4 hours ago, Gol15 said:

No it's not a coincidence that happen but at the same time it showed how that formation depends maybe too much on them. We started in a 3-4-2-1 last season with a draw and 2 wins, the same result as we had now with the 4-2-2-2/4-1-4-1 so we're good in both formations but the question is do we really need the 3 at the back against most teams?

Thats exactly it. If we are effective with back 4 why reverse to back 5 and take one of the attackers off for a defender and rely on our wing backs AGAIN for goals. 

The mood among many of #Chelsea’s attackers 'isn’t good' due to the way Thomas Tuchel 'uses and treats them'. The situation has 'grown serious enough' for some of them to start considering leaving in the summer.

[via @TheAthleticUK]
 

Underperforming players blame manager shock. It would be easier for me to be sympathetic with them if they weren’t either missing sitters or going missing most games

17 minutes ago, timetowaste said:

The mood among many of #Chelsea’s attackers 'isn’t good' due to the way Thomas Tuchel 'uses and treats them'. The situation has 'grown serious enough' for some of them to start considering leaving in the summer.

[via @TheAthleticUK]
 

Underperforming players blame manager shock. It would be easier for me to be sympathetic with them if they weren’t either missing sitters or going missing most games

Apparently Tuechel is brutal in terms of yelling at every mistake or failed attempt by the forwards. No one likes a micro-manager as coach. It can limit creativity and cause players to play too cautious. That also  doesn’t help with recruiting new players either as word gets around. 

5 minutes ago, TheGreatestGame said:

Apparently Tuechel is brutal in terms of yelling at every mistake or failed attempt by the forwards. No one likes a micro-manager as coach. It can limit creativity and cause players to play too cautious. That also  doesn’t help with recruiting new players either as word gets around. 

Pep and klopp are bigger micro-managers. Look at United with Ole and his lax attitude and where it got them. If players feel they are being asked to do too much, they can leave. But I don't see lack of effort in games so I think the story is mostly BS or came from fringe players like Barkley.

1 hour ago, timetowaste said:

The mood among many of #Chelsea’s attackers 'isn’t good' due to the way Thomas Tuchel 'uses and treats them'. The situation has 'grown serious enough' for some of them to start considering leaving in the summer.

[via @TheAthleticUK]
 

Underperforming players blame manager shock. It would be easier for me to be sympathetic with them if they weren’t either missing sitters or going missing most games

Even if true not so easy to move on as most of them are on huge contracts so their options are basically United or PSG.

Realistically only Ziyech and Pulisic would draw feasible interest from elsewhere to suit all parties. So would Mount but no way this article is about him.

2 hours ago, timetowaste said:

The mood among many of #Chelsea’s attackers 'isn’t good' due to the way Thomas Tuchel 'uses and treats them'. The situation has 'grown serious enough' for some of them to start considering leaving in the summer.

[via @TheAthleticUK]
 

Underperforming players blame manager shock. It would be easier for me to be sympathetic with them if they weren’t either missing sitters or going missing most games

Are they actually missing sitters though? I think fans and manager alike might be too harsh on these forward players. We are not actually creating big chances in comparison to a City or Liverpool. Salah before he went to the African Cup of Nations missed 4 big chances in his last 5 PL games. Lukaku in comparison has only missed 1 in his last 6 PL games. Calum who gets hammered on here has also missed 2 in his last 7 PL games.

Below is a comprehensive list for this season, Havertz is the highest Chelsea player at 18th just to put things in context.

 

https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/players/big_chance_missed

3 hours ago, ducavis said:

Are they actually missing sitters though? I think fans and manager alike might be too harsh on these forward players. We are not actually creating big chances in comparison to a City or Liverpool. Salah before he went to the African Cup of Nations missed 4 big chances in his last 5 PL games. Lukaku in comparison has only missed 1 in his last 6 PL games. Calum who gets hammered on here has also missed 2 in his last 7 PL games.

Below is a comprehensive list for this season, Havertz is the highest Chelsea player at 18th just to put things in context.

 

https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/players/big_chance_missed

Some interesting stats on that site.

I looked at "number of shots". There is not a single Chelsea player in the Top 20. Mount is our highest, at tied 21st.

Here is the top 20 :

 

We simply aren't trying our luck enough, or creating enough chances.

That story is fake. Media just likes to stir the pot.

30 minutes ago, Frankie8Lampard said:

That story is fake. Media just likes to stir the pot.

They are on my list of ignorable sources, as are most of the sites you get directed to on "Newsnow Chelsea" :-) 

1 hour ago, Sexyfootball said:

They are on my list of ignorable sources, as are most of the sites you get directed to on "Newsnow Chelsea" 🙂

Just out of curiosity, are there any British media that aren't this biased when it comes to us? Sorry for the off topic.. 

Edited January 26, 20224 yr by wizardous

One year on and overall he's done a very good job.

A- in my opinion.

Winning the Champions League gets him into the top bracket but he misses out on a solid A for not being able to challenge City (Pool will pull away too) and not being able to get a single attacker consistently firing in this team. 

 

He's done a great job. He has a footballing philosophy that works for us I think. Immediately when he came he said Chelsea has always been about defending. He is a manager that wants his teams to defend with the ball. 

He also seems he doesn't take sh*t from anyone. He has that fire on the sidelines. He leads the team without a doubt.

Trouble he has faced this season is the constant injuries, covid and Lukaku. I don't think he falls this season but it remains to be seen. He is so volatile anything can happen at any moment. 

9 hours ago, wizardous said:

Just out of curiosity, are there any British media that aren't this biased when it comes to us? Sorry for the off topic.. 

I take most of my Chelsea info from www.chelseafc.com :-) 

And Gol ... :-)

14 hours ago, Frankie8Lampard said:

That story is fake. Media just likes to stir the pot.

I think not. Simon Philips is  a credible source and Pulisic starts complaining as soon as he’s with the USA team https://weaintgotnohistory.sbnation.com/2022/1/27/22903614/pulisic-to-just-keep-going-as-his-up-and-down-year-continues-at-chelsea

There is no doubt in my mind that Pulisic want to leave. Havertz and Werner are unlikely to be super happy about their careers stagnating either.

Havertz for example was probably considered the biggest talent in Europe before we signed him. Unfortunately he's failed to perform for Lampard and now also for Tuchel (despite some great performances in CL last season) and now he's become a impact sub here.

Everyone who wants to leave can leave as far as i'm concerned. Keeping the manager is far more important and if Havertz, Pulisic and Werner want to leave they'll have to be prepared for a reduced salary somewhere else but i'd sell them all in a heartbeat if we could somehow recoup most of our money.

Basically all of our forwards could complain about not being given time in their preferred position in a preferred system.

Havertz is a number 10, never gets played as one. False 9 mostly or occasional wide forward.

Werner is a left forward playing off a main striker, often  played as a main striker or wide right winger, occasional left winger.

Mount is a number 8, never plays there due to the system. Mostly inside forward.

CHO is a left winger, of all the forwards he has most games in his preferred position but can often  be put wide right, as a second striker or wingback.

Ziyech is a right wide attacker, has been on the bench a lot and when played has been used a bit on left.

Pulisic is a left winger, he rarely is used there. Often right winger, striker or wing back.

Lukaku likes to play as part of strike partnership and to peel off to the right side and run at defenders, but mainly plays as a target man loan striker.

So basically it could be about any or all of them.

Edited January 27, 20224 yr by axman2526

1 hour ago, axman2526 said:

Basically all of our forwards could complain about not being given time in their preferred position in a preferred system.

Havertz is a number 10, never gets played as one. False 9 mostly or occasional wide forward.

Werner is a left forward playing off a main striker, often  played as a main striker or wide right winger, occasional left winger.

Mount is a number 8, never plays there due to the system. Mostly inside forward.

CHO is a left winger, of all the forwards he has most games in his preferred position but can often  be put wide right, as a second striker or wingback.

Ziyech is a right wide attacker, has been on the bench a lot and when played has been used a bit on left.

Pulisic is a left winger, he rarely is used there. Often right winger, striker or wing back.

Lukaku likes to play as part of strike partnership and to peel off to the right side and run at defenders, but mainly plays as a target man loan striker.

So basically it could be about any or all of them.

Literally nobody plays in their preferred position. No wonder our forward play is so dire. It would be interesting to see how the club evaluates players for signing. 

6 hours ago, Sindre said:

There is no doubt in my mind that Pulisic want to leave. Havertz and Werner are unlikely to be super happy about their careers stagnating either.

Havertz for example was probably considered the biggest talent in Europe before we signed him. Unfortunately he's failed to perform for Lampard and now also for Tuchel (despite some great performances in CL last season) and now he's become a impact sub here.

Everyone who wants to leave can leave as far as i'm concerned. Keeping the manager is far more important and if Havertz, Pulisic and Werner want to leave they'll have to be prepared for a reduced salary somewhere else but i'd sell them all in a heartbeat if we could somehow recoup most of our money.

Havertz didnt play much for Lamps - was injured and never had a pre-season. Yes keeping the manager is absolutely important - but at times managers need to also be flexible. Many in this forum have said that the 3 at the back and constant rotation is killing our forward play. On top of that for some strange reason too frequently players are being played out of position.

Even in the game against city Pulisic played on the left and Ziyech on the right when its clear that both perform better on the opposite wing. It was quite bizzare. 

Look i like Tuchel but the board will be unhappy if 220 mil dollar talent foes down the train.

25 minutes ago, Jangz said:

Pulisic played on the left and Ziyech on the right when its clear that both perform better on the opposite wing. It was quite bizzare. 

 

What and miss these kind of goals ? Ziyech is way better on the right.

Players using the "Im playing in the wrong position" is a lazy excuse for poor form IMO. Pulisic only played false nine in less than a handful of games, he should be the last one to complain about being played out of position.

1 hour ago, coco said:

 

What and miss these kind of goals ? Ziyech is way better on the right.

i meant ziyech played on the left and pulisic on the right against city. see even when i type i can think of no other way to play them - wonder why TT does.

11 hours ago, mojo said:

I think not. Simon Philips is  a credible source 

By credible do you mean copy and pastes what actual journalists write? 

1 hour ago, ForeverCarefree said:

By credible do you mean copy and pastes what actual journalists write? 

6 hours ago, Frankie8Lampard said:

Players using the "Im playing in the wrong position" is a lazy excuse for poor form IMO. Pulisic only played false nine in less than a handful of games, he should be the last one to complain about being played out of position.

It isn’t only “False Nine” though, he has been played as a RW, and a WB. Look around the league, no teams move their wingers around. It doesn’t help in finding rhythm and consistency, then you add in the constant rotation. 

They have the right to be unhappy and it would be kind of surprising if they were happy as attackers at this point in time. Tuchel needs to figure it out, I think it's going to be a busy summer for him.