Just now, Ernie_blue said:

Conte did well to change the game, playing for the draw.

thanks for the well thought out argument, really adds to the discussion

2 minutes ago, magichat said:

could've changed the game, should've changed the game, didn't.

Conte had to change something, for half an hour all of our attacking player (Hazard included) was sitting on their arse. he's no oracle, he couldn't have predicted whether Hazard will or will not change the game had he stayed, but what he could do was judging him by his actual performance. he had every right to change him based on that.

And what about Moratta ? If Hazard needs to be subbed for bad play in the second half, what does one do about the play of Moratta ? Why single our Hazard ? Pedro for Hazard is a downgrade - Atleast Giroud for Moratta is (if anything based on current form) a lateral. 

Just now, brownindian said:

And what about Moratta ? If Hazard needs to be subbed for bad play in the second half, what does one do about the play of Moratta ? Why single our Hazard ? Pedro for Hazard is a downgrade - Atleast Giroud for Moratta is (if anything based on current form) a lateral. 

because he was changing the shape to 4-2-4 with 2 strikers upfront?

1 minute ago, magichat said:

thanks for the well thought out argument, really adds to the discussion

It's true, he done well.

4 minutes ago, The Don Antonio said:

More like thanks chelsea board. They should both have been tied down last summer, and our transfers have been a f**king disgrace

BArkley

Bakayoko

Drinkwater

Zappacosta

Give me a f**king break

As of this moment I would add Moratta to the list as well.

We've all got our opinions as to where the game was won & lost today and who was at fault. But for me it comes down to our striker just not being good enough. That first half we were all over them and Willian and Hazard were playing really well, pulling their defenders all over the place but we didn't have the man up front to capitalise on our dominance. All the top teams have a striker they rely on to make the difference. Spurs have Kane, City Aguerro, toay Utd had Lukaku. We have a bloke who spends more time on his arse than on his feet and when he is on hit feet you never feel he offers a threat anyway. A decent no.9 today and we win that game simple.

4 minutes ago, magichat said:

because he was changing the shape to 4-2-4 with 2 strikers upfront?

Well one striker and one plank of wood.

25 minutes ago, big blue said:

We have to lower our expectations, we are about the same level we were at in the late 90's. Good but not quite good enough. 

I'm not even angry anymore at defeats, just wish we showed some more balls. 

We were never going to get that morata decision old Trafford, can't blame the referee for that 2nd half perfomance. 

Unless the club is willing to invest heavily like the 2 Manchester clubs, this is where we are going to be. We are in the same boat as spurs and Liverpool, I just think we need accept it, and start building slowly. 

We can't be sacking world class managers for finishing 5th.

Another big game next weekend, and it will fingers crossed again. Top 4 is still attainable. 

Spot on post, we are a second tier club in this country now, so let's all realise it, and get on enjoy the odd victory we might achieve against the big boys. Agree we are on a level with late 90's Chelsea now, sad thing is though, I had a lot more passion for that side than I do for this one

37 minutes ago, BenCFC19 said:

He was a disgrace in the second half. Barely got into positions to receive the ball and when he did he lazily gave it away with those stupid flicks they like to do in the second half when they get tired and can't be bothered

Those flicks happened once, Willian did the same too. But hazard will get criticized over flicks and rest of the team wont

Sad thing is, I'm not even that angry or upset. Just apathetic. From the shambles of a transfer window, and the first game of the season, it was obvious this was going to be a poor year.

Losses to Burnley, Palace, Bournemouth, Watford, West Ham, City, Man Utd.

Terrible performances against Arsenal about 15 times.

And we've still got to play City, Liverpool and Spurs again. We'll be lucky if we take 3 points from those 3 games.

 

It's just all got the feel of a timid, nothing season, petering out into disappointment.

26 minutes ago, robdog said:

so is everyone ok with this call?

 

I don't know why bs like this happens to CFC

I have said it a few times this season, it's because refs are under no pressure to give us big decisions. We are hated by everybody, nobody is going to give a sh*t if we don't get decisions. The media will ignore it, opposition fans don't give a damn, but watch the reaction to City, Arsenal, United, Liverpool and Tottenham not getting big decisions. People in the media will highlight the mistake and put so much focus on it, this puts pressure on refs to give decisions in those teams favour. We don't get that, we actually get the complete opposite. Look at the reaction from the media when we get a soft penalty. Remember when Ramires got a penalty against West Brom a few years back? geez, the reaction was pathetic. The pressure from the media was so bad that ref felt he had to publicly apologise for it. It wasn't even a clear dive from Ramires, two players collided and Ramires went down, it wasn't anything like what you see from Dele Alli or Kane or Sterling or Pogba. If one of our players dives, it's highlighted for weeks and we are made to pay for it with the amount of decisions that don't go in our favour. Other teams dive and excuses are made for the dive and they continue to get big decision's in their favour.

Refs in this country are sh*t, they are so mentally weak. You see just how bad things are when you hear commentators say things like "you would be a brave ref to give a decision at this ground" when playing at places like Old Trafford......why would they be brave? is doing their job too much to ask for? If you can't give a decision against a big team playing at home, then you shouldn't be a ref.

I'm afraid it's all a question of mentality. We needed to avoid defeat today, we needed to fight for our lives, we were defending a deserved 1-0 lead against a poor side. We lost, because we lack personality, because we lack mentality, because we lack toughness.

 

Luiz and Costa are gone from last season, big personalities, both leaders. In years gone by we had JT, Lamps, Ivan, Cole, Drogba, Cech. We had pride, we were strong of body and of mind. That's all gone. We're meek, we're nice, we've lost our edge.

 

I've been a lone voice on these boards about Christensen. He's a good prospect, but he needs to toughen up, I've said it time and time again. Today we saw a classic example, a lamentable example. He went down clutching his head, Lukaku didn't, he just carried on, and got a goal. Christensen wasn't that hurt, because he bounced back up immediately, while they were still attacking, but after that he's always trying to recompose himself. I'm sorry but should he be going down when the ball is loose outside our box? Even if he's hurt? Defend your lines, wait for the opportunity, and then go down if you have to. What was he thinking? Can you imagine JT doing that? You have to defend like your life depends on it, your priority as a defender is to avoid conceding and you should do everything in your power to achieve that target. You do not go down in those circumstances. We had similar at Palace I think and we conceded, and we've had similar at other places when he's got away with it. You want to be a CB in the Prem? You have to be tough. That's a prerequisite. Ampadu isn't going down in those circumstances. He may not be ready for the big-time yet, but one thing you see with that boy is character.

 

Morata? Hit the bar and scored a good goal so it's hard to be critical, but I doubt he would have scored if he hadn't seen the flag. We were practically playing without a striker. Another yellow card and yet another game without a goal. With players like him we're only going one way and that's down. He lacks heart, he lacks bottle, and that's unforgivable at this level. You need to have a strong mentality if you're going to have an edge over your opponents. Right now they've got him in their pockets. He's fragile, physically and mentally.

 

We need tigers. We've got pussy cats. I'm afraid I'm really worried for our top four chances. This season has really been a damp squib, and I'm afraid the person most to blame is the manager. This is his team, however much he tries to distance himself from it. Maybe if he didn't distance himself so much they might have a bit more confidence, and maybe they'd play a bit more like they meant it.

 

Edit: No way we should have lost that game, but the truth is, they were just that tiny bit more up for it, and that's a pretty damning indictment.

Edited February 25, 20188 yr by Davey Baby

4 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

I have said it a few times this season, it's because refs are under no pressure to give us big decisions. We are hated by everybody, nobody is going to give a sh*t if we don't get decisions. The media will ignore it, opposition fans don't give a damn, but watch the reaction to City, Arsenal, United, Liverpool and Tottenham not getting big decisions. People in the media will highlight the mistake and put so much focus on it, this puts pressure on refs to give decisions in those teams favour. We don't get that, we actually get the complete opposite. Look at the reaction from the media when we get a soft penalty. Remember when Ramires got a penalty against West Brom a few years back? geez, the reaction was pathetic. The pressure from the media was so bad that ref felt he had to publicly apologise for it. It wasn't even a clear dive from Ramires, two players collided and Ramires went down, it wasn't anything like what you see from Dele Alli or Kane or Sterling or Pogba. If one of our players dives, it's highlighted for weeks and we are made to pay for it with the amount of decisions that don't go in our favour. Other teams dive and excuses are made for the dive and they continue to get big decision's in their favour.

Refs in this country are sh*t, they are so mentally weak. You see just how bad things are when you hear commentators say things like "you would be a brave ref to give a decision at this ground" when playing at places like Old Trafford......why would they be brave? is doing their job too much to ask for? If you can't give a decision against a big team playing at home, then you shouldn't be a ref.

I just expect it now so in contrast to previous years where I would have been going mad that a perfectly fine goal was ruled out, I'm apathetic these days as the quality of officiating in the Premier league over the last 2 years has been utterly comical, so I go into these fixtures expecting at least one atrocious decision per game. 

Regarding the offside goal today, whatever happened to giving the striker the benefit of the doubt? The linesman was in the perfect position, when he's looking straight along the line how is it f**king possible to interpret Morata to be farther ahead than the defender when he clearly isn't? Completely baffles me, I think these officials see what they want to see. 

You just saw it coming. So disappointing after such a bright start. Drinkwater, surprisingly imo was our best player today. I am fuming at Conte for doing this again. Hazard was not great but you just don't take off your best player at that minute. Ridiculous. They scored shortly after he came off and who is their to inspire magic? No one! Such a poor decision. He still was dangerous and a player Mourinho must of been smiling secretly in delight when he saw him come off.

As good as the defence are, my worry sometimes is that none of them are physical powerhouses and very commanding. Rudiger to some extent. Not a major problem but just concerned how easily Lukaku was able to easily shrug off our defenders throughout the match.

That loss is really a blow. I don't see us getting anything at City. Best a draw and considering Liverpool have Newcastle at home and Spurs have Huddersfield at Wembley, you imagine them pulling even further away. Not impossible to get top 4 but a huge ask. Those losses against relegation fighting teams looks like it will prove pivotal right now. Games like Bournemouth, Burnley, West Ham, Watford, we just can't afford to be losing all those games. Just ridiculous when you think about it. They are hugely costing us.

The only hope that makes me think we may get something out of City is that they go to Emirates on Thursday and then have a game three days after against us. Hopefully fatigue kicks in but even then still don't have much hopes of getting anything there.

25 minutes ago, Jamjar1986 said:

I also agree, but conte has got to do better, has been playing the victim for months and its turned our season into a complete shambles, liverpool strengthening, spurs new stadium to come, we are gona end up miles away with a board not wanting to invest

Can't believe Spurs are getting a new stadium before us. We are falling further behind our rivals

Can't believe Spurs are getting a new stadium before us. We are falling further behind our rivals

 

If you want to blame someone for it, Chelsea Pitch Owners should be it.

 

If they didn’t refuse to move from the Bridge so many times, maybe we would have a new stadium by now.

 

I love the idea of staying there, but the construction of the stadium will really put our progression as a whole. And by the looks of it and how hard it is to start, the new stadium may be done in no less than 10 years, in the best-case scenario.

1 hour ago, Jamjar1986 said:

Missing out on top 4 is gonna be catastrophic, no world class signing,and probably hazard and courtouis gone, thanks conte

Don't think it's all his fault.....he has a squad of players that can down tools at any time during the season, whether it be for one or more games; this bunch downed tools far too often against physical teams that are fighting to avoid relegation, most recently the likes Watford, Bournemouth, West Ham, Palace...change those loses and names to Liverpool, Utd, City and Spurs plus Arsenal and it would not be a surprise and none of us would be moaning too much

50 minutes ago, magichat said:

could've changed the game, should've changed the game, didn't.

Conte had to change something, for half an hour all of our attacking player (Hazard included) was sitting on their arse. he's no oracle, he couldn't have predicted whether Hazard will or will not change the game had he stayed, but what he could do was judging him by his actual performance. he had every right to change him based on that.

He's no oracle? He's a football manager who's paid over 100k a week.

And taking Hazard off has benefited us in what way exactly? A lot of pundits have even said it's bizarre why he keeps taking Hazard off because it doesn't serve any good purpose. This is the same Eden Hazard who used to play 180 minutes a week for Jose no problem at all, the same Eden Hazard that would put in 9/10 performances on the usual while having to defend. 

Now when he doesn't have the best of games he gets subbed off, it's ridiculous. Hazard is a game changer without him we struggle, to take him off is never a good bet and I really think it made a difference today without him, you don't want to be chasing a game with Hazard not on the team. 

maybe for now weve had our time in the sun ,i bet liverpool spurs and arsenal fans would have liked our trophies over the pas t few years.

at the moment we are the fifth best team ,it will need some major investment to turn it around , but Roman dosent seem bothered  

Did not see the game so can someone tell me what went wrong? Looked a good line up and we scored first right?

How did morata do?

Obviously losing to a top 4 rival while Liverpool and spurs win is really poor. Our top 4 hopes look bleak. City next too.

7 minutes ago, axman2526 said:

Did not see the game so can someone tell me what went wrong? Looked a good line up and we scored first right?

How did morata do?

Obviously losing to a top 4 rival while Liverpool and spurs win is really poor. Our top 4 hopes look bleak. City next too.

I think this pretty much covers it..........................

7 minutes ago, axman2526 said:

Did not see the game so can someone tell me what went wrong? Looked a good line up and we scored first right?

How did morata do?

Obviously losing to a top 4 rival while Liverpool and spurs win is really poor. Our top 4 hopes look bleak. City next too.

Started off very well, Dodgy officiating and took our foot off the gas second half and Morata was an embarressment, even though he had a perfectly good goal ruled offside wrongly.

a single frame view of the offsides goal call?

2 minutes ago, robdog said:

a single frame view of the offsides goal call?

Never offside and people defending the linesman must be doing lines themselves. 

You can literally see the only thing that's offside is his arm, which doesn't count, shameful to even make a call like that. We really need to start making more noise against these decisions, Jose did just that for us, Conte needs to do the same, we got absolutely robbed today. 

We were definitely the better team overall, especially in the first half when we played some lovely football. Morata was desperately unlucky to hit the bar and then to have a perfectly good goal ruled offside. On another day that would have been two goals. I would have kept Hazard on personally but wasn't surprised to see him go off, it wasn't one of his better performances and Willian is untouchable at the moment. Christensen has had a bit of a wobble the last couple of games but he's still developing as a player so I won't hold it against him. He's still a safer solid centre back than Luiz or Cahill these days.

So a very disappointing result but nothing like as bad as many of the insane overreactions here would have you believe.