how to do this. Kante wasn't smart enough on either occasion to spot what was happening. 

43 minutes ago, EdinburghBlue said:

De Bruyne is probably one of a handful of players (if that) which can punish you from that range with a free kick. Most of them will be fired in to the wall or the stand. 
 

I would rather he fouled the player than allowed them to back our centre half in the box in a one on one.

Also doesn't help when you got a keeper who gets across to the ball, then decides to take his hands away!

3 minutes ago, chi blue said:

Also doesn't help when you got a keeper who gets across to the ball, then decides to take his hands away!

He wasn't going to reach it anyway.

I don't have the stats back it up, but just watching him this year, seems to committed more fouls and lost out more duels than say 12-18 months ago. I reckon it's just the result of him being played more higher up the field, he's gaining in attac but will lose his defensive abilities.

1 hour ago, Zeta said:

He wasn't going to reach it anyway.

That's worrying considering the ball was only halfway up the net and from 30 yards, hardly a Ronaldo free kick against Pompey a few years back at Old Trafford.

The foul tonight wasn't a good decison (I'm not sure if it was tactical foul or not) but beyond that he was great. 

All season City have opened teams up by interchanging fullbacks, wingers and midfielders to create third man runs into the channel. Kante was so good tracking runners into those areas. The extra mobility just allowed us to cover City's options.

There will be lots of chat about build up play and registas etc. But in all honesty we had 35 percent of the ball so that wasnt overly important. Its notable how much more solid defensively we have been since the restart. Hard not to think that Kante being in his traditional role has played a big part in that improvement.

1 hour ago, Spiller86 said:

The foul tonight wasn't a good decison (I'm not sure if it was tactical foul or not) but beyond that he was great. 

All season City have opened teams up by interchanging fullbacks, wingers and midfielders to create third man runs into the channel. Kante was so good tracking runners into those areas. The extra mobility just allowed us to cover City's options.

There will be lots of chat about build up play and registas etc. But in all honesty we had 35 percent of the ball so that wasnt overly important. Its notable how much more solid defensively we have been since the restart. Hard not to think that Kante being in his traditional role has played a big part in that improvement.

We were already improving in that regard, Liverpool and Everton barely got a sniff against us, same with Spurs not long before that.

He was good against Villa, but very poor yesterday, especially in the 2nd half. I like him to play deeper, but I don't like him being in the central role, his distribution isn't good enough. 

I agree with @Argo he should be playing RCM/LCM, just as long as he isn't lingering up top all the time. 

5 hours ago, Spiller86 said:

The foul tonight wasn't a good decison (I'm not sure if it was tactical foul or not) but beyond that he was great. 

All season City have opened teams up by interchanging fullbacks, wingers and midfielders to create third man runs into the channel. Kante was so good tracking runners into those areas. The extra mobility just allowed us to cover City's options.

There will be lots of chat about build up play and registas etc. But in all honesty we had 35 percent of the ball so that wasnt overly important. Its notable how much more solid defensively we have been since the restart. Hard not to think that Kante being in his traditional role has played a big part in that improvement.

Better defensively? Yesterday yes, because we were sitting deep and City had no number 9. But Villa was just more of the same as we've seen all season, particularly since December, we were shocking at the back. 

Kante made 0 tackles and 3 interceptions while many times miss passing in dangerous areas, watching the game again without the raw emotion i'm even more convinced (if that's even possible) he's not for that position. If Lampard keeps persisting with this experiment it will ruin all the excellent work (in evolutionary terms) he's done up to this point, i'm sorry to keep repeating myself but it has to be Jorgi or Billy there.

17 hours ago, Argo said:

We were already improving in that regard, Liverpool and Everton barely got a sniff against us, same with Spurs not long before that.

Well there is another link between our last four games and our defensive stability. But I prefer not to speak.

In any case NGolo at the base of midfield gets the best out of him and also has allowed us to experiment more with our number 8s. Barkley and Mount against City were great at making third man runs into the channel. Created all sorts of issues.

19 hours ago, chi blue said:

That's worrying considering the ball was only halfway up the net and from 30 yards, hardly a Ronaldo free kick against Pompey a few years back at Old Trafford.

What game did you watch. Half way up the net? look at the trajectory of the ball. No keeper saves that. 

 

6 hours ago, Argo said:

Kante made 0 tackles and 3 interceptions while many times miss passing in dangerous areas, watching the game again without the raw emotion i'm even more convinced (if that's even possible) he's not for that position. If Lampard keeps persisting with this experiment it will ruin all the excellent work (in evolutionary terms) he's done up to this point, i'm sorry to keep repeating myself but it has to be Jorgi or Billy there.

The more I see him play this season the more I think that if that offer comes at whatever his acceptable price tag would be that the club will sell him to fund further purchases.

Not sure if they would be the right decision given his injuries and corona but I think he has declined slightly over the last 18 months but on his day is still a monster in midfield.

29 minutes ago, big blue said:

What game did you watch. Half way up the net? look at the trajectory of the ball. No keeper saves that. 

 

Hits the net no where near top corner, if it was like  pile driver that hits stanchion fair play, but we are talking a prem keeper who collapses with no spring and arms taken away, now I don't proffess to be a goalkeeping expert, and hate criticizing keepers as played county football in goal for years, but just to many mistakes and things done wrong, maybe it's the keeper coach? Hope he comes good though.

57 minutes ago, chi blue said:

Hits the net no where near top corner, if it was like  pile driver that hits stanchion fair play, but we are talking a prem keeper who collapses with no spring and arms taken away, now I don't proffess to be a goalkeeping expert, and hate criticizing keepers as played county football in goal for years, but just to many mistakes and things done wrong, maybe it's the keeper coach? Hope he comes good though.

It crosses the line at the point that is frozen. It is dipping into the top corner at pace. As you say, your no keeper expert, yet not a single ex pro has criticised Kepa for that goal, if he had saved it, it wouldve been the save of the season. 

I would 100% sell kepa, but the criticism for the last 2 goals we have conceded is totally unwarranted, 

1 hour ago, big blue said:

What game did you watch. Half way up the net? look at the trajectory of the ball. No keeper saves that. 

 

Looking at those two pictures, I think his arms would have to be twice as long as they are for Kepa to be reaching that. You can see the relative length of his arm extended in the first pic, Super impose that arm sticking out of his shoulder straight up in the second pic and he is still nowhere near it. Sometimes you just have to praise the quality of the hit, rather than look for blame in the goalkeeper. The mistake was in conceding a foul in such a dangerous area, when the opponent has such an effective specialist free kick taker.

I do think Kepa is a bit short for a specialist keeper mind you ... although not sure even someone like Cech or Courtois at 6'5"/6'6" could have got to that one.

23 hours ago, chi blue said:

That's worrying considering the ball was only halfway up the net and from 30 yards, hardly a Ronaldo free kick against Pompey a few years back at Old Trafford.

You are kidding right? There is no way anyone would save that freekick. I doubt even Crouch at GK could save that

You'd have to be able to see the future to save it. The height and dip of the freekick was amazing.

 

5 hours ago, Spiller86 said:

Well there is another link between our last four games and our defensive stability. But I prefer not to speak.

In any case NGolo at the base of midfield gets the best out of him and also has allowed us to experiment more with our number 8s. Barkley and Mount against City were great at making third man runs into the channel. Created all sorts of issues.

If you mean Jorgi well there's a trade off with him. Granted he's not the best defensively off all time but with him there we keep the ball better and build up better. With Kante we on the whole get a lot of his negatives without reaping the rewards of the positives.

And even if we take Jorgi out of the picture there's Gilmour who's perfect for that position in both phases of the game, people may counter me and say it's only two great games, but it's two more than Kante's had as a holder.

4 hours ago, Argo said:

If you mean Jorgi well there's a trade off with him. Granted he's not the best defensively off all time but with him there we keep the ball better and build up better. With Kante we on the whole get a lot of his negatives without reaping the rewards of the positives.

And even if we take Jorgi out of the picture there's Gilmour who's perfect for that position in both phases of the game, people may counter me and say it's only two great games, but it's two more than Kante's had as a holder.

You can't actually prove that there is a player currently in our squad at Jorghy's position that is better defensivly than him. 

Most tackles made, most interceptions made and on top of it most through balls passed while Kante has made 0 through balls this season. He's simply not a deep lying playmaker he has been a box to box midfielder his whole life.

12 hours ago, Argo said:

If you mean Jorgi well there's a trade off with him. Granted he's not the best defensively off all time but with him there we keep the ball better and build up better. With Kante we on the whole get a lot of his negatives without reaping the rewards of the positives.

And even if we take Jorgi out of the picture there's Gilmour who's perfect for that position in both phases of the game, people may counter me and say it's only two great games, but it's two more than Kante's had as a holder.

Naturally I disagree, but there really is just a difference in view on how we might play. I think the regista role is less important and an happy to prioritise defensive stability over neat build up that all goes through one player. You prefer the build up through the 6 over the extra defensive stability. 

I'm happy to live and let live on this. 

Watching highlights of today’s game just further made me concerned Kante is on the decline, we’ve said he’s injured, we’ve said he’s been unfit, we’ve said he’s been rushed back to early and now we’re saying he’s being played out of position when that was also the argument when he was playing RCM like a lunatic right winger. It happens to players they can be world class for years and then all of a sudden they don’t ever hit close to them levels wayyyy wayyy way before there peak, we should know that better than any team having watched Torres tear us a new one and then he signs for us and was just like a timid tortured kitten. 
 

look at how both of those players rely on there freakish physical attributes of speed and mobility to literally look levels above the players they play against, it’s a shame but Kante IMO won’t hit the same levels for us or even close. 

60% win rate.

PSA: 'What is Kanté's natural position?' has officially reached the Top 10 of 'Most tedious Shed End debates of all time'.