1 hour ago, venom2011 said:

Utter tripe. Save for the moments where we've been low on confidence or personnel, the general style of play has been better than every club in the league bar City. Have you watched any Man Utd, Arsenal, Spurs games this season? I've seen quite a few Liverpool games as well and they pretty much exist in moments and with ruthless efficiency - not unlike some of the football we've played in the past. 

Yep. I get the frustration of recent results and performances and my confidence that we can eventually find a way to match the top 2 in terms of week by week consistency has taken a massive knock in recent weeks but the sweeping statements about how we will blow top 4, get hammered in the FA Cup final and how a UCL triumph where we conceded a mere 4 goals and were behind for a grand total of 4 minutes in 13 games in being retconned as a lucky fluke is a bit too much.

9 minutes ago, Argo said:

Yep. I get the frustration of recent results and performances and my confidence that we can eventually find a way to match the top 2 in terms of week by week consistency has taken a massive knock in recent weeks but the sweeping statements about how we will blow top 4, get hammered in the FA Cup final and how a UCL triumph where we conceded a mere 4 goals and were behind for a grand total of 4 minutes in 13 games in being retconned as a lucky fluke is a bit too much.

😉

Hopefully the new owners see that, in order for us to compete again, we need a lot of changes without best youth added to new players.

This cycle is at an end.

So long as we achieve top 4, and we will, TT should should fine.

Imo the new owners will care most about us being in the CL for the money. Wyss and Clearlake will only care about makong money, and our other priority will be the stadium rebuild.

I don't imagine the new owners are so stupid to think this squad and the failures we have made in the market, of which Lukaku is king, can compete over a league season with the top two without major investment; and in today's market that probably means 500mill plus.

Imo our time at the top table is over for this cycle. Maybe we will be back up there in a few years or more, but for now we have too many players near the end which need replacing, whereas the top two are well oiled machines that keep replacement parts in reserve.

Still I have no complaints. Titles, cups, European and World champions, so amazing players and managers. It really has been a privilege being Roman's club.

Can someone please tell Tuchel that he needs to start Chalobah, who hasn't been on a losing side for the entire season (excepting the EFL Final penalty shoot out to Liverpool, which I don't really count as a loss as it finished as a draw in actual playing time).

I also fail to see how Barkley or Saul could be any worse in midfield than what we have seen in recent weeks, and what is the point of recalling Kenedy (presumably as a left wing back) if he is never ever going to play ? 

Use the whole damn squad !!!

My only pass I’ll give the team is that has been a long season for them. We will have played in 63 out of 65 possible games this season. It’s probably taking it’s toll - especially with all the off field stuff. They’ve not a full week break for AGES?
 

Clutching at straws?

Didn’t realise the Leicester game has been moved so this week will be the their first full week off in months. Should do them good and freshen them up

4 hours ago, axman2526 said:

So long as we achieve top 4, and we will, TT should should fine.

Imo the new owners will care most about us being in the CL for the money. Wyss and Clearlake will only care about makong money, and our other priority will be the stadium rebuild.

I don't imagine the new owners are so stupid to think this squad and the failures we have made in the market, of which Lukaku is king, can compete over a league season with the top two without major investment; and in today's market that probably means 500mill plus.

Imo our time at the top table is over for this cycle. Maybe we will be back up there in a few years or more, but for now we have too many players near the end which need replacing, whereas the top two are well oiled machines that keep replacement parts in reserve.

Still I have no complaints. Titles, cups, European and World champions, so amazing players and managers. It really has been a privilege being Roman's club.

£500m!? Is that in one transfer window? & has any club ever gone over the £250m barrier in a window? Can’t see it happening; he will rightly get 2-3 signings, and be tasked with integrating Broja, Gallagher + 1 more youth loanee which is fair IMO.

On 26/04/2022 at 19:14, axman2526 said:

Let's be honest it would take an insane level of investment in the first team to have us improve both our quality and depth to be able to compete with City and Pool. 

It would be better if we invested wisely and look for gems like Diaz and spend 30-50mill a player and not go for the 100plus mill players. A slow build, is what Klopp has done to make his side.

We also need an honest look at what we already have. Take Mendy for example. We came in to the season many of us believing he is one of the best, but while his kicking remains as terrible as it is it becomes a compete liability too us. 

If he does not improve in that aspect then we need a new number 1 as good as Allison if we are to compete at the top.

I don’t agree to this … I think it’s our first team that is not strong enough.. don’t really think backup options at pool or city work.. last year when they had a couple of injuries they tailed off .. similar with city..

I don’t think you can underestimate the impact of losing James and chilwell had on our season.

on Mendy he comes us with great saves routinely.. on his kicking ederson and Allison also regularity mis kick.. not really bothered 

I think it’s just that we need to mix up a little always playing short puts too much pressure on our defenders who end up making mistakes.

3 hours ago, Sexyfootball said:

Can someone please tell Tuchel that he needs to start Chalobah, who hasn't been on a losing side for the entire season (excepting the EFL Final penalty shoot out to Liverpool, which I don't really count as a loss as it finished as a draw in actual playing time).

I also fail to see how Barkley or Saul could be any worse in midfield than what we have seen in recent weeks, and what is the point of recalling Kenedy (presumably as a left wing back) if he is never ever going to play ? 

Use the whole damn squad !!!

He should use Chalobah, Ziyech and Pulisic more but it’s a bigger risk to start a game with Saul and Barkley in the midfield and had he done that everyone would have complained about it.

TT certainly playing a big part in this. I get the players have had a long season,  but again, better squad management would mitigate against that.

Saul was just looking like he was adapting to the pace of the EPL and getting into some form, then bang, dropped off the face of the earth. Kenedy was back, had a sub appearance, the bang, never seen again. Barkley played a few at the tail end of last year, and looked above RLC, then bang, he was gone.

Now - I am not saying Those 3 are the answers to our prayers,  but a more effective use of the squad would have helped us.

But....by far and away the biggest issue for me is the pace at which we play and the sheer predictability of our game. We are well and truly figured our.

If shedend simpletons like me and Gol15 can see our play is too slow and sideways, then why can't TT? And if he CAN see that the players are not playing quickly enough, why is he not doing anything about it. 

Unfortunately, I fear that he wants us to play on this dull way - control and "precision" will only get so far in the EPL. You also need speed -mid thought and passing - which is where Liverscum and citeh excel. 

On 26/04/2022 at 14:44, axman2526 said:

Let's be honest it would take an insane level of investment in the first team to have us improve both our quality and depth to be able to compete with City and Pool. 

It would be better if we invested wisely and look for gems like Diaz and spend 30-50mill a player and not go for the 100plus mill players. A slow build, is what Klopp has done to make his side.

We also need an honest look at what we already have. Take Mendy for example. We came in to the season many of us believing he is one of the best, but while his kicking remains as terrible as it is it becomes a compete liability too us. 

If he does not improve in that aspect then we need a new number 1 as good as Allison if we are to compete at the top.

It is a myth that both City & Liverpool have depth. Take a look at Liverpool’s bench v Villarreal in a CL semi; Williams, Matip, Gomez, Elliott, Milner, Jota, Keita, Origi & Minamino. Jota, & Matip are the real quality, at a stretch you might say Keita. City were no different v Madrid; Egan-Riley, Mbete, Ake, Gundogan, Fernandinho, McAtee, Lavia, Grealish, Sterling & Palmer. Most of those names are unknown with Sterling, Grealish & Gundogan the standouts. Our Fans would tear their hair out if we ever had that level of quality in a league game, not even a CL semi. Now compare with our bench v Everton, and this whole idea those they have better depth or quality than us just doesn’t add up.
 

What Klopp & Pep seem to be able to do is mix it up without a real drop in quality, this is where Tuchel fails IMO.

21 minutes ago, ducavis said:

It is a myth that both City & Liverpool have depth. Take a look at Liverpool’s bench v Villarreal in a CL semi; Williams, Matip, Gomez, Elliott, Milner, Jota, Keita, Origi & Minamino. Jota, & Matip are the real quality, at a stretch you might say Keita. City were no different v Madrid; Egan-Riley, Mbete, Ake, Gundogan, Fernandinho, McAtee, Lavia, Grealish, Sterling & Palmer. Most of those names are unknown with Sterling, Grealish & Gundogan the standouts. Our Fans would tear their hair out if we ever had that level of quality in a league game, not even a CL semi. Now compare with our bench v Everton, and this whole idea those they have better depth or quality than us just doesn’t add up.
 

What Klopp & Pep seem to be able to do is mix it up without a real drop in quality, this is where Tuchel fails IMO.

Tuchel is trying to do that with Pulisic being his go-to sub when needed. Feels like Klopp and Pep rotate  a bit more but even if that isn’t true Liverpool looks like anyone can step in and do the job when given the minutes which isn’t the case for us...

You know I wanted Willian to leave so badly the last 4 years he was here.

But our attack has dropped so badly in quality, to the point yesterday we would have looked better with Willian still here.

That’s how bad this is.

Also sorry but I strongly dislike Lampard because what he did to Tomori. Un-fecking-forgivable. I liked Tomori and he got rid of him. He would have been perfect for a Rudi replacement. Now we are in limbo.

Edited May 2, 20224 yr by Mana

2 hours ago, Mana said:

You know I wanted Willian to leave so badly the last 4 years he was here.

But our attack has dropped so badly in quality, to the point yesterday we would have looked better with Willian still here.

That’s how bad this is.

Also sorry but I strongly dislike Lampard because what he did to Tomori. Un-fecking-forgivable. I liked Tomori and he got rid of him. He would have been perfect for a Rudi replacement. Now we are in limbo.

Frank did stop playing Tomori for some reason. However the club are to blame for letting him go. He was sent out on loan, with the option to buy, just 3 days berfore Frank was shown the door. So the club would have known Frank was leaving at that point and had other options with Tomori.

2 hours ago, Mana said:

You know I wanted Willian to leave so badly the last 4 years he was here.

But our attack has dropped so badly in quality, to the point yesterday we would have looked better with Willian still here.

That’s how bad this is.

Also sorry but I strongly dislike Lampard because what he did to Tomori. Un-fecking-forgivable. I liked Tomori and he got rid of him. He would have been perfect for a Rudi replacement. Now we are in limbo.

LOL - you know things are bad when people start pining for Willian !

I can't dislike Lampard, but he didn't exactly cover himself in management glory in his handling of Tomori. 

Given we also let Guehi go, and then allowed three of our defenders to reach end of contract without a renewal, we've basically blasted both barrels at our central defensive feet ... let's hope somebody at the club learns some lessons and we manage to keep hold of Colwill. Probably worth placing a bet that he gets sold in the summer :-) 

If new ownership wants to focus on sustainability then they would keep a hold of the academy prospects and get rid of the leeches on our wage bill who either offer nothing or want to leave. 

I think we will eventually make top 4 and give Liverpool at least hell if not win the final. These late showings are then long forgotten. 

I personally trust some of our players to drive us to that. Namely Mount, Silva, Rudiger, Azpilicueta, Havertz to name a few. 

If we make top 4 and win the cup we have had a brilliant season considering Lukaku was a total failure and Chilly and Reece were mostly out. Think about it 3 of our most important goalmakers not available. Lukaku has only himself to blame.

18 hours ago, forbzy said:

Who knows whether Lukaku was really his choice? Either way though he sanctioned the signing so at that point he is always going to be held accountable.

I would argue that some of the club's decisions on outgoings were even worse last summer though. We let both Tammy and Giroud leave, plus Broja on loan, bringing in only Lukaku as striker. Even if he had worked out better, there were still the risk he would get injured and we then had little cover.

We also sold 2 highly promising CB's in Tomori, and Guehi despite knowing that most of our CB's were coming to the end of their contracts. Instead we could have started to phase the older players out this season and brought in Guehi and Tomori. Chalobah and Sarr could have gone out on a loan for a year instead. Now we have a hell of a job ahead this summer to replace the key players in defense.

Chalobah and Sarr were supposed to go on loan but were kept because once we sold Zouma Sevilla tried to squeeze significantly more money for Kounde than was previously agreed. Kounde deal fell through and we had to keep Trevoh and Malang as a result.

Rudiger and Silva are world class defenders and guaranteed starters. Tomori and Guehi left because they wanted playing time and they're both current starters in their respective clubs so they certainly don't regret their decisions. Also, Tomori had his own share of errors under Frank after a bright start, so let's not rewrite history here. Also Serie A is a mere shadow of what it used to be. Guehi's looking solid for Palace but doing well at a midtable club isn't the same as performing for Chelsea, different kind of pressure. Of course I'd rather have Guehi on the bench than Sarr, but one was ready to be a bench warmer while the other wasn't. You can't have everything.

As far as Rudiger/Christensen contract situation. People tend to forget that Rudiger was between solid to average to shocking under Lampard. Before Tuchel turned him into a top defender he wasn't exactly in demand and I wouldn't be surprised if they were thinking about unloading him after 2020- 21 season, prior to TT's arrival. If someone told you at the time that soon Real would be competing for his signature against other top European clubs you'be laughed out of the room. But once his value started to rise I bet his agent started getting calls from everyone of note and that changes things. Same for Christensen who went back on his word once Barca convinced him to run out his last year of contract. If it wasn't for the ownership issue we may have reached the agreement with Rudiger and there were rumours we were close right before the crisis, who knows, but it doesn't matter anymore.

Edited May 2, 20224 yr by abramovich

1 minute ago, abramovich said:

Chalobah and Sarr were supposed to go on loan but were kept because once we sold Zouma Sevilla tried to squeeze significantly more money for Kounde than was previously agreed. Kounde deal fell through and we had to keep Trevoh and Malang as a result.

Rudiger and Silva are world class defenders and guaranteed starters. Tomori and Guehi left because they wanted playing time and they're both current starters in their respective clubs so they certainly don't regret their decisions. Also, Tomori had his own share of errors under Frank after a bright start, so let's not rewrite history here. Also Serie A is a mere shadow of what it used to be. Guehi's looking solid for Palace but doing well at a midtable club isn't the same as performing for Chelsea, different kind of pressure. Of course I'd rather have Guehi on the bench than Sarr, but one was ready to be a bench warmer while the other wasn't. You can't have everything.

As far as Rudiger/Christensen contract situation. People tend to forget that Rudiger was between solid to average to shocking under Lampard. Before Tuchel turned him into a top defender he wasn't exactly in demand and I wouldn't be surprised if they were thinking about unloading him after 2020- 21 season, pripor to TT's arrival. If someone told you at the time that soon Real would be competing for his signature against other top European clubs you'be laughed out of the room. But once things changed I bet his agent started getting calls from everyone of note and that changes things. Same for Christensen who went back on his word once Barca convinced him to run out his last year of contract. If it wasn't for the ownership issue we may have reached the agreement with Rudiger and there were rumours we were close right before the crisis, who knows, but it doesn't matter anymore.

I agree with you about the Kounde deal, but that is ultimately on the board. Negotiating deals for players is their job, and they failed to get Kounde last summer. Sure Sevilla wanted to maximize the price but all clubs do that and perhaps we should have waited until that deal was confirmed before selling Zouma. Kounde (or other targets) won't be any easier to acquire now and we will probably end up paying even more. Had we picked up Kounde last summer we would have had much better defensive coverage this season, and would be in a better place to deal with the departures of Rudiger/Christensen etc.

Are TTS coaching limitations laid bare for us fans to criticise, because for a season he allows Dave to play stoopid 10yd pointless passes, same with Rudi to Alonso, then Jorginho rinse and repeat, with no real intention to set up our attackers, don’t tell me we have no creativity, Jorgino and  Kova are both sublime passers, just seem they are coached not to…

Forgot who posted it but they were spot on in saying Tuchel has deserved the time to bring his own players in to see if he can rid of this pointless recycled possession play. 

 

2 hours ago, evissy said:

If we make top 4 

We will. Spurs will lose next Saturday and one or both of them and Arsenal have to drop points in their game against each other.

2 hours ago, evissy said:

and win the cup 

We won't. That's a pipedream mate. Our opponent is better than us in every position and their manager is better than ours.

40 minutes ago, axman2526 said:

We will. Spurs will lose next Saturday and one or both of them and Arsenal have to drop points in their game against each other.

We won't. That's a pipedream mate. Our opponent is better than us in every position and their manager is better than ours.

If we are on our game and not screwed by poor refs we can beat them.. they have only beaten us this season on penalties .

10 minutes ago, Jangz said:

If we are on our game and not screwed by poor refs we can beat them.. they have only beaten us this season on penalties .

But we will get screwed by either the ref or var,the only way we won't is if Liverpool are 3 up.

Let's be real, we'll screw ourselves before VAR gets involved.