21 hours ago, axman2526 said:

He did get really lucky with that for sure. Almost like with these mistakes and our awful finishing we were trying to give United a boost.

The whole game felt like another those days where we took our eye off the ball. It seems to happen often to us when we come up against teams in poor form.

Congratulations Jorgi boy - £rd place in the Ballon d'Or is not to be sniffed at. Take a bow!

 

NNNJ

1 hour ago, Scott Harris said:

The whole game felt like another those days where we took our eye off the ball. It seems to happen often to us when we come up against teams in poor form.

Cause we are far too often guilty of complacency.

22 minutes ago, nonotnowjim said:

Congratulations Jorgi boy - £rd place in the Ballon d'Or is not to be sniffed at. Take a bow!

 

NNNJ

Won the Euros, won the CL. Had he finished second to Lewa fair enough, he won things and had an outstanding season.

Missed out to that sell out Messi though, who won nothing for his club and won the South American community shield with the Argies. Big whoop. 

2 hours ago, Gol15 said:

I think Messi is winning it. Which means I'll have to wait till Billy Gilmour wins it for Chelsea in some years...

Podium finish - well done!

6 minutes ago, Munkworth said:

Podium finish - well done!

His shoes stood out like a sore thumb though lol

Think they changed the results when he came out looking like a teenager

Outrageous decision. That's twice in two days that poor Jorgi has been robbed.

1 minute ago, PloKoon13 said:

Outrageous decision. That's twice in two days that poor Jorgi has been robbed.

👏 

I remember during the Xavi-Busquets-Iniesta era people used to say "You only understand how good Busquets is when he is not playing."

Same can be said about Jorginho. The guy is simply a midfield maestro, has his brainfart moments two or three times per season, but other than that he is one of the best midfielders in world football. 

Saul - Loftus Cheek as a pair and Jorginho - Kante/Kovacic is like comparing a pizza from Napoli with a frozen one from Lidl.

9 minutes ago, petre ispirescu said:

I remember during the Xavi-Busquets-Iniesta era people used to say "You only understand how good Busquets is when he is not playing."

Same can be said about Jorginho. The guy is simply a midfield maestro, has his brainfart moments two or three times per season, but other than that he is one of the best midfielders in world football. 

Saul - Loftus Cheek as a pair and Jorginho - Kante/Kovacic is like comparing a pizza from Napoli with a frozen one from Lidl.

True 🙂 it's important for TT to NOT play Jorgi once in a while just to show everyone how much less in control we are. 

2 hours ago, ashwin said:

True 🙂 it's important for TT to NOT play Jorgi once in a while just to show everyone how much less in control we are. 

I think Watford game is more about Saul than Jorgi. 

5 hours ago, Bob stark said:

I think Watford game is more about Saul than Jorgi. 

Hard to say. I think Jorginho and Saul would have retained much more control than Saul and RLC. Of couse, RLC and Jorgi would have done far better.

19 hours ago, ashwin said:

Hard to say. I think Jorginho and Saul would have retained much more control than Saul and RLC. Of couse, RLC and Jorgi would have done far better.

I agree but I really didn't watch the game and think ah this is why Jorginho is so important. My thinking was we need any midfielder. Saul is awful and Ruben is an attacker being converted into a midfielder. You play any of kova, kante, jorgi over ruben/saul and we will look better. 

There was a game I cant remember which one last year where I thought Jorginho will be better option to Kova but yesterday nope.

 

Never really injured, just overplayed and needs some rest. That's a kind of a consistency that I wish more of our players had.

37 minutes ago, Gol15 said:

Never really injured, just overplayed and needs some rest. That's a kind of a consistency that I wish more of our players had.

Mount and rudiger are on the same ground there imo.

Everyone else tend to pick up knocks on a semi regular to pulisic level basis.

Actually one of Jorginho's biggest assets (often understated in professional footballers) is his ability to stay fit and avoid lengthy layoffs. Just like Lampard.

2 mistakes in two games that have cost us important points, as much as I love the guy, the flaws of his games get exposed when he doesn't have a Kante or Kovacic-type player to cover him.

Jorginho is the worst of the lot when it comes to performances dropping in the winter months. This is 4 seasons in a row that this has happened to him now, and every time it has cost us massively. 

He can't be dropped though. He can't be dropped because our game is pretty much built around his game, and we have nobody in the side that can play his role as effectively. Basically, when Jorginho's form goes to sh*t, the teams form goes to sh*t. It's harsh to put that kind of pressure on one player, but that is the reality when you build a system around a few players. It would be similar if James or Chilwell were taken out of the side or their form dropped, so much of our game is built around that midfield and wing backs that it comes to pieces without them.

2 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

Jorginho is the worst of the lot when it comes to performances dropping in the winter months. This is 4 seasons in a row that this has happened to him now, and every time it has cost us massively. 

He can't be dropped though. He can't be dropped because our game is pretty much built around his game, and we have nobody in the side that can play his role as effectively. Basically, when Jorginho's form goes to sh*t, the teams form goes to sh*t. It's harsh to put that kind of pressure on one player, but that is the reality when you build a system around a few players. It would be similar if James or Chilwell were taken out of the side or their form dropped, so much of our game is built around that midfield and wing backs that it comes to pieces without them.

He only started, 4 games between November and February last season, lost one. 

Even in his 1st season under Sarri we did okay until mid January.

2 errors in his last 2 games, Mendy shouldve bailed him out today, but I dont think his overall play has been poor in either match. 

3 minutes ago, big blue said:

He only started, 4 games between November and February last season, lost one. 

Even in his 1st season under Sarri we did okay until mid January.

2 errors in his last 2 games, Mendy shouldve bailed him out today, but I dont think his overall play has been poor in either match. 

And why did he only start 4 games? because his form dropped massively. I also remember under Sarri that there were signs that he was starting to struggle, by January, he was one of our most out of form players. Teams started targetting him because he became a weak link, and because our game went through him, it effectively stopped us making any progress and we ended up getting involved in a top 4 battle. Things only started to improve for him again towards the end of the season. Jorginho has shown that at the middle part of the season, he struggles. He starts and ends well, but the middle part he is really poor.

1 minute ago, Scott Harris said:

And why did he only start 4 games? because his form dropped massively. I also remember under Sarri that there were signs that he was starting to struggle, by January, he was one of our most out of form players. Teams started targetting him because he became a weak link, and because our game went through him, it effectively stopped us making any progress and we ended up getting involved in a top 4 battle. Things only started to improve for him again towards the end of the season. Jorginho has shown that at the middle part of the season, he struggles. He starts and ends well, but the middle part he is really poor.

He wasnt playing long before the winter kicked in though, which was your point wasnt it? He was in and out of the team from the start of last season, as Lampard was looking to mold the team with his new signings. 

Under Sarri we had decent run through until mid January, Jorginho started 2 defeats up until that run of 3 defeats in 4. 

Lampards 1st season is probably the one you can level a fair criticism that he is someone the biggest culprit of playing poorly in the winter. 

There is no correlation in my opinion, as a club we have had dodgy winters going back as far as Ancelotti. 

In fact most clubs have a dodgy winter, with the fixture congestion, injuries etc, we are no different. The teams that get through the winter without a dodgy patch are 9/10 the champions in May. 

 

35 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

And why did he only start 4 games? because his form dropped massively. I also remember under Sarri that there were signs that he was starting to struggle, by January, he was one of our most out of form players. Teams started targetting him because he became a weak link, and because our game went through him, it effectively stopped us making any progress and we ended up getting involved in a top 4 battle. Things only started to improve for him again towards the end of the season. Jorginho has shown that at the middle part of the season, he struggles. He starts and ends well, but the middle part he is really poor.

I don't think it has something to do with winter. As long as we want to play this heavy control football and more importantly back 3,Jorginho is fine. 

 

1 hour ago, Frankie8Lampard said:

2 mistakes in two games that have cost us important points, as much as I love the guy, the flaws of his games get exposed when he doesn't have a Kante or Kovacic-type player to cover him.

I disagree. I have criticized Jorginho a gazillion time but today was the 1st time in a while where I thought he was bad. So many underhit pass which slow down our offense. 

 

I go so far as to say if we had had Rice in our midfield and Wet Spam had Jorginho...... we would have won that game.

The incident in the first half when Jorginho was simply out-muscled in the middle of the pitch, grabbed the ball and was booked, summed up his performance today perfectly.

1 hour ago, big blue said:

He wasnt playing long before the winter kicked in though, which was your point wasnt it? He was in and out of the team from the start of last season, as Lampard was looking to mold the team with his new signings. 

Under Sarri we had decent run through until mid January, Jorginho started 2 defeats up until that run of 3 defeats in 4. 

Lampards 1st season is probably the one you can level a fair criticism that he is someone the biggest culprit of playing poorly in the winter. 

There is no correlation in my opinion, as a club we have had dodgy winters going back as far as Ancelotti. 

In fact most clubs have a dodgy winter, with the fixture congestion, injuries etc, we are no different. The teams that get through the winter without a dodgy patch are 9/10 the champions in May. 

 

I don't think Jorginho did have a decent run through to January under Sarri though. We were grinding away before then and he wasn't playing as well as he was at the beginning of the season. By January, things got so bad for him that the fans started booing his selection in the team. Will he be as bad now? I hope not, he has been playing in England and football long enough now, he should be able to avoid these mid season slumps, but his games against United and West Ham haven't given me much confidence.

When your style of football is built around a certain player, that players form can't dip for prolonged periods, it will just kill any teams chance of success.