1 minute ago, Snedger said:

Just curious, but who exactly is the manager/coach that walks in tomorrow and instantly puts us on a twelve game winning run and leads us to a top four finish?

At this point it's about bringing in (if we plan on replacing Potter that is) the manager that will have us in the best possible position for next season. Even though I think there are many managers to could get a significant bounce out of this squad the most important thing would be to get a manager that can achieve something next season and beyond. Would Pochettino for example make us look more coherent as a team instead of 11 individuals? I am pretty sure he would.

Pochettino is also someone the club already held talks with after Tuchel was sacked.

https://theathletic.com/3572627/2022/09/07/chelsea-potter-pochettino-tuchel-replacement/

 

8 minutes ago, cfcforeverfan said:

Just because there aren’t a perfect manager to come in right away we should accept mediocrity 

 

best logic ever

You're going to have to accept mediocrity regardless. This is a club that has been in decline for a few seasons and it has just accelerated recently.

You think appointing literally anybody in place of Potter results in the new owners having even the slightest clue how to run a football club and makes Ziyech, Havertz, Sterling, Koulibaly etc etc etc half decent footballers?

And you still haven't named a coach that could step in. Pep going to quit and move here? Or will Sam Allardyce suffice?

10 minutes ago, OriginalS said:

At this point it's about bringing in (if we plan on replacing Potter that is) the manager that will have us in the best possible position for next season. Even though I think there are many managers to could get a significant bounce out of this squad the most important thing would be to get a manager that can achieve something next season and beyond. Would Pochettino for example make us look more coherent as a team instead of 11 individuals? I am pretty sure he would.

Pochettino is also someone the club already held talks with after Tuchel was sacked.

https://theathletic.com/3572627/2022/09/07/chelsea-potter-pochettino-tuchel-replacement/

 

Pochettino sounds plausible as a name. Personally, I don't think that even Pep Guardiola could bounce this disparate bunch of lazy average footballers with the aid of the worlds biggest trampoline.

12 minutes ago, Snedger said:

Pochettino sounds plausible as a name. Personally, I don't think that even Pep Guardiola could bounce this disparate bunch of lazy average footballers with the aid of the worlds biggest trampoline.

I would just suggest that you for example went back to August in Sterlings and Cucurella's threads here on the forum as see what the consensus was about them back then.

If one wants to defend Potter those two are not names you want to bring up because they are a case of two quality players that had a very decent start at this club that "suddenly" turned sh*te when Potter got his hands on them.

Some posts about Sterling for example about a week before Tuchel was sacked:

Can see why he is an elite player, he’s always in the right position.

We just need another elite player with Sterling in our attack and we can talk hard this season.

Sterling was fantastic today.

Love his spirit and fight. When we signed him noted it felt like we had finally backfilled Pedro in the squad (and with no disrespect to Pedro, Sterling is better). 

Top quality player, someone to put the ball in the net, can't remember last time one one of our wide players scored two in a game

Best attacking player we currently have....I fully expect to see him at right centre back this weekend......

Which again goes back to my point that Potter got this squad massively underperforming. Absolutely everyone. Even the likes of Mount and Kovacic in addition to the two beforementioned who we know are quality players. This always happens though when a manager is floundering. Rudiger, Christensen, Jorginho was a joke for Lampard, especially towards the end. Tuchel came in a proved they were in fact quality players didn't he?

Edited January 9, 20233 yr by OriginalS

26 minutes ago, OriginalS said:

At this point it's about bringing in (if we plan on replacing Potter that is) the manager that will have us in the best possible position for next season. Even though I think there are many managers to could get a significant bounce out of this squad the most important thing would be to get a manager that can achieve something next season and beyond. Would Pochettino for example make us look more coherent as a team instead of 11 individuals? I am pretty sure he would.

Pochettino is also someone the club already held talks with after Tuchel was sacked.

https://theathletic.com/3572627/2022/09/07/chelsea-potter-pochettino-tuchel-replacement/

 

No no no. Came second in a two horse race with Spuds !!! wasn't much good with PSG either.

I have decided to back Potter for 3 straight seasons. If we are not where we need to be after that, sack him. From here to that point in time I will back him and the project. 

It means I will probably skip some games as it is so hard to watch us struggle. 

I will trust the process as I think what it is. I will not let media get under my skin. They basically want people to just buy a paper. Chelsea struggling sells papers better than Chelsea thriving. They live in Roman era realities. I am now in the new era.

Thanks! 💪

 

5 minutes ago, OriginalS said:

If one wants to defend Potter

I'm not defending Potter and my opinion of Sterling and Cucurella won't be changed by reading anything from any point in time. One is well past it and the other is is not fit to lace the boots of most fullbacks to play here in the last twenty five years.

There may be some issues with tactics and what not, but I am sick and tired of watching Chelsea players take 200 grand and week home whilst downing tools every five minutes because they don't feel like even remotely trying to put in any effort whatsoever because they have decided that they don't like AVB or Scolari or Di Matteo or Potter or Tuchel and a few others.

True, we have been in decline, but still got to the 4th spot last season with the same lazy Havertz and not give a sh1t Ziyech. So at least Tuchel got more out of these bunch than Potter. Therefore to say any manager would have the same struggle is far stretched. He's not going to get sack if we lose against Fulham because of the circumstances. The fact he had to tell us he's not sackable really bugged me, and not surprisingly followed by one of the worst performance of the season. I get he's pissed off, so show it on the training ground or dressing room, or goes into Conte mode on the sideline. Get some results like the other 19 guys in the league, and stop reminding us this is part of the 'normal transition' into...

1 minute ago, icecoolguy22 said:

True, we have been in decline, but still got to the 4th spot last season with the same lazy Havertz and not give a sh1t Ziyech. So at least Tuchel got more out of these bunch than Potter. Therefore to say any manager would have the same struggle is far stretched. He's not going to get sack if we lose against Fulham because of the circumstances. The fact he had to tell us he's not sackable really bugged me, and not surprisingly followed by one of the worst performance of the season. I get he's pissed off, so show it on the training ground or dressing room, or goes into Conte mode on the sideline. Get some results like the other 19 guys in the league, and stop reminding us this is part of the 'normal transition' into...

Does he have the quality to do something radically different from now on that would turn things around? Given his history of low scoring seasons, I doubt it.

This season he has the big excuse of just taking over and having a lot of injuries, but next season he'll feel the pressure.

1 hour ago, Snedger said:

You're going to have to accept mediocrity regardless. This is a club that has been in decline for a few seasons and it has just accelerated recently.

You think appointing literally anybody in place of Potter results in the new owners having even the slightest clue how to run a football club and makes Ziyech, Havertz, Sterling, Koulibaly etc etc etc half decent footballers?

And you still haven't named a coach that could step in. Pep going to quit and move here? Or will Sam Allardyce suffice?

Poch or Enrique would be a better manager than Potter

1 minute ago, cfcforeverfan said:

Poch or Enrique would be a better manager than Potter

I wouldn't like to see Pochettino at all even if he is a better manager, he's just not a winner.

Luis Enrique is an interesting coach that likes to work with younger players but his style is ultra tiki-taka, something that most fans wouldn't appreciate and he would be the biggest copy of Pep himself. That would be a pretty risky manager to have on the long term but maybe he could develop the younger players we want to depend on.

Has he been sacked yet???

Potter is coming over like a downtrodden manager, I want to hear fighting talk, not hear him say how great city are, or how we’re ‘not in a good place’, we can see that Graham we’re not daft. I want to hear solid promises he knows what he’s doing, he’s on a massive contract, he has all his own staff, he has players coming into the team. No more excuses we want to see signs of improvement. And stop the negative sh*t

If the players are happy with him then it sure doesn't show on the pitch.  I only saw one moment of anger from the players yesterday was from Azpi when he booted the ball against the hoarding; does he do it the dressing room though and lay into the players as the captain...I doubt it.  The only player over the last couple of years that truly puts his heart and soul into every game he plays is Tiago Silva. If we had 10 more of him we would not be where we are today...shame we got him several years too late.   Potter really needs some soul searching this week.  Emotional Intelligence ain't working with this group, maybe a kick in the balls might help, or at the very least speak to Boehly if he is really backing him and ship out those that don't want to be here, even at a loss and paying some part of the wages.  Stick with the kids with a couple of senior players if Potter stays.  

A poor loss this week at Fulham will I think be the final straw, or will Boehly wait until we are flirting with the bottom 3.

2 hours ago, Gol15 said:

I wouldn't like to see Pochettino at all even if he is a better manager, he's just not a winner.

If that is the criteria, then Potter is a long long way down the list, based on his resume to date, and what we have seen so far !

"I came 9th in the PL ... "

2 hours ago, icecoolguy22 said:

True, we have been in decline, but still got to the 4th spot last season with the same lazy Havertz and not give a sh1t Ziyech. So at least Tuchel got more out of these bunch than Potter. Therefore to say any manager would have the same struggle is far stretched. He's not going to get sack if we lose against Fulham because of the circumstances. The fact he had to tell us he's not sackable really bugged me, and not surprisingly followed by one of the worst performance of the season. I get he's pissed off, so show it on the training ground or dressing room, or goes into Conte mode on the sideline. Get some results like the other 19 guys in the league, and stop reminding us this is part of the 'normal transition' into...

The league is different every season, which is why it's important to be consistent. It's the reason we failed to challenge for the title after winning it under both Conte and Mourinho (second time around). This season Arsenal and Newcastle are performing really well which they weren't doing so last season. 

To be fair Pochettino had prime Kane, Sissoko in midfield, Eriksen, Son and still failed with that lot. We don't have a Kane like ST, and we don't have an Eriksen like player. 

45 minutes ago, coco said:

Potter is coming over like a downtrodden manager, I want to hear fighting talk, not hear him say how great city are, or how we’re ‘not in a good place’, we can see that Graham we’re not daft. I want to hear solid promises he knows what he’s doing, he’s on a massive contract, he has all his own staff, he has players coming into the team. No more excuses we want to see signs of improvement. And stop the negative sh*t

To me it feels like he thinks he's still at Brighton and losing against better teams is just part of it. The difference between him and top managers is that top managers have ambition that goes beyond a good contract at a top club, they want to win every game. I'd also "trust the process" if anybody told me how long that process will approximately take. A year, two, three, five?

This has already been posted on here, but I just want to take a second to analyse his behaviour and mannerisms. Firstly I want to reiterate that I and I believe the majority of the fan base who share my opinion (whatever percentage that is of the overall fan base) do like Graham Potter and have no issue with him as a person or a coach.

It's always been the stance that for a club undertaking such a project, a coach with more experience managing at this level would be needed to get the results in the present and short to mid-term. Whilst also being likely to consistently produce over a longer period of time. 

Now on to the point of this post, look at his mannerisms when asked the question do you get p***** off. He firstly responds yes I do get "cross" which I firstly believe demonstrates his polite nature both publicly and privately alongside his adversion to public outburst unlike a lot of (fiery coaches we may be used to). This is later reinforced by the way in which he repeats yes I do get p***** off but he almost whispers it as if he can't quite bring himself to say it with his chest or any conviction.

His answers are emotionally intelligently driven, he knows what's expected off him as a face of the the club and he responds in a respectful way. Yes he does provide a valid excuse, but what fans want to see is unfiltered passion like TT was with Conte. As a football coach despite how well mannered you are there should always be decisions or situations that vex you and this should be seen visibly, either he hides it well or he's just not as angry as he makes out.

If you don't know where I'm going with this you're probably thinking longtimer why does any of this matter? Psychologically he's a polite well mannered man who seems relatively down to earth.

This type of temperament works with mid to bottom table teams as it shows a certain level of humility, but also a basic understanding of where you are in the food chain. At an elite club, whilst it is good to be seen as humble, Potter's characteristics seem to still resemble that of a mid table team and it feels like this bleeds through to the playing staff. 

Whilst managerial personality might not seem like a big aspect of coaching it's actually one of the most fundamentally influential aspects. You need the head coach to have charisma otherwise his player's won't follow him they won't believe in him.

The head coach of a contemporary 'elite' club now is almost seen as the face of a company it's their attributes ans qualities that are seen to be held by all associated with the club alongside their tactics and approach to the actual game of football. 

The football team mirrors its coach, if they are unsure of themselves not as confident in their approach, nicer down to earth that's what you will see in their players. You go from a serial winner perfectionist to a do your best kind of guy and this is what you expect to see. 

The worst part is whilst Boehly gets some stick, if you look at Potter he is essentially a fall guy for any short comings Boehly makes in his management of the club. Boehly has essentially bought himself "time" by hiring a "long-term" manager to lead his "long-term project" meaning we have to give them both time if we want to see the fruits of this "project". 

Therefore under this regime we have multiple assumptions. Until we see a fully fit squad under Potter, injuries will always be used an excuse. Until we see Potter get the players he needs to play his football that will always be used as an excuse. Until the players get used to Potter's tactics and style of play that will always be used as an excuse. 

Give us time is the message and then we will sign the best young players in the world, build an attractive style of play, rebuild the stadium and create a franchise (buy up multiple smaller clubs and use then as profit generators as well as talent hubs). 

The thing is time isn't given in football it's earned. Boehly as of this moment hasn't really earned much good faith despite the willingness to spend he's actually making the situation worse. Potter might be a long-term appointment, doesn't mean he's the right long-term appointment for Chelsea. I reiterate again we pulled him away from his previous project before it had even finished so we don't even know what the final product would look like.

Those who claim his past teams are indication miss the point that you cannot translate success of small teams in small leagues to an Elite club like Chelsea.....we're the reigning world champions for **** sake not to mention the previous holders of the continental cup. What's happening to club cannot be reduced down to merely injuries.

There are deep rooted issues at this club, the players are underperforming yesz but this stems from the top. Boehly sacked a man at the top of his field for a coach completely untested so either we see Potter and Boehly live long enough to hit smooth sailing or they take the ship down with them.

Tldr I tried to keep it short but alas, human psychology plus business management when applied to Potter imo I see a club mirroring their head coach. The fight isn't there for the players because the coach isn't showing any at least publicly. From a perfectionist in TT to a do your best kind of guy in GP. Boehly has shown me one thing since he's been in charge don't listen to what he says watch what he does. I've never wanted a coach sacked before, but my patience is being sorely tested I shall continue to watch what Boehly does.

 

People are already seriously arguing for Pochettino to substitute Potter to get us in the best position this season? if we were to sack Potter, I'd rather have Sean Dyche to steady the boat and kick some bollocks in the changing room until the end of the season, and then look for a serious champion to come for the long term. At least the conferences would be a laugh.

Just to clarify my position, I'm not completely sold on Potter but, I think that he probably needs some more time to show what he can do with new incoming players, he's working with a group of half-arsed players who have let down Lamps, Tuchel and now Potter, and, most importantly, I don't see any manager available that convinces me.

I'm fed up of the manager getting the blame every single time when we have players walking off the field not clapping the away fans or demanding stupid wages for inconsistent performances. Sterling hasn't proved his worth at all. Neither has Mount, he's feeding off of last season's performance. Jorginho is putting in the same poor performances week in, week out. Koulibaly has been here a short time, but he can't even make simple passes and use his football IQ at times.

Havertz is living off a CL goal and doesn't look like he's bothered at all. Ziyech looks like a sulky kid and isn't consistent. Thiago Silva is the only one who can hold his head high. Thiago Silva and his wife actually seem to give more of a sh*t at the moment and they've been here for one and half seasons. I don't understand it, the players need to look hard at themselves and show effort on the pitch. Potter can only do so much, but there's 11 players on the pitch who should be putting in consistent hardwork every week to get results and show hunger. 

Edited January 9, 20233 yr by enigma

4 hours ago, coombsie said:

No no no. Came second in a two horse race with Spuds !!! wasn't much good with PSG either.

He actually came 3rd in a two horse race

24 minutes ago, LongtimerLurker said:

This has already been posted on here, but I just want to take a second to analyse his behaviour and mannerisms. Firstly I want to reiterate that I and I believe the majority of the fan base who share my opinion (whatever percentage that is of the overall fan base) do like Graham Potter and have no issue with him as a person or a coach.

It's always been the stance that for a club undertaking such a project, a coach with more experience managing at this level would be needed to get the results in the present and short to mid-term. Whilst also being likely to consistently produce over a longer period of time. 

Now on to the point of this post, look at his mannerisms when asked the question do you get p***** off. He firstly responds yes I do get "cross" which I firstly believe demonstrates his polite nature both publicly and privately alongside his adversion to public outburst unlike a lot of (fiery coaches we may be used to). This is later reinforced by the way in which he repeats yes I do get p***** off but he almost whispers it as if he can't quite bring himself to say it with his chest or any conviction.

His answers are emotionally intelligently driven, he knows what's expected off him as a face of the the club and he responds in a respectful way. Yes he does provide a valid excuse, but what fans want to see is unfiltered passion like TT was with Conte. As a football coach despite how well mannered you are there should always be decisions or situations that vex you and this should be seen visibly, either he hides it well or he's just not as angry as he makes out.

If you don't know where I'm going with this you're probably thinking longtimer why does any of this matter? Psychologically he's a polite well mannered man who seems relatively down to earth.

This type of temperament works with mid to bottom table teams as it shows a certain level of humility, but also a basic understanding of where you are in the food chain. At an elite club, whilst it is good to be seen as humble, Potter's characteristics seem to still resemble that of a mid table team and it feels like this bleeds through to the playing staff. 

Whilst managerial personality might not seem like a big aspect of coaching it's actually one of the most fundamentally influential aspects. You need the head coach to have charisma otherwise his player's won't follow him they won't believe in him.

The head coach of a contemporary 'elite' club now is almost seen as the face of a company it's their attributes ans qualities that are seen to be held by all associated with the club alongside their tactics and approach to the actual game of football. 

The football team mirrors its coach, if they are unsure of themselves not as confident in their approach, nicer down to earth that's what you will see in their players. You go from a serial winner perfectionist to a do your best kind of guy and this is what you expect to see. 

The worst part is whilst Boehly gets some stick, if you look at Potter he is essentially a fall guy for any short comings Boehly makes in his management of the club. Boehly has essentially bought himself "time" by hiring a "long-term" manager to lead his "long-term project" meaning we have to give them both time if we want to see the fruits of this "project". 

Therefore under this regime we have multiple assumptions. Until we see a fully fit squad under Potter, injuries will always be used an excuse. Until we see Potter get the players he needs to play his football that will always be used as an excuse. Until the players get used to Potter's tactics and style of play that will always be used as an excuse. 

Give us time is the message and then we will sign the best young players in the world, build an attractive style of play, rebuild the stadium and create a franchise (buy up multiple smaller clubs and use then as profit generators as well as talent hubs). 

The thing is time isn't given in football it's earned. Boehly as of this moment hasn't really earned much good faith despite the willingness to spend he's actually making the situation worse. Potter might be a long-term appointment, doesn't mean he's the right long-term appointment for Chelsea. I reiterate again we pulled him away from his previous project before it had even finished so we don't even know what the final product would look like.

Those who claim his past teams are indication miss the point that you cannot translate success of small teams in small leagues to an Elite club like Chelsea.....we're the reigning world champions for **** sake not to mention the previous holders of the continental cup. What's happening to club cannot be reduced down to merely injuries.

There are deep rooted issues at this club, the players are underperforming yesz but this stems from the top. Boehly sacked a man at the top of his field for a coach completely untested so either we see Potter and Boehly live long enough to hit smooth sailing or they take the ship down with them.

Tldr I tried to keep it short but alas, human psychology plus business management when applied to Potter imo I see a club mirroring their head coach. The fight isn't there for the players because the coach isn't showing any at least publicly. From a perfectionist in TT to a do your best kind of guy in GP. Boehly has shown me one thing since he's been in charge don't listen to what he says watch what he does. I've never wanted a coach sacked before, but my patience is being sorely tested I shall continue to watch what Boehly does.

 

If we were winning his attitude and calmness would be pretty cool though, he would be our smooth operator... But now that we look clueless it just looks so bad 

Too right @enigma, I'm struggling to remember how many times our players have downed tools and seen managers get fired. It's endemic in the club and it's about time it stopped. It's very hard to know if the manager is rubbish when the players basically quit trying.

It's like me getting fired as a dad when my toddler son decides he won't eat a particular vegetable today.

I'd have Cahill in this team alongside Silva. At least he had some leadership about him. We used to have Carvalho and Terry at CB. We had the chance to sign Van Dijk when Conte won the league but instead went for inferior options. Would have instantly strengthened our defence. Even going back further, we never replaced Drogba, then we got Costa and never replaced him. We had the chance to sign Aguero and David Silva back in 2010/11 but opted for Torres ffs. . This is what I mean by poor recruitment that's led to the struggles we have. Fail to prepare, prepare to fail. As fantastic as Roman and Co were early on, in the latter years they failed with recruitment and remaining competitive every season.

Edited January 9, 20233 yr by enigma