5 minutes ago, Slojo said:

Good, playing it out from the back is extremely underrated on this forum. It's part of Lampards philosophy and I'm glad, there's nothing more demoralising for the opposition when you're chasing shadows, it's a very effective way to play football. 

And it serves to tire out the opposition attack, means they end up being less likely to score later on. It's definitely a factor in our high clean sheet ratio (8 in 10 games)... 

2 hours ago, Shweaves said:

And it serves to tire out the opposition attack, means they end up being less likely to score later on. It's definitely a factor in our high clean sheet ratio (8 in 10 games)... 

It's funny to me. There was a moment against Spuds where N'Dombele was clearly showing his frustration after Kova went on with the ball, and he did it to Salah and a few others last season as well.

Not much to say about yesterdays game other than Kovacic is on a streak with very good performances, even made a pre-assist and an assist. Sevilla was already broken when he went off the pitch. For me he's one of the first names on the teamsheet with what he offers, since I think Mount&Havertz is too offensive and Jorgi&Kante is too defensive. I think Lamps is starting to really appreciate him, especially with the congestion of fixtures coming up and the younger players likely to drop off in the latter part of the season.

28 minutes ago, Vagabond said:

It's funny to me. There was a moment against Spuds where N'Dombele was clearly showing his frustration after Kova went on with the ball, and he did it to Salah and a few others last season as well.

Not much to say about yesterdays game other than Kovacic is on a streak with very good performances, even made a pre-assist and an assist. Sevilla was already broken when he went off the pitch. For me he's one of the first names on the teamsheet with what he offers, since I think Mount&Havertz is too offensive and Jorgi&Kante is too defensive. I think Lamps is starting to really appreciate him, especially with the congestion of fixtures coming up and the younger players likely to drop off in the latter part of the season.

100% agree, thats why i think Kova should always play when we play the top 6 especially.

3 hours ago, jack_super_class said:

100% agree, thats why i think Kova should always play when we play the top 6 especially.

It's like fighting a boxer with a good chin (Not sure if anyone caught hat Dubois and Joyce fight over a week ago but that's a classic example) you give them all your best hits and you've done nothing to them, and in return you're shattered and you feel pathetic. 

Your manager tells you to press their defence and win the ball back, the first half you've done absolutely nothing but tire yourself out. People who dislike that style of play usually don't understand it, usually the ones who will go "Stop pissing about with it and hoof it up in the air". Any team can have a physical prescence, but not every team can have the abillity and technique to control the game, that's usually what seperates the better teams. 

Idk if people have noticed but Kovacic and Jorginho pressing high has been adjusted a bit. Jorginho is more often the one pressing the highest up the pitch while Kovacic is near the centre and when Kovacic is chasing the ball Jorginho is deeper in our half.

Kovacic is more effective without the ball now, his positioning got better and he's making more interceptions. When we don't have control over the ball now we are more dangerous because it takes just a second for us to organize an attack going, we are way more fluid than before specially when we play without pressure.

17 hours ago, Slojo said:

It's like fighting a boxer with a good chin (Not sure if anyone caught hat Dubois and Joyce fight over a week ago but that's a classic example) you give them all your best hits and you've done nothing to them, and in return you're shattered and you feel pathetic. 

Your manager tells you to press their defence and win the ball back, the first half you've done absolutely nothing but tire yourself out. People who dislike that style of play usually don't understand it, usually the ones who will go "Stop pissing about with it and hoof it up in the air". Any team can have a physical prescence, but not every team can have the abillity and technique to control the game, that's usually what seperates the better teams. 

I think having periods in the game where we control the game through possession and keeping our shape is another area we have hugely improved in comparison to last season. It allows the team a bit of a breather and avoids periods in games where we get camped in our half and find it difficult to get out. Last season we played fast pace direct football and would look incredible for a 20-30 minute period and completely emptied the tank resulting in getting dominated for the remainder of the half.

I think the credit can be attributed to the coaching staff and some of the senior figures on field.

Not sure what Kovacic brings to the side anymore. I’ve defended him constantly but he doesn’t offer much. I think he is one we should look at selling - fees for him and Jorginho should net enough to make a run at Rice in the summer.

19 minutes ago, mwblue10 said:

Not sure what Kovacic brings to the side anymore. I’ve defended him constantly but he doesn’t offer much. I think he is one we should look at selling - fees for him and Jorginho should net enough to make a run at Rice in the summer.

Agree but I don't think we should sell him, handy squad player, still has his uses. But not having a good season at all. 

To be honest, I think he's just useless in a midfield 3, we saw in his first season here that he didn't provide much in one. He plays better in the pivot. 

1 minute ago, Slojo said:

Agree but I don't think we should sell him, handy squad player, still has his uses. But not having a good season at all. 

To be honest, I think he's just useless in a midfield 3, we saw in his first season here that he didn't provide much in one. He plays better in the pivot. 

I typically would tend to agree with you, you make a good point. This City game is on where I would expect him to be useful, particularly keeping possession in tight spaces against their press. But he’s been useless.

You’re right though, probably should keep him as a squad player.

His performance today was bizarre. 

He's not a world class player by any means but you can usually rely on his dribbling and being press resistant, looked like a completely different player out there. Extremely low on confidence.

1 minute ago, Remodez said:

His performance today was bizarre. 

He's not a world class player by any means but you can usually rely on his dribbling and being press resistant, looked like a completely different player out there. Extremely low on confidence.

I wonder what happened to him. He won POTY last season but has never gotten into second gear this season. He wasn't played much in the first games of the season I wonder if this has something to do with it. 

Get rid.

Has been garbage this season, id still keep him though, good squad player.

He can be good and is a handy squad player but at times like today he looks so average and ineffective when you compare him to the sort of quality that Man City have.

 

Good last season but looks like a player Real Madrid wouldn’t want to keep for most of this season.

Would like to upgrade with someone like Rice, trouble is will the board give Frank more money to replace.

People saying can be good? Keep as a squad player? I'm sorry but anybody name an occasion Kovash*t has won a game for us

I think we are doing no more than looking to tread water keeping players like Kovacic and Jorginho. They are mid table players which is what we are right now and where we will end up finishing if some big changes aren't made. 

I see no real benefit in keeping them. They are holding back the likes of Gilmour and will never ever be consistent quality performers. 

I believe in the saying that you’re only as strong as your weakest team member.

If he’s the level we look to as a starter or even a squad member then we will ultimately reap what we sow.

8 minutes ago, loz said:

I think we are doing no more than looking to tread water keeping players like Kovacic and Jorginho. They are mid table players which is what we are right now and where we will end up finishing if some big changes aren't made. 

I see no real benefit in keeping them. They are holding back the likes of Gilmour and will never ever be consistent quality performers. 

I watched Gilmour away to Leicester in the FA cup last season and he was awful. Our fans always seem to rate the players who dont play much. Tomori is another one.

1 minute ago, jack_super_class said:

I watched Gilmour away to Leicester in the FA cup last season and he was awful. Our fans always seem to rate the players who dont play much. Tomori is another one.

Yeah it's a load of rubbish, there must be a word coined for this somewhere, but it's how people overstate what youngsters do and hype them up after one game that they pretend their on a higher level than senior and experienced players almost instantly. I wanted Gilmour to start for something different, but if Kovacic or any other senior player had a game like that against Leicester, people wouldn't want to see them play in a Chelsea shirt again. 

And his game against Everton was just a standard day in the office for what Kovacic was doing last season, but because he was 18, you're more impressed. Great game against Liverpool though, have to give him that. 

4 minutes ago, jack_super_class said:

I watched Gilmour away to Leicester in the FA cup last season and he was awful. Our fans always seem to rate the players who dont play much. Tomori is another one.

He is just a boy though. Clearly has shown he has potential but it will be wasted if he doesn't get playing time. And if he can't get it when the players ahead of him are playing this poorly then be will never get it. He merits a chance. 

I think given the game time he is likely to get wonder if he sent the wrong player on loan.. Barkley when for does provide something on the other end .. I don’t want to knock him down given the irregular game time he has for but for me I don’t see what he brings to the team.. he is not a regista doesn’t have the range or vision not a 10 can’t shoot or assist not a 8 can’t really time his runs and doesn’t have the best engine either.. I really don’t understand his best position..

Just now, loz said:

He is just a boy though. Clearly has shown he has potential but it will be wasted if he doesn't get playing time. And if he can't get it when the players ahead of him are playing this poorly then be will never get it. He merits a chance. 

I actually put him in my starting lineup over Kovacic because I just wanted something different from that boring midfield 3 of Mount-Kante-Kovacic. But I don't think Gilmour is the answer, in fact, he could actually be worse given he's so inexperienced. 

However, worth a punt isn't it.

2 minutes ago, Slojo said:

Yeah it's a load of rubbish, there must be a word coined for this somewhere, but it's how people overstate what youngsters do and hype them up after one game that they pretend their on a higher level than senior and experienced players almost instantly. I wanted Gilmour to start for something different, but if Kovacic or any other senior player had a game like that against Leicester, people wouldn't want to see them play in a Chelsea shirt again. 

And his game against Everton was just a standard day in the office for what Kovacic was doing last season, but because he was 18, you're more impressed. Great game against Liverpool though, have to give him that. 

Yes Gilmour isn’t ready yet makes too many false/dangerous passes.. I think we should persist with Kante / mount/ havertz and rotate Kante.. if any needs to be given a long rope I’d go with Havertz

1 minute ago, loz said:

He is just a boy though. Clearly has shown he has potential but it will be wasted if he doesn't get playing time. And if he can't get it when the players ahead of him are playing this poorly then be will never get it. He merits a chance. 

I know hes just a boy but that doesn't mean he cant be criticised. Its not difficult to play and look decent when your 3-0 down. Hudson Odoi does it too. Then when Hudson Odoi starts he doesn't look as good. Would of been better to keep Barkley and loan Gilmour, Gilmour needs games and with the pressure Franks under im not sure he will get them.