1 hour ago, Boston Blue said:

Given the fickle nature of some of our "alleged" supporters, I fear he will get very little in the way of a second chance.  A certain group of supporters will be all over him after one mis-placed pass.  If he gets a second chance, he needs to be encouraged.  We've seem how he does not react well when things go poorly and he hears the negativity.  There's no reason to put him through that.  

There's a difference though between fans naturally and instinctively groaning and moaning after yet another one of his awful mistakes, and targeting and abusing him and abusing on the pitch because he's crap.                                                                 And lets not forget, he wasn't just staggeringly bad, his attitude stank as well, with him sometimes not even bothering to trackback and try to retrieve the ball after a howler. His attitude made Morata look like Kante.

Edited July 9, 20197 yr by Dixons

26 minutes ago, Dixons said:

There's a difference though between fans naturally and instinctively groaning and moaning after yet another one of his awful mistakes, and targeting and abusing him and abusing on the pitch because he's crap.                                                                 And lets not forget, he wasn't just staggeringly bad, his attitude stank as well, with him sometimes not even bothering to trackback and try to retrieve the ball after a howler. His attitude made Morata look like Kante.

No, but he was good at Monaco, and had a nice season at AC Milan.  There's a better player there than what he showed in his time with us.

I don't know if he couldn't come to terms with the system here, or he put so much pressure on himself after the move.  I do know that he came to us really excited to be at Chelsea, and that's an attitude we could have used more of.  

I'd rather he be crap because he's no good, rather than be crap because he's negatively affected by how the supporters treat him.  

30 minutes ago, Boston Blue said:

No, but he was good at Monaco, and had a nice season at AC Milan.  There's a better player there than what he showed in his time with us.

I don't know if he couldn't come to terms with the system here, or he put so much pressure on himself after the move.  I do know that he came to us really excited to be at Chelsea, and that's an attitude we could have used more of.  

I'd rather he be crap because he's no good, rather than be crap because he's negatively affected by how the supporters treat him.  

As others have mentioned, being ok in the slow paced Italian league is completely different from playing overe here. Frank wants us to play high tempo, and Bakayoko has neither the technical skill or football brain for that.                                            All things considered, i don't think the fans treated him unfairly. He was never singled out and booed on and off the pitch like Jorginho was. Jorginho showed mental strength to get thru the booing and poor form and played well the last couple of months. Sadly, Bakayoko was unable to get past poor form and deserved groans which showed he was as strong as a wet lettuce.                                 

Edited July 9, 20197 yr by Dixons

1 hour ago, Boston Blue said:

No, but he was good at Monaco, and had a nice season at AC Milan.  There's a better player there than what he showed in his time with us.

I don't know if he couldn't come to terms with the system here, or he put so much pressure on himself after the move.  I do know that he came to us really excited to be at Chelsea, and that's an attitude we could have used more of.  

I'd rather he be crap because he's no good, rather than be crap because he's negatively affected by how the supporters treat him.  

The problem is, all this is now a moot point given the style of football we are aspiring to transition too, even a good Bakayoko simply doesn't fit this system as even at his best his control is still sketchy and can't pass his way out of a press.

And it's not like he was just average, he was unbelievably bad after an allright first two months, it's one thing giving a player who was a bit rough around the edges in a first season (for example Ramires or even Essien) another chance, it's another giving one to someone who struggled to kick a ball in a straight line.

3 hours ago, Boston Blue said:

Given the fickle nature of some of our "alleged" supporters, I fear he will get very little in the way of a second chance.  A certain group of supporters will be all over him after one mis-placed pass.  If he gets a second chance, he needs to be encouraged.  We've seem how he does not react well when things go poorly and he hears the negativity.  There's no reason to put him through that.  

If this post was for someone like Hazard or Cesc or David Luiz or heck Kante even, I would agree. But this is for Bakayoko. 

His performances just go from crap to average. The worst was the Watford game. We have better midfielders now. 

If the club is desperate for that kind of midfielder then might as well buyback Ake next year and put him at DM

21 hours ago, Scott Harris said:

What makes you think that? It's not like United and PSG haven't both made w**k signings in the last few years, especially United.

You would assume they have half decent scouts at big clubs like that, but whether the manager is inquiring or the club is a different story.

Also fact is if it’s 2 big clubs each registering separate interest you would be surprised if they both are interested in making the same w**k signing. 

Point is he has qualities that are desirable I still think we could get more out of him, he is young.

Edited July 9, 20197 yr by WalterWhiteCFC

That performance against Watford is legendary.

The worst 30 minutes I can remember for a long while.

I’d be shocked if he improved enough to look decent in the EPL.

It was like a normal average guy somehow blagged his way into a professional football match.

Reminds me of what happened to Souness at Southampton.

On 09/07/2019 at 09:48, Argo said:

There's more chance of West Ham winning the league than there is Bakayoko turning into a KDB esque situation.

I mean, i seriously doubt he's going to reach KDB level, but lets be honest that season he had at monaco he was great for them, and is the reason we even went onto sign him. Last season at Milan he was also great for the vast majority of the season and actually one of the stand out players in that milan team. The potential is definitely there. I think that if he were just played in the role hes best at (the destroyer role) instead of trying to make fancy passes and all that, he'd actually play well. He's certainly built strong and has the physical attributes

I wouldn't sell Bakayoko to United for a 15-20M profit, it's just keep sending the wrong message. They never sold us a player, and we sold them Mata, Matic without much of a bidding. With the transfer ban, we should be very careful who we sell or even loan out. Let's hope he gives his all in training and put his hands up for a starting spot.

2 hours ago, ENygma said:

Last season at Milan he was also great for the vast majority of the season and actually one of the stand out players in that milan team. 

Where did you get that from?

It is true dkw.  He had a howler of a start at Milan but then settled and his form increased dramatically. Fair number of man of the match performances and was a permanent fixture on the first team.
He just thrives in leagues like the French and Italian when there is more space to play than there is in Chesty Morgan's cleavage.

Given the transfer ban I wouldn't be opposed to bringing him back to play slightly ahead of Kante once Kante is restored to his rightful position  but probably not as a regular starter.

 

 

7 minutes ago, loz said:

It is true dkw.  He had a howler of a start at Milan but then settled and his form increased dramatically. Fair number of man of the match performances and was a permanent fixture on the first team.
He just thrives in leagues like the French and Italian when there is more space to play than there is in Chesty Morgan's cleavage.

Given the transfer ban I wouldn't be opposed to bringing him back to play slightly ahead of Kante once Kante is restored to his rightful position  but probably not as a regular starter.

 

 

I remember him having a few good games and being talked up, but didnt he tail off badly after that and was benched?

I remember him having a few good games and being talked up, but didnt he tail off badly after that and was benched?

Not sure, about end of season. I know he rocked up late for training near the end and pissed Milan off but before that he was a nailed on starter for months.

Frank is a midfield connoisseur, i can't see him being impressed with Bakayoko.

1 hour ago, dkw said:

I remember him having a few good games and being talked up, but didnt he tail off badly after that and was benched?

He was benched towards the end of the season for having a spat with Gattuso. But in terms of the way he performed, he was probably one of their best players last season and one of the main reasons they finished as high as they did

2 hours ago, icecoolguy22 said:

I wouldn't sell Bakayoko to United for a 15-20M profit, it's just keep sending the wrong message. They never sold us a player, and we sold them Mata, Matic without much of a bidding. With the transfer ban, we should be very careful who we sell or even loan out. Let's hope he gives his all in training and put his hands up for a starting spot.

Veron, Bosnich, Hughes, Donaghy!

I can't believe what i'm reading on here lately.  We're a team lacking goals, real flair and creativity, which is everything City and Livepool have over us and why they're way ahead of us.   So, the way forward for us to try and start closing that gap in goals, flair and creativity is to sign Kovacic and now bring back Bakayoko. 

Edited July 10, 20197 yr by Dixons

7 minutes ago, Dixons said:

I can't believe what i'm reading on here lately.  We're a team lacking goals, real flair and creativity, which is everything City and Livepool have over us and why they're way ahead of us.   So, the way forward for us to try and start closing that gap in goals, flair and creativity is to sign Kovacic and now bring back Bakayoko. 

The alternative was to bring in no one.  We have a transfer ban.  We can't register new players.  We have two young players in CHO & RLC out for the first half of the season.  

Kovacic and Bakayoko were needed moves.  If Bakayoko can show a little something n pre-season.[perhaps we can find a taker for him.  Maybe Frank can get something out of him.  

As for Kovacic, having one full season under his belt and the performance in the EL final are encouraging for him to be important for us.  

9 minutes ago, Boston Blue said:

The alternative was to bring in no one.  We have a transfer ban.  We can't register new players.  We have two young players in CHO & RLC out for the first half of the season.  

Kovacic and Bakayoko were needed moves.  If Bakayoko can show a little something n pre-season.[perhaps we can find a taker for him.  Maybe Frank can get something out of him.  

As for Kovacic, having one full season under his belt and the performance in the EL final are encouraging for him to be important for us.  

An exciting, brave appointment with the manager, then go ultra conservative with these two mega flops. This was the perfect season to finally give a chance to some of our much hyped youth.  I'm really not looking forward to watching more oof those two stinking out the place, when i know there's a chance we could do so much better with some of our young talent bursting for a chance.

6 hours ago, ENygma said:

I mean, i seriously doubt he's going to reach KDB level, but lets be honest that season he had at monaco he was great for them, and is the reason we even went onto sign him. Last season at Milan he was also great for the vast majority of the season and actually one of the stand out players in that milan team. The potential is definitely there. I think that if he were just played in the role hes best at (the destroyer role) instead of trying to make fancy passes and all that, he'd actually play well. He's certainly built strong and has the physical attributes

He wasn't great though, it's a myth. Out of all of the younger players in that Monaco team, Bakayoko was the worst of the lot. His two performances against Juventus in the Champions League that season was a sign of things to come. He's been overrated from the minute people started noticing him. 

4 hours ago, loz said:

It is true dkw.  He had a howler of a start at Milan but then settled and his form increased dramatically. Fair number of man of the match performances and was a permanent fixture on the first team.

He was tied for 2nd on the team in MOTM with Donnarumma (4) with only Suso having more (7)

for the season, according to WhoScored, he was their 3rd highest rated player

Make no mistake about it, Bakayoko was very good in his DM role for Milan.

Which is good, at the very least we should get our money back on him like we did with Morata.

1 hour ago, Dixons said:

An exciting, brave appointment with the manager, then go ultra conservative with these two mega flops. This was the perfect season to finally give a chance to some of our much hyped youth.  I'm really not looking forward to watching more oof those two stinking out the place, when i know there's a chance we could do so much better with some of our young talent bursting for a chance.

There is zero evidence a young player on our books can fill that role.  Who?  Mount?   He's Championship proven.  Ampadu?  We don't know whether he's a defender or a midfielder, and spent the whole of last season without any meaningful competitive minutes.  It's been said that the same exciting, brave managerial appointment wanted Kovacic, so he must have some idea on how he wants to deploy him.  I don't know what restrictions Sarri put on his play, so if Frank can get performances out of him like he played in the EL final, he will be an important player for us. 

As supporters (and I'm guilty of this) we tend to over-rate our own youth players.  We don't know what they can do because our managers have never felt secure enough to trust them.  Until now.  And out of necessity.  And we need a mix of experienced players to go with the youth.  We can't just play 9 youth players.   Kovacic has a full year of PL experience, and I'm guessing he's primed for a great season.

I can't see Bakayoko making it here, but we need to make him as attractive as possible to any potential buyers out there.  We paid significant money for him, and we should recoup some of that.

Dunno why we pay managers so much money when the answer is so simple, throw a youth player in. Experience means nothing.

Works for @g3.7
 he is still signing Freddy Adu on championship manager.

20 hours ago, WalterWhiteCFC said:

You would assume they have half decent scouts at big clubs like that, but whether the manager is inquiring or the club is a different story.

Also fact is if it’s 2 big clubs each registering separate interest you would be surprised if they both are interested in making the same w**k signing. 

Point is he has qualities that are desirable I still think we could get more out of him, he is young.

At one point all the top clubs were creaming for Odegaard, Renato Sanches etc. Just because more than one club "are rumoured to be interested" doesn't mean it's real or a smart move.