1 hour ago, MayosNoun! said:

Quote where Giroud was described as world class please. 
 

Giroud is a better all round player than Tammy. Had he played, we’d have won. 

No he isn’t. Fans have built him up into a player he isn’t. And IMO we would most likely have lost. You start Giroud and most of our play upfield would have been aerial not on the ground to get the most out him. 
 

Quick question if he leaves in Jan, what top team is he starting for? Forget any of the PL top 7, top Spanish teams, top Italian and top German because he isn’t getting ahead of any of their forwards.

5 minutes ago, ducavis said:

No he isn’t. Fans have built him up into a player he isn’t. And IMO we would most likely have lost. You start Giroud and most of our play upfield would have been aerial not on the ground to get the most out him. 
 

Quick question if he leaves in Jan, what top team is he starting for? Forget any of the PL top 7, top Spanish teams, top Italian and top German because he isn’t getting ahead of any of their forwards.

The funny thing about Giroud is that he is the perfect striker for Arsenal right now, he is arguably the best striker at holding up the ball in the league and would help bring Auba and Pepe into the game by occupying the CB's.

Watching Arsenal aimlessly crossing the ball into the box yesterday you would have thought they had Giroud as a CF and not Auba.

33 minutes ago, abramovich said:

Jimmy was talking in the post match whether Tammy watches himself after games, trying to correct his mistakes and I was wondering the same, too. Half of any striker's success comes from timing and movement. It's great to have speed but if that was all there's to it, guys like Giroud would never get anywhere. Tammy probably has physical attributes to be a top forward but he lacks intelligence. People talk about his pressing and it's good, but his reading of the game and anticipation need serious work. He runs when he needs to stop and stops when he needs to move. That's where all those misplaced passess and crosses come from. That's why he can't make a proper connection to at least force the keeper into a save, because too often he's not where he's supposed to be.

His heading is poor from a technical standpoint. Strikers see an attacking cross coming, they time their jump in anticipation and position themselves to connect with the ball cleanly to direct it on goal. He made a mess of every cross vs Spuds, that was painful to watch.

Absolutely spot on for me , agree 100% with your take.

I like Tammy , as much as I know him he comes across as a decent lad, but I don’t know if he’s good enough at the highest level -sadly I suspect not ?

28 minutes ago, Imran_CFC said:

The funny thing about Giroud is that he is the perfect striker for Arsenal right now, he is arguably the best striker at holding up the ball in the league and would help bring Auba and Pepe into the game by occupying the CB's.

Watching Arsenal aimlessly crossing the ball into the box yesterday you would have thought they had Giroud as a CF and not Auba.

We whipped the same balls in the box to Tammy's head. Reece's crosses are great but Tammy can't head the ball to save his life. 

Just now, evissy said:

We whipped the same balls in the box to Tammy's head. Reece's crosses are great but Tammy can't head the ball to save his life. 

Difference being we have other avenues of attack and Arsenal don't.

How many hours has it been since there last goal from open play?

Tammy is a fine player, but I simply don't see him as our number one striker. He's still young and will only become better, but at the moment I would prefer Werner or Olivier against the stronger sides, especially with the number of crosses we put in every game.

47 minutes ago, Imran_CFC said:

Difference being we have other avenues of attack and Arsenal don't.

How many hours has it been since there last goal from open play?

Against Tottenham that was the best avenue. They had all their side close to their box all game. Frank chose Tammy because they have a good chemistry between him and Werner. Don't chance if it ain't broke. Yesterday maybe Frank should have started Oli. But these are the choices you have to make and live with them. No criticism to Frank, would have done the same myself. Maybe Reece should have crossed to Tammy's feet rather than his head... 

Lets not forget, we didn't buy him from another club for bags full of money and make him our #1 striker.

He's been with the club for 16 years, 4 years ago we started sending him out on loan,did pretty good, got lots of attention, so last season he got his first big chance, and he ended up the top scorer.

He has earned his place this season, so far he's not been brilliant, and yet were in touch with the leaders, so lets not be too hasty with him and allow him time to get back to last early-mid seasons form.

He's getting treated way too harshly but some members of our fan base in my opinion. The chances he had against Spurs yesterday were nothing more than half chances really, yes maybe Giroud would have buried one but he's an elite level headerer of the ball. 

Tammy is another player who's improving every time I see him. He's a lot stronger on the ball now and his hold up/link up play is good. He's only just turned 23, he's going to be a beast at 26.

He's a good squad player for me, maybe starts big games when he's on a hot streak (like yesterday). We need players like him who love the club and provide competition. but looking forward to seeinf Werner up the middle with CHO or pulisic on the left against Leeds.    

2 hours ago, coco said:

Lets not forget, we didn't buy him from another club for bags full of money and make him our #1 striker.

He's been with the club for 16 years, 4 years ago we started sending him out on loan,did pretty good, got lots of attention, so last season he got his first big chance, and he ended up the top scorer.

He has earned his place this season, so far he's not been brilliant, and yet were in touch with the leaders, so lets not be too hasty with him and allow him time to get back to last early-mid seasons form.

What difference does it make whether he was born thousands of miles away and bought for lots of money or has been with the club forever? He's a professional footballer competing at the highest level, the only thing he should be judged upon is his contribution on the pitch.

I have to say, Tammy exceeded my expectations last season and I do think that, if he continues to improve, at the very least he can be a solid squad option for us in the future. Now, does he have what it takes to be a starter at Chelsea, I don't know, there are some serious flaws in his game and it's not just a question if he can fix those, but rather how fast that improvement can happen.

He is still a young lad and he scored 15 goals last season. He has a great mentality and his work rate is top notch. His attitude has been great; he could've easily just sulked and let the fact that we brought in attackers effect his play. 

He's not perfect, and he has plenty to improve upon, but his future is very bright.

11 minutes ago, abramovich said:

What difference does it make whether he was born thousands of miles away and bought for lots of money or has been with the club forever? He's a professional footballer competing at the highest level, the only thing he should be judged upon is his contribution on the pitch.

I have to say, Tammy exceeded my expectations last season and I do think that, if he continues to improve, at the very least he can be a solid squad option for us in the future. Now, does he have what it takes to be a starter at Chelsea, I don't know, there are some serious flaws in his game and it's not just a question if he can fix those, but rather how fast that improvement can happen.

Maybe i'm old fashioned, but i rather like the club producing and supporting our home grown players, i was getting sick of seeing fake players we got duped into shelling out millions of dollar for.

3 hours ago, DannyVblue said:

He's getting treated way too harshly but some members of our fan base in my opinion. The chances he had against Spurs yesterday were nothing more than half chances really, yes maybe Giroud would have buried one but he's an elite level headerer of the ball. 

Tammy is another player who's improving every time I see him. He's a lot stronger on the ball now and his hold up/link up play is good. He's only just turned 23, he's going to be a beast at 26.

No way are they half chances.

The first cross from James at 38 seconds is right on him, that should be any easy goal for any striker. He gets in front of his man and all he has to do is get decent contact on the ball, and it's a goal. You don't need to be an elite player at heading the ball to score that.

The second cross at 48 seconds is a bit more difficult, but again, he beats his man and should be getting on the end of it.

The third at 1:15 is the worst of the lot. The cross is right into his feet, and Abraham's legs are flying all over the place. That's a sitter for me.

 

These should not be difficult chances for strikers playing for a top 4 team. Every striker misses some chances they should score from, but I can't think of any strikers playing for our rivals that would miss all 3 of these chances.

6 hours ago, ducavis said:

No he isn’t. Fans have built him up into a player he isn’t. And IMO we would most likely have lost. You start Giroud and most of our play upfield would have been aerial not on the ground to get the most out him. 

Why do you assume that? After lockdown, Giroud was starting pretty much every game and we weren't playing aerial football then, so why would we now?

Also, all of our best chances yesterday came from crosses, it wasn't like were trying to play through Tottenham's defence, so why not play the player best suited to put those crosses into the net?

Yesterday's game was more suited to Giroud than it was Abraham.

People calling for Giroud forget he can barely manage 60mins let alone leading the press for longer. Giroud also missed a good chance at the end with a tame effort. Giroud is hardly a good enough player to be a consistent starter for most premier league sides so I dont want him to be a number 1 starter for Chelsea. His best asset is coming on as a sub in games while looking for a goal.

Werner up top is always the way to go but for some reason CHO isnt trusted while Pulisic is out.

If Giroud was the target for those chances for Tammy, Oli puts in at least one of them. Tammy's overall game and effort were absolutely excellent but the thing he is paid for, scoring, he failed in this game. Tammy is very young still and he will only improve. Reality is he is also a starting striker for a side chasing the title. He should be very proud but he should also train heading the ball outside normal training. All the absolute top players do. 

All in all Tammy is very impressive but he needs to work hard to reach next level. 

3 hours ago, Ernie_blue said:

People calling for Giroud forget he can barely manage 60mins let alone leading the press for longer. Giroud also missed a good chance at the end with a tame effort. Giroud is hardly a good enough player to be a consistent starter for most premier league sides so I dont want him to be a number 1 starter for Chelsea. His best asset is coming on as a sub in games while looking for a goal.

Werner up top is always the way to go but for some reason CHO isnt trusted while Pulisic is out.

It's not like people are asking for Giroud to play a full 90 minutes in every game, but it couldn't hurt to have him share the position with Abraham. I don't see any reason why Giroud shouldn't be starting the odd game here and there.

It's like people have forgotten that Giroud was leading the line and scored 6 goals in 9 games after lockdown, he was probably our second best player after Pulisic during that period. 

10 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

It's not like people are asking for Giroud to play a full 90 minutes in every game, but it couldn't hurt to have him share the position with Abraham. I don't see any reason why Giroud shouldn't be starting the odd game here and there.

It's like people have forgotten that Giroud was leading the line and scored 6 goals in 9 games after lockdown, he was probably our second best player after Pulisic during that period. 

Agreed. I think it's about options and strikers who suit particular games. Tammy largely is a guy who seems to score goals against more open defences where there is a bit of space.

Giroud on the other hand suits a game like Spurs where there is no space, but he can create a focal point for others to play around. Neither are great finishers so it becomes more about who benefits the team most in particular situations.

I would say that Tammy has better pressing legs than Giroud, which matters in the Lampard system. 

59 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

It's not like people are asking for Giroud to play a full 90 minutes in every game, but it couldn't hurt to have him share the position with Abraham. I don't see any reason why Giroud shouldn't be starting the odd game here and there.

It's like people have forgotten that Giroud was leading the line and scored 6 goals in 9 games after lockdown, he was probably our second best player after Pulisic during that period. 

Personally I dont rate Giroud and think his a good 3rd choice striker or 2nd choice, I dont think he should start any top games unless it's for injuries. That's just my opinion.

16 hours ago, Spiller86 said:

Agreed. I think it's about options and strikers who suit particular games. Tammy largely is a guy who seems to score goals against more open defences where there is a bit of space.

Giroud on the other hand suits a game like Spurs where there is no space, but he can create a focal point for others to play around. Neither are great finishers so it becomes more about who benefits the team most in particular situations.

I would say that Tammy has better pressing legs than Giroud, which matters in the Lampard system. 

I think if you give Giroud and Abraham the same number of game time, Giroud has the better goal tally out of the two. He is a better striker (although he definitely lacks pace but heavily compensates for that in other areas). 

The thing is with Tammy, is that he is a good striker, still young and has potential. And to be fair, Tammy does have a good goal tally, we're lucky to have him. It's a just shame he has games like this where he looks like a little boy. 

I think Frank did well starting Tammy, during the first half we needed to press them and try to create chances playing through their defensive set up. The second half should have been for Giroud. It was clear that we were going to boss them and it was also clear that Spuds would be defending very tightly. This is when Giroud should have come in to get the attention of their two CBs, opening up a bit of space and to give us a better finisher of aerial crosses.

2 hours ago, RMH said:

I think Frank did well starting Tammy, during the first half we needed to press them and try to create chances playing through their defensive set up. The second half should have been for Giroud. It was clear that we were going to boss them and it was also clear that Spuds would be defending very tightly. This is when Giroud should have come in to get the attention of their two CBs, opening up a bit of space and to give us a better finisher of aerial crosses.

I don't think it was nailed on that we were going to dominate the 2nd half. First half I actually thought Spurs were the most dangerous even though we had most of the ball and it was an even game. But he definitely should've brought Giroud on around the 60th minute or so. But that is classical hindsight I suppose... However, Tammy has never been that good in the air for me. He doesn't anticipate or get in goal scoring positions like Giroud does, he's an absolute natural at it. After Abraham scuffed up 3 chances, and lets face it he did, his lack of balance and anticipation completely bottled each of them it just looked like a terrible decision to keep him on for so long. I don't even think the lad made one successful pass in that 2nd half, he was doing everything wrong. 

On 30/11/2020 at 17:27, Scott Harris said:

Why do you assume that? After lockdown, Giroud was starting pretty much every game and we weren't playing aerial football then, so why would we now?

Also, all of our best chances yesterday came from crosses, it wasn't like were trying to play through Tottenham's defence, so why not play the player best suited to put those crosses into the net?

Yesterday's game was more suited to Giroud than it was Abraham.

Our football was way more direct last season than it is this season. With the addition of Silva & Chiwell in defence who are both comfortable with the ball, Zouma & Silva have the most touches in our games. Last season every time the defenders were pressed they cleared it upfield for Giroud to hold up.

Personally I hope Lamps starts Giroud against Sevilla so fans can understand why he isn’t starting him.

For those so quick to dismiss Abraham for having a lack of ability, I think it's important to remember that at Abraham's age, Giroud was f**king around in Ligue 2 for the mighty Tours and Montpellier.

Abraham has a long way to go before he will be a world-class target man but he also has a lot of time to do it in.