Super Frank Lampard

[Imran_CFC]

29 minutes ago, abramovich said:

They were always going to give him a three year contract, he wouldn't have taken the job otherwise. What were they going to say, Frank. we normally give new managers three years, but we're having doubts about your suitability for the job, so let's make it a year and see how it goes?

My point is, the length of a contract means nothing, it's the norm, we sacked managers in the past long before their contracts were up if the hierarchy felt it was the right thing to do and I don't see why they'd make an exception for Frank. I believe they're still expecting him to finish in the top four and if the team continues to struggle, at some point they'll sack him.

If I go back to my original post, my response was to a poster saying you cannot learn your craft on the job but due to Franks lack of experience that was always going to be the case & the club knew what they were getting into. If they wanted an experienced man they wouldn't have appointed Frank but since they've offered him the contract & knew with an inexperienced manager we were always going to hit a rocky phase at some point, now its a case of whether he has the metal to turn things around.

[forbzy]

All those calling for Frank to be shown the door should at least recognize that if that happens we will have an interim for the rest of the season. That worked very well once when we had RDM step in (at least in the cups. Not so much in the league) but we should also remember that the other times we had interims were not so great. Hiddink did well enough on his first stint here (with a good squad) but even his second time here was pretty forgettable. Lets not kid ourselves and think that an interim manager is going to come in and bring us top 4 or a trophy. That is a long shot at best with the squad on current form. Especially if the interim is likely to be Avram Grant. I would rather let Frank get the rest of the season and at least see if he can turn this around.

[dansubrosa]

1 hour ago, Slojo said:

I can't help but feel that this is absolutely ridiculous... 

what part do you find ridiculous? Mercenary managers or Lampard being in it for the long stint?

Of course it’s unrealistic to expect a manager to stay for longer than 3/4 years, that’s the reality of football nowadays but we can dream and hope.

If Lampard gets us out of this rut and starts being successful, what’s to stop him staying for a decade? As unlikely as that is.

It’s different to the likes of Jose, Carlo or Conte who may have aspirations to manage a national team or a certain club.

[Osgoodwasgood]

3 hours ago, bisright1 said:

Pep and Klopp both conveyed a vision of what style of football they wanted to play in their 2nd season as managers, clearly, effectively. Lampard doesn't seem to study the game in the same way. I thought he would when we appointed him. But everything is about "confidence" and "digging deep". As if the players just tried a bit harder they would improve. It's why he played a bunch of older players because he has the belief that "experienced players will drag us to victory" instead of having a style and players that fit into that style. 

We've declined since Sarri left in holding onto possession, we lose it a lot more in the middle of the park now. We struggle to play forward quickly. We struggle to look for gaps and we are constantly playing 2 or 3 touch football. 

He's taken us this far, but we need to go further if we are going to win titles. 

His plan as i understand it is to have two number 8's, and get players between the lines, his preferred choice for this was intended to be Mount and Havertz but this was upset by the Latter's illness and loss of form.

I dont see why this could'nt work as i have no concerns with Havertz eventually coming good, however my concern is the quality we have at the base and the protection it gives the defence and indeed the momentum it gives us to move up the pitch.

For Franks plan to work he needs a change of personnel in this area and im reluctant to agree that this now includes Kante.

[yorkleyblue]

On 15/01/2021 at 16:47, pcmacca said:

Well, I feel pretty confident in saying that Chelsea are not going to win every match even if it is only 1-0, so back on planet Earth.......

Step 1 - mission accomplished, smartarse.

[Guest Sindre]

5 hours ago, bisright1 said:

Pep and Klopp both conveyed a vision of what style of football they wanted to play in their 2nd season as managers, clearly,

You can't honestly say you haven't seen a vision and a style of play for most of Lampard's tenure can you?

And Pep is an interesting example actually, because earlier season they were the team that looked nothing like themselves and were down in 13th, 8-9 points behind the leaders. Now they look completely rejuvenated and will go top of the league if they win their game in hand.

No doubt there would have been some fans claiming he had taken the team as far as it could go and we should have looked for a replacement if it happened at this club. No patience whatsoever.

[The Rising Sun]

Seeing the academy players in the first team has been a major plus for me, that's why I want Frank and Jody to be given a chance, let's see if any youngsters can come through to build something special for the club

[bisright1]

1 hour ago, Sindre said:

You can't honestly say you haven't seen a vision and a style of play for most of Lampard's tenure can you?

And Pep is an interesting example actually, because earlier season they were the team that looked nothing like themselves and were down in 13th, 8-9 points behind the leaders. Now they look completely rejuvenated and will go top of the league if they win their game in hand.

No doubt there would have been some fans claiming he had taken the team as far as it could go and we should have looked for a replacement if it happened at this club. No patience whatsoever.

Sorry what is our style of play? I am being genuine, I've never heard anyone say what it is other than snide comments about cross cross cross. 

Klopp was talking about gegenpressen in his second season. Pep was instilling tiki taka in his second season. Lampard is talking about working hard, effort, riding out the bad form, but never about what his actual style is or what he is trying to do here. 

I'm not a city fan. But pep is a student of the game, a rigorous coach and I would never have suggested he be sacked. They were always going to look rejuvenated. 

I don't believe we will improve. I don't believe frank knows how.

Edited January 18, 2021 by bisright1

[dkw]

1 hour ago, Sindre said:

You can't honestly say you haven't seen a vision and a style of play for most of Lampard's tenure can you?

And Pep is an interesting example actually, because earlier season they were the team that looked nothing like themselves and were down in 13th, 8-9 points behind the leaders. Now they look completely rejuvenated and will go top of the league if they win their game in hand.

No doubt there would have been some fans claiming he had taken the team as far as it could go and we should have looked for a replacement if it happened at this club. No patience whatsoever.

This vision and playing style thing seems to be the current sh*tty stick with which to beat Lampard, especiallyby the f**kwits on so,ciak media, its so weird. Even weirder is its often the same people who complain that we keep playing the same way in games...I mean....

[bisright1]

8 minutes ago, dkw said:

This vision and playing style thing seems to be the current sh*tty stick with which to beat Lampard, especiallyby the f**kwits on so,ciak media, its so weird. Even weirder is its often the same people who complain that we keep playing the same way in games...I mean....

So what is the style? I think if I'm generous its a rubbish version of Klopps liverpool

[mm24]

So what's with this Tomori situation? Honestly, I can't believe that anyone could think that Rudiger or Christensen are more useful now than Tomori. 

[wizardous]

I see a lot of comparisons to AVB who was sacked in the middle of a 'rebuild'.

Don't forget AVB had Cech, Terry, Lampard, Drogba, Cole etc. Not in their primes but still one of the very best in the world in their positions. We all know what happened later in the season.

At this moment, to be honest, Lampard doesn't have a single player who is even close to that level. Not a single one. And he is still very close to top 4 with this team that is young and full of potential in every position.

That is the main difference.

 

[bisright1]

27 minutes ago, wizardous said:

I see a lot of comparisons to AVB who was sacked in the middle of a 'rebuild'.

Don't forget AVB had Cech, Terry, Lampard, Drogba, Cole etc. Not in their primes but still one of the very best in the world in their positions. We all know what happened later in the season.

At this moment, to be honest, Lampard doesn't have a single player who is even close to that level. Not a single one. And he is still very close to top 4 with this team that is young and full of potential in every position.

That is the main difference.

 

Outside of liverpool and man city, who does have players like that? 

Do you think tottenham, leicester, man united all have better teams than ours? 

I think our squad is comfortably the 3rd beat in the league. The squad seems worse when a team is playing sh*t, but a top manager could get these players singing. 

[chi blue]

Haven’t bothered reading all this thread, as can imagine some of the bollox spouted by the Xbox brigade, does it really matter if we lose some games, not win a trophy and not finish in the top 4? Let’s enjoy some youth players coming through, and Frank in charge, we could have some twat like Jose in charge again, moaning and sulking like f**k, can’t wait till we get back to bridge and the match going fans can get behind Frank. Us old skool can hark back to when we were sh*te, but it  was more enjoyable than all this spoilt brat bickering. ‘Win or lose up the blues’

[Osgoodwasgood]

15 minutes ago, chi blue said:

Haven’t bothered reading all this thread, as can imagine some of the bollox spouted by the Xbox brigade, does it really matter if we lose some games, not win a trophy and not finish in the top 4? Let’s enjoy some youth players coming through, and Frank in charge, we could have some twat like Jose in charge again, moaning and sulking like f**k, can’t wait till we get back to bridge and the match going fans can get behind Frank. Us old skool can hark back to when we were sh*te, but it  was more enjoyable than all this spoilt brat bickering. ‘Win or lose up the blues’

Hear Hear

[The Rising Sun]

29 minutes ago, chi blue said:

Haven’t bothered reading all this thread, as can imagine some of the bollox spouted by the Xbox brigade, does it really matter if we lose some games, not win a trophy and not finish in the top 4? Let’s enjoy some youth players coming through, and Frank in charge, we could have some twat like Jose in charge again, moaning and sulking like f**k, can’t wait till we get back to bridge and the match going fans can get behind Frank. Us old skool can hark back to when we were sh*te, but it  was more enjoyable than all this spoilt brat bickering. ‘Win or lose up the blues’

Bang on !

[wizardous]

1 hour ago, bisright1 said:

Outside of liverpool and man city, who does have players like that? 

Do you think tottenham, leicester, man united all have better teams than ours? 

I think our squad is comfortably the 3rd beat in the league. The squad seems worse when a team is playing sh*t, but a top manager could get these players singing. 

It is easy to say that by just looking at names. Football is just not about that. 

Do you really think Werner and Havertz would suddenly start scoring for fun if Lampard gets sacked? All they need is some time to adjust. Again, we're not even halfway through this season.

I think Man Utd have a better team than us, judging by their league position right now it probably is true. 

[dansubrosa]

This is probably controversial but we probably could do with someone like Pogba. As much of a knobhead he is, he has the physicality and passing range we’re screaming for in our midfield.

Im not saying I want us to sign him but we probably could do with someone with a similar physique and skill. Mount, Kovacic, Kante, Jorginho and Gilmour, they all don’t have any strength. Keeping my fingers crossed Loftus Cheek will rediscover his form, he can do that role for us.

[Brutos]

I see lots of talk about let’s just enjoy it even if we don’t get top four or win a trophy well unfortunately businesses doesn’t run that way especially one where you invest millions expecting a good ROI. Chelsea NEEDS CL football especially with the current pandemic and TV money it’s a must with a big hole in match day takings. 

I think the club will not sack Lampard, the only time I see that happening is if we are mathematically out of the CL race and they would still let him finish the season anyway. They would then do a PR job about different vision and we thank him for two great years blah blah.... they won’t sack him in season unless we are in the relegation zone and I don’t see it happening so he’s here until end of the season.

If he can’t get us playing by the end of the season I don’t expect him to get us playing next season either because the player’s won’t change I don’t see the same investment happening next season like we did last season.
 

Edited January 18, 2021 by Brutos

[Brutos]

2 hours ago, wizardous said:

It is easy to say that by just looking at names. Football is just not about that. 

Do you really think Werner and Havertz would suddenly start scoring for fun if Lampard gets sacked? All they need is some time to adjust. Again, we're not even halfway through this season.

I think Man Utd have a better team than us, judging by their league position right now it probably is true. 

Not to be pedantic but tomorrow will be the half way point for us in the PL 😛

[Bob stark]

4 hours ago, dansubrosa said:

This is probably controversial but we probably could do with someone like Pogba. As much of a knobhead he is, he has the physicality and passing range we’re screaming for in our midfield.

Im not saying I want us to sign him but we probably could do with someone with a similar physique and skill. Mount, Kovacic, Kante, Jorginho and Gilmour, they all don’t have any strength. Keeping my fingers crossed Loftus Cheek will rediscover his form, he can do that role for us.

That is not controversial but it is difficult to find player with pogba skillet. 

[Bob stark]

7 hours ago, wizardous said:

I see a lot of comparisons to AVB who was sacked in the middle of a 'rebuild'.

Don't forget AVB had Cech, Terry, Lampard, Drogba, Cole etc. Not in their primes but still one of the very best in the world in their positions. We all know what happened later in the season.

At this moment, to be honest, Lampard doesn't have a single player who is even close to that level. Not a single one. And he is still very close to top 4 with this team that is young and full of potential in every position.

That is the main difference.

 

At that point all your player that you mentioned are pretty much done as important player.

Yes, We won ucl but my God, you can easily argue we were one of the worst ucl winner in recent history. 

Edited January 19, 2021 by Bob stark

[Argo]

5 hours ago, wizardous said:

I think Man Utd have a better team than us, judging by their league position right now it probably is true. 

That's the thing, they ain't. Our fullbacks are levels above their's especially on offense, Thiago Silva sh*ts on any of their centre half's, apart from Pogba our CM/pivot options are better, Werner and Ziyech outperformed Martial and Bruno respectively at their previous clubs, Pulisic is better than Rashford, Mount is better than VDB, Hudson Odoi is more naturally gifted than Greenwood (although the latter is a better finisher) and I'd probably say Mendy is better than this current version of DDG aswell (who is struggling to see off Kepa's competition in the Spanish side).

Apart from Pogba and maybe Cavani there's no player in that United squad I look at and think we can't raise a better or atleast equal equivalent. I mean how far are we going to go to reduce expectations? Are we a few more bad results from saying West Ham have better players?

Edited January 19, 2021 by Argo

[STATS]

6 hours ago, dansubrosa said:

This is probably controversial but we probably could do with someone like Pogba. As much of a knobhead he is, he has the physicality and passing range we’re screaming for in our midfield.

Im not saying I want us to sign him but we probably could do with someone with a similar physique and skill. Mount, Kovacic, Kante, Jorginho and Gilmour, they all don’t have any strength. Keeping my fingers crossed Loftus Cheek will rediscover his form, he can do that role for us.

Agreed. United have not been great but what helps Ole is the physicality in midfield. We couldn't play the type of game they played on Sunday because we don't have the muscle in midfield to contain the opposition.  Players are too lightweight and easy to counter and brush off the ball. Hence why a player like Rice is needed to provide better protection and more muscle in midfield. Even Arsenal look more solid and keeping clean sheets and being tougher to break down with Partey in that team now.

[Slojo]

12 hours ago, forbzy said:

All those calling for Frank to be shown the door should at least recognize that if that happens we will have an interim for the rest of the season. That worked very well once when we had RDM step in (at least in the cups. Not so much in the league) but we should also remember that the other times we had interims were not so great. Hiddink did well enough on his first stint here (with a good squad) but even his second time here was pretty forgettable. Lets not kid ourselves and think that an interim manager is going to come in and bring us top 4 or a trophy. That is a long shot at best with the squad on current form. Especially if the interim is likely to be Avram Grant. I would rather let Frank get the rest of the season and at least see if he can turn this around.

Interims have worked well 4/5. 

Hiddink part 1, Di Matteo, Avram Grant, Rafa Benitez. Every one of them won trophies besides Grant who got us into two cup finals. 

The only time it didn't work out well was Hiddink part 2, but who's to say he didn't save our season then? Before that we were fighting for relegation.