As pleasing as it was to see Werner score last night, and it was a good finish, let's not pretend this glosses over all his short-comings in one game, or two if you include Southampton.

He is still very poor in tight spaces because his first touch very often let's him down. First half he tried to take a pass in the box and spin round with the ball but his touch was poor and the defender turned possession over. He has a helluva a lot of room for improvement if he wants to be acknowledged as a top class forward. He hasn't really shown any consistency since he arrived and that is why Tuchel has yo-yoed him in and out of the team.

1 hour ago, just said:

As pleasing as it was to see Werner score last night, and it was a good finish, let's not pretend this glosses over all his short-comings in one game, or two if you include Southampton.

He is still very poor in tight spaces because his first touch very often let's him down. First half he tried to take a pass in the box and spin round with the ball but his touch was poor and the defender turned possession over. He has a helluva a lot of room for improvement if he wants to be acknowledged as a top class forward. He hasn't really shown any consistency since he arrived and that is why Tuchel has yo-yoed him in and out of the team.

Certainly does Just. A start would be maintaining, nay improving on, his work rate to be at a minimum the same level as last season,  and not ducking challanges.

11 hours ago, axman2526 said:

Let's see him start, provided he is fit to do so, the next 3. 3 London derby. See how he fairs.

I am not sure about playing him against palace. Maybe he will be better against arse but i haven't watched arse play for a long2 time.

It was the same story last season. Werner was very good against rm,city n pool but the moment we played team who did not play high line and did not want the ball we were back complaining how bad timo was. I posted "he works hard" almost after every game.

With tino it has nothing to do with confidence, It all come down to his weakness n strength. 

Edited April 14, 20224 yr by Bob stark

53 minutes ago, Bob stark said:

I am not sure about playing him against palace. Maybe he will be better against arse but i haven't watched arse play for a long2 time.

It was the same story last season. Werner was very good against rm,city n pool but the moment we played team who did not play high line and did not want the ball we were back complaining how bad timo was. I posted "he works hard" almost after every game.

With tino it has nothing to do with confidence, It all come down to his weakness n strength. 

Is a fair point but we lack alternatives. I mean given he loves Palace like Timo loves Saints CP is one, but I would not have Ziyech or CHO ahead of Timo.

And nevermind about Lukaku...

12 hours ago, axman2526 said:

Is a fair point but we lack alternatives. I mean given he loves Palace like Timo loves Saints CP is one, but I would not have Ziyech or CHO ahead of Timo.

And nevermind about Lukaku...

If we are looking at players who do well against Palace, I think Pulisic has a great scoring record against them. While he hasn't impressed much recently, they seem to be one of the few teams that bring out his best form.

19 hours ago, just said:

As pleasing as it was to see Werner score last night, and it was a good finish, let's not pretend this glosses over all his short-comings in one game, or two if you include Southampton.

He is still very poor in tight spaces because his first touch very often let's him down. First half he tried to take a pass in the box and spin round with the ball but his touch was poor and the defender turned possession over. He has a helluva a lot of room for improvement if he wants to be acknowledged as a top class forward. He hasn't really shown any consistency since he arrived and that is why Tuchel has yo-yoed him in and out of the team.

Fully agree however I would start him for the rest of the season now to see how he performs playing week in week out. If we see the same lack of consistency and a regular inability to actually go past a defender then we throw in the towel this summer. 

6 hours ago, loz said:

Fully agree however I would start him for the rest of the season now to see how he performs playing week in week out. If we see the same lack of consistency and a regular inability to actually go past a defender then we throw in the towel this summer. 

He played every week last year

On 15/04/2022 at 02:00, Bob stark said:

He played every week last year

And ended the season on 24+ goals/assists....oh, and a Champions League winners medal. Not bad for his first season outside his home country.

Another little lovely assist today. Making things happen....again

20 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

Another little lovely assist today. Making things happen....again

Almost 2. 

Finding a bit of form at the right time.

A few weeks ago he looked like a beaten man but now he looks like he’s got a bit of confidence back.

On 14/04/2022 at 18:01, loz said:

Fully agree however I would start him for the rest of the season now to see how he performs playing week in week out. If we see the same lack of consistency and a regular inability to actually go past a defender then we throw in the towel this summer. 

Posted this in the Palace match thread Loz, but will stick it in the Werner thread as well.

Still nowhere near being convinced by him myself. Yes, he made runs and our midfield generally ignored them, and he passed to Mount for his goal, but when he got space at the end he messed up twice. I watched Luis Diaz for Liverpool yesterday and other games this season and already he looks twice the player Werner does.

1 minute ago, just said:

Posted this in the Palace match thread Loz, but will stick it in the Werner thread as well.

Still nowhere near being convinced by him myself. Yes, he made runs and our midfield generally ignored them, and he passed to Mount for his goal, but when he got space at the end he messed up twice. I watched Luis Diaz for Liverpool yesterday and other games this season and already he looks twice the player Werner does.

 

Yep  simply isn't clinical enough to be a really top drawer centre forward. 

2 minutes ago, loz said:

Yep  simply isn't clinical enough to be a really top drawer centre forward. 

True. And he doesn't dribble or cross well enough to be a top drawer wide man either.

The bit that puzzles me @just us prople still talk about his blistering pace. Happened again in today's commentary. In all his time at Chelsea has he ever left a defender for dead? I dare say he has once or twice but it certainly isn't a regular occurrence.

3 hours ago, just said:

Posted this in the Palace match thread Loz, but will stick it in the Werner thread as well.

Still nowhere near being convinced by him myself. Yes, he made runs and our midfield generally ignored them, and he passed to Mount for his goal, but when he got space at the end he messed up twice. I watched Luis Diaz for Liverpool yesterday and other games this season and already he looks twice the player Werner does.

 

 

2021/2022

Diaz: 17 games 3 goals 1 assist for Liverpool

Werner: 32 games 10 goals 6 assists for Chelsea

 

 

3 hours ago, loz said:

The bit that puzzles me @just us prople still talk about his blistering pace. Happened again in today's commentary. In all his time at Chelsea has he ever left a defender for dead? I dare say he has once or twice but it certainly isn't a regular occurrence.

Ferrets don't run very quick loz, but you try catching one.

1 minute ago, coco said:

Ferrets don't run very quick loz, but you try catching one.

I'd prefer it if you kept my personal life off this site Coco!

15 minutes ago, ElTerrible said:

 

2021/2022

Diaz: 17 games 3 goals 1 assist for Liverpool

Werner: 32 games 10 goals 6 assists for Chelsea

 

 

https://www.whoscored.com/Players/377168/Show/Luis-Díaz

https://www.whoscored.com/Players/130903/Show/Timo-Werner

 

 

Never really been a fan of stats as the ultimate argument maker. OK in the extreme a striker who gets no goals is going to struggle when compared to one who gets 20 plus but that's an extreme example.

For me it's about what you see when you watch them play. Watch Diaz and you expect something to happen. Defenders get worried and it creates a degree of panic. That may, or may not,  result in an assist or a goal for Diaz. But it regularly creates concern and puts defenders on edge which prevents teams feeling comfortable and building confidence that they aren't second best. There are no stats for that. Werner rarely, if ever  creates that kind of concern. Nor does Pulisic and Ziyech. Its one of the reasons 'lesser' teams play us and feel confident they can get something out of the game. I don't think that's the same when they play Liverpool or City

 

If only there were some way to hypnotize Werner and Lukaku into thinking they were playing Southampton and Villa every time they stepped foot on a football pitch, we'd have the Prem's top 2 scorers.

9 hours ago, loz said:

Never really been a fan of stats as the ultimate argument maker. OK in the extreme a striker who gets no goals is going to struggle when compared to one who gets 20 plus but that's an extreme example.

For me it's about what you see when you watch them play. Watch Diaz and you expect something to happen. Defenders get worried and it creates a degree of panic. That may, or may not,  result in an assist or a goal for Diaz. But it regularly creates concern and puts defenders on edge which prevents teams feeling comfortable and building confidence that they aren't second best. There are no stats for that. Werner rarely, if ever  creates that kind of concern. Nor does Pulisic and Ziyech. Its one of the reasons 'lesser' teams play us and feel confident they can get something out of the game. I don't think that's the same when they play Liverpool or City

 

I recognize how skilled Diaz is. I doubt you know how skilled Werner is. That´s why I threw some stats in your face. Werner has played 1820 minutes this season, which translates to 20 games, which means he contributes 0.8 G/A per 90 minutes. This season Mane is at 0.58. Jota is at 0.78. Diaz is at 0.23. Salah is at 1.05. If I had thrown the raw numbers at you, most would have guessed.

Salah 1.05

Jota 0.80

Mane 0.78

Diaz 0.58

Werner 0.23

Due to media bias and stupid punditry most fans simply don´t recognize what Werner actually brings to any/this Chelsea team.

I think opposing coaches are plenty concerned, when they play against Werner - Havertz - Mount, cause all three work their socks off pressing, tracking back and still make relentless runs offensively, which means they´ll make every top team uncomfortable for 90 minutes. You can never rest on/off the ball as the opposing team.

That´s before we get into the argument of changing countries and leagues during and with COVID disrupted seasons that were anything but normal.

 

Edited April 18, 20224 yr by ElTerrible

2 hours ago, ElTerrible said:

 

Due to media bias and stupid punditry most fans simply don´t recognize what Werner actually brings to any/this Chelsea team.

Not sure about that. Werner, has got cult status with the fans. 

The comparison with Diaz did make me think, damn I really miss having a proper winger at Chelsea. Who was the last proper winger we had? Pedro? 

A winger who can actually beat players, cross and score. If we had a good winger like Robben, Joe Cole instead of Werner, I suspect we’d be doing a lot better.

We need to sign wingers. I know Hudson Odoi is one but let’s be honest, he’s not good enough.