9 minutes ago, just said:

Scott would you mind if I asked have you have ever seen a player, any player at a young age, perhaps before anybody had ever even heard of them, that you watched and thought at times, this kid looks special? Of coourse there's never any guarantees that any young player will reach the huge expectations placed on them, but you felt this kid has way more chance than most? They might still make mistakes, make rash decisions, but that you've thought that will most likely change with more experience but mostly you feel, because of their sheer god-given abilities. Anyone?

I have three times. Live and in the flesh. Messi at 17, but everyone could see that in him. Vincent Kompany at 18 when we played Anderlecht away in a meaningless UCL early group game. And once at Barnet FC in the late 90's at our first pre-season game. He was a centre-half. Bit gangly, bit rash, he tried to win every ball but didn't. Made a hash of a few things. Wasn't blessed with real pace but his bravery, tackling, concentration levels, physical strength and sheer will to win absolutely shone through.

I came away completely convinced he had "IT". So did my Dad incidentally, who had watched Chelsea since the early 1950s. The kid went out on loan and we didn't think we'd probably ever see him again. Nowadays, under our current system, we most probably wouldn't have done. But he came back, (still young and still a bit raw), ......... His name was John Terry.

Again in bold this time no guarantees he will make it, but I can only think you have seen very, very little of Fofana or watched him over a number of matches with any particular close attention to come out with such a knee-jerk "he ain't good enough" post.

Wait John Terry actually played for Barnet?

2 minutes ago, Gol15 said:

Wait John Terry actually played for Barnet?

No Gol, John Terry played in the pre-season game against Barnet FC.

After what I saw today from Fofana I think it will be smarter for us to just activate the buy back clause on Guehi

2 hours ago, axman2526 said:

Thats English nationality tax. Fofana and Cucurella both had one single good season at midtable sides and we are smashing records for them.

Now they will need to become the new VVD and Ashley Cole, respectively to justify it or be seen as flops. Huge pressure.

You should live here axman. Everything is expensive; tax, property, energy, fuel, community charges, TV licences and of course, beer! Plus we have our first moderately hot summer in 50 years and a hosepipe ban, trains stop running and the government are advising people against having BBQs because of the risk of wildfires. Even in Peckham.

22 minutes ago, just said:

Scott would you mind if I asked have you have ever seen a player, any player at a young age, perhaps before anybody had ever even heard of them, that you watched and thought at times, this kid looks special? Of coourse there's never any guarantees that any young player will reach the huge expectations placed on them, but you felt this kid has way more chance than most? They might still make mistakes, make rash decisions, but that you've thought that will most likely change with more experience but mostly you feel, because of their sheer god-given abilities. Anyone?

I have three times. Live and in the flesh. Messi at 17, but everyone could see that in him. Vincent Kompany at 18 when we played Anderlecht away in a meaningless UCL early group game. And once at Barnet FC in the late 90's at our first pre-season game. He was a centre-half. Bit gangly, bit rash, he tried to win every ball but didn't. Made a hash of a few things. Wasn't blessed with real pace but his bravery, tackling, concentration levels, physical strength and sheer will to win absolutely shone through.

I came away completely convinced he had "IT". So did my Dad incidentally, who had watched Chelsea since the early 1950s. The kid went out on loan and we didn't think we'd probably ever see him again. Nowadays, under our current system, we most probably wouldn't have done. But he came back, (still young and still a bit raw), ......... His name was John Terry.

Again in bold this time no guarantees he will make it, but I can only think you have seen very, very little of Fofana or watched him over a number of matches with any particular close attention to come out with such a knee-jerk "he ain't good enough" post.

I probably did knee-jerk a bit by saying he wasn't good enough. At his age, mistakes will happen and he will likely get better. Still, from what I have seen of him, I don't yet see where this potential to be a star comes from. But like every signing we make that hasn't convinced me, I hope I am wrong.

That price tag scares the sh*t out of me, they just never seem to work out for us. Whenever we make these big money moves, I voice my concerns and fans are always telling me they are going to be amazing. Havertz is still not the player everybody was telling me he was going to be, Bakayoko was sh*t, Morata was sh*t, Lukaku was sh*t, Pulisic had a purple patch and has been sh*t since. All of these and more, fans were telling me how great they were and that I was missing something, and then it turns out the player wasn't all that after all. I'm bored of it.

22 minutes ago, just said:

No Gol, John Terry played in the pre-season game against Barnet FC.

Ah ok, well it was a good read despite me not knowing how to read!

8 minutes ago, just said:

You should live here axman. Everything is expensive; tax, property, energy, fuel, community charges, TV licences and of course, beer! Plus we have our first moderately hot summer in 50 years and a hosepipe ban, trains stop running and the government are advising people against having BBQs because of the risk of wildfires. Even in Peckham.

Have you noticed wine is about the only thing that's not gone up in price? Even my bloody goldfish holiday block has gone up 45p, the fish will be taking a trip down the loo if it continues ... I love them really

2 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

I probably did knee-jerk a bit by saying he wasn't good enough. At his age, mistakes will happen and he will likely get better. Still, from what I have seen of him, I don't yet see where this potential to be a star comes from. But like every signing we make that hasn't convinced me, I hope I am wrong.

That price tag scares the sh*t out of me, they just never seem to work out for us. Whenever we make these big money moves, I voice my concerns and fans are always telling me they are going to be amazing. Havertz is still not the player everybody was telling me he was going to be, Bakayoko was sh*t, Morata was sh*t, Lukaku was sh*t, Pulisic had a purple patch and has been sh*t since. All of these and more, fans were telling me how great they were and that I was missing something, and then it turns out the player wasn't all that after all. I'm bored of it.

Yep, no doubt Scott a huge risk. Could work out, could go tits-up. Why do I think it's worth the gamble? Fofana is a fantastic athlete even after the broken leg. 6'3" with a superb leap. Brave as JT and Cahill and way, way quicker than both of them. Superb timing in the tackle, can play as a full-back and I have seen him direct and lead the players around him. At 21.

Another reason I would pay the £80 million, is to get him here right now, while Silva is still playing. That could be absolutely key in Fofana developing into a world class talent. Silva could mentor him, develop him, the way Marcel Desailly mentored JT.

 

 

 

 

 

6 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

I probably did knee-jerk a bit by saying he wasn't good enough. At his age, mistakes will happen and he will likely get better. Still, from what I have seen of him, I don't yet see where this potential to be a star comes from. But like every signing we make that hasn't convinced me, I hope I am wrong.

That price tag scares the sh*t out of me, they just never seem to work out for us. Whenever we make these big money moves, I voice my concerns and fans are always telling me they are going to be amazing. Havertz is still not the player everybody was telling me he was going to be, Bakayoko was sh*t, Morata was sh*t, Lukaku was sh*t, Pulisic had a purple patch and has been sh*t since. All of these and more, fans were telling me how great they were and that I was missing something, and then it turns out the player wasn't all that after all. I'm bored of it.

I think the biggest difference is that we bought most of those players from out of the league. Not trying to be anti foreign players but a lot of people underestimate how hard it is to settle into a new league and a club like Chelsea especially when you're young. I honestly believe the reason why Liverpool had success with people like Mané, Diogo Jota and VVD is because they all had at least one year of Premier League experience versus them being bought directly from out of the league. Other than Torres, most of our big signing flops have been players bought from out of the league where their success there might not work here in the Premier League

28 minutes ago, just said:

You should live here axman. Everything is expensive; tax, property, energy, fuel, community charges, TV licences and of course, beer! Plus we have our first moderately hot summer in 50 years and a hosepipe ban, trains stop running and the government are advising people against having BBQs because of the risk of wildfires. Even in Peckham.

Lol between Covid and the Russian invasion seems like many decided it was great to put the price of everything up. Same over here too. Even Gas in a province that is rich in it but sells too much of it abroad lol.

Though the wildfire risk from BBQs is a very Canadian thing, we tend to get those every year. 

and romano again: "…and it’s absolutely not over yet for Wesley Fofana"

48 minutes ago, ozboy said:

and romano again: "…and it’s absolutely not over yet for Wesley Fofana"

It makes sense from everyone's point of view that this is done, one way or another, ASAP. 

Yet I feel this will drag on till the end of the window for some reason.

Do you think Fofana "dogged" it last night?. He certainly looked very average.

Edited August 14, 20223 yr by ozboy

3 minutes ago, ozboy said:

Do you think Fofana "dogged" it last night?. He certainly looked very average.

Absolutely not. No way a professional, and someone credited with being a leader, would think to himself or herself "I know what will help me cause to leave, me playing sh*t".

I honestly believe he wants to leave Leicester in the besr way possible, and if he was going to resort to less savory tactics he would certainly go with a transfer request and refusing to play and train before deliberately playing badly.

4 hours ago, charierre said:

 Todd's negotiating skills need honing it seems

This is a bit of a big call when you consider Boehly is a self made billionaire who got there by negotiating for himself and for others. But maybe he will get taken to the cleaners.

So far my opinion is that he has done well. In the end we have got players who were going to leave their prior clubs and improve us. Sure they cost but we would be stuffed without them for sure. Fofana now wants to come to Chelsea, apparently, which of course isn't that hard considering how woeful Leicester are going to be this season. De Jong and Auba are almost the same they can be levered out.

In some ways I regret the way we and other big clubs just cherry pick the best out of the clubs lower down but that is the way. 

We didn't get Kounde but depending on which story you believe that's because in the end we didn't want him. We would have had De Ligt but he did want Bayern. He made Barca pay up for Raphina.

13 hours ago, axman2526 said:

Yeah Colwill should be learning from them as well rather than rotting on the Brighton bench...

Cowill isn't rotting on their bench. He joined 2 days before their first game of the season, so had no time to spend pre-season with them and now will be getting used to Potter's style of play. Also Brighton will rotate which GP is known for but first 2 games, their defence has been solid so he rightfully has not changed that. Later on there will be midweek games as well as possible injuries and drop in form. He has loads of time to play. Broja went from being Southampton's third choice striker to their main man last season. He took a while to get in their PL starting team.

14 hours ago, charierre said:

Well I looked at him today for the first time properly, I see a player with promise but definitely got a mistake in him, Rio at a similar age had more than his share of gaffes. He seemed to get squared up very easily, maybe his head wasn't in it. The point is though he is very raw, not yet a full international. I see Tomori and Chalobah at present in him, should we be breaking the world record fee for a defender for him, and all the pressure it will entail? 80m plus is a massive fee, one you expect to get a ready-made world-class defender. It's a big risk that could be inspired or backfire spectacularly. Todd's negotiating skills need honing it seems we low ball first, then offer a mid-range price plus a penny arrow bar, 2 mojos, and a drumstick lolly, and then agree to pay the full price. Each opponent knows now to just hold out for the top dollar.

Forgive me @charierre, I'm not criticising you in particular but this type of comment frustrates me.

TB may have negotiated very few football transfers but that's still more than all of us here put together. In addition he has negotiated goodness knows how many baseball trades and business deals. Not directly the same processes but a very great deal more relevant than any experience than almost all of us have for handling transfer discussions. Given all of this I hope you understand where I'm coming from.

Worse than the lack of experience we have a complete lack of knowledge. We know nothing about how the Fofana negotiation has been handled. It doesn't make sense to me that we criticise Chelsea's negotiators without actually knowing what they have, or have not, said and done.

On Fofana himself, I don't believe that he is worth the fee reported to be required to close the deal. That's certainly true in terms of his current level and I think it's a mistake to pay world record fees for potential. 

Edited August 14, 20223 yr by OhForAGreavsie

3 minutes ago, OhForAGreavsie said:

Forgive me @charierre, I'm not criticising you in particular but this type of comment frustrates me.

TB may have negotiated very few football transfers but that's still more than all of us here put together. In addition he has negotiated goodness knows how many baseball trades and business deals. Not directly the same processes but a very great deal more relevant than any experience than almost all of us have for handling transfer discussions. Given all of this I hope you understand where I'm coming from.

Worse than the lack of experience we have a complete lack of knowledge. We know nothing about how the Fofana negotiation has been handled. It doesn't make sense to me that we criticise Chelsea's negotiators without actually knowing what they have, or have not, said and done.

A valid point but it does kind if make the point of a fans forum slightly redundant if we only digest news from the people concerned   especially if they keep that stuff to themselves.

But agreed that criticising people for doing or not doing things without the facts is a bit pointless. 

What is evident is that Fofana isn't signed yet after two failed bids. The club have said there are other targets. Any club selling players may well need time to source replacements. So basically if we don't get the majority of our business done this week the window of opportunity and likeliness will start closing rapidly.

let me ask you guys: what CB would be a guarantee to be a world class player for us right now? How much will he cost? And how old would he be? How many season will he be able to deliver? Will he come for a salary of 200k a week? 

there is one and we already got him: Koulibaly

you want a player who will be able to be class for us right now + has potential but not for more than 30 million and he cannot be too old and he has to be unknown from the french 2nd division or maybe from League 1 or from some obscure club. And he cannot have had a bad game before he signs. 

 

it would be a challenge to find a player on the current level of Fofana and who could potentially be world class and who would be able to play for about 10 seasons for us (and will keep his value for that time). Good luck trying to find a player who will costs us 8 million a season for 10 years and who can become world class and who can be a starter for us now.

Fofana is a decent player. We might be over paying for him. But then we should be happy that our new owners are actually willing to spend money.

Fofana Vs. Kounde.  I think Fofana is the the better French CB. 5 inches taller than Kounde too.

Sounds like he was garbage against Arsenal.

Really feel like we should walk away from this.

1 hour ago, azpi28 said:

let me ask you guys: what CB would be a guarantee to be a world class player for us right now? How much will he cost? And how old would he be? How many season will he be able to deliver? Will he come for a salary of 200k a week? 

there is one and we already got him: Koulibaly

you want a player who will be able to be class for us right now + has potential but not for more than 30 million and he cannot be too old and he has to be unknown from the french 2nd division or maybe from League 1 or from some obscure club. And he cannot have had a bad game before he signs. 

 

it would be a challenge to find a player on the current level of Fofana and who could potentially be world class and who would be able to play for about 10 seasons for us (and will keep his value for that time). Good luck trying to find a player who will costs us 8 million a season for 10 years and who can become world class and who can be a starter for us now.

I also think it is about systems and players that fit.

Our CL final back four, Bosingwa, Cahill, Luiz, A Cole. Other than Ashley Cole I don't think any of these players came to us already as elite players. Didn't VVD get to Liverpool via Southampton and Celtic (was it?).

Don't get me wrong I want this lad as much as anyone, it's the media pantomime I find a bit embarrassing.  That Nunez signed for Liverpool, not a word . City sign this Gomez left back in less than a week. Its not played out in the press for weeks on end.

My point, as I have posted earlier, is that we all want him and it looks like he wants it. But the system in place should cater for any number of players and if it ends up being a 20m unknown from Frankfurt then so be it. If this is the only guy that Tuchels team can identify then God help us in the long run.

I've said it numerous times. 

It's only our fans that get bent out of shape about price. 

if we are going to judge players based on 1 match we should end our interest in Rice as he has been awful against Nottingham Forrest 

 

20 minutes ago, azpi28 said:

if we are going to judge players based on 1 match we should end our interest in Rice as he has been awful against Nottingham Forrest 

 

Fofana has a bright future, Rice already peaked so if we are planning to spend 80m+ there is no doubt that we should pay Leicester and stay away from West Ham.