1 hour ago, Frankie8Lampard said:

Hard to tell. Mourinho was 10th with a championship winning squad halfway through the season. Once you lose the dressing room, which apparently Tuchel did, anything can happen.

If Tuchel had lost the dressing room there would have been an immediate new manager bounce, aside from the first 10 mins vs Salzburg there really wasnt one.

 

If anything, judging by Kieron Dyer's comments, most players were opposed to Tuchel leaving, and it's Potter that's struggling to win them over.

9 minutes ago, Sconnie Blue said:

Sacking Tuchel when we did was a dumb decision, not the sacking itself. 

There are a lot of flaws with Tuchel many do not recognize. These flaws hinder what this club is now trying to do. 

This is bang on. If they wanted to sack Tuchel they should've done it either as soon as the take over went through, or at least given him all of this season before sacking him.

Sacking him 5 days after the transfer window shut was 100% the wrong time to do so. 

13 minutes ago, drjonesy1994 said:

This is bang on. If they wanted to sack Tuchel they should've done it either as soon as the take over went through, or at least given him all of this season before sacking him.

Sacking him 5 days after the transfer window shut was 100% the wrong time to do so. 

Think Tuchel also showed his inability to build a team and it became evident his vision for established players was well off to what Boehly/Vivell wanted to do, which is buy younger talents and develop them in the hope it ensures sustainability. 

40 minutes ago, Drogba1 said:

Frank Lampard was a club legend, but it was clear that he wasn't tactically up to it, sacking him was the correct decision. He didn't achieve (as a manager) what Tuchel did for the club. 5 cup finals in 18 months with the legendary forwards Werner and Havertz up front, that's an insane achievement. Sacking Tuchel has beem one of the dumbest decisions in this clubs history.

Some of us were ready to give Lamps more time to see if he was capable of turning it around, we had been top of the league in November to then take a dip in form over the christmas period, as usual (if I remember correctly). Regarding Tuchel, there was a lot of concern regarding the way we were playing and the results we were having towards the end of last season and the beginning of this. Iirc there was even a poll (or it may have been discussed in his topic) to see whether we should give him more time or sack him, and I was ready to give him time, at least until the WC. The majority of us were shocked the way he was sacked, and surely I think it was wrong the way and the timing. BUT, and this is my point, just like Lampard was the past when some of us were 'complaining' about him being sacked, Tuchel is the past as well, and he is not coming back to Chelsea any time soon if there's any truth in how bad he and Boehly got on. So, let's just look to the future, under Potter or without Potter, but this constant reminder of Tuchel's tenure here is getting a bit tedious (plus there's a lot of rewriting, to be honest).

2 hours ago, Gol15 said:

What was the most expensive transfer of Potter prior to Enzo?!

Mudryk like a week or so before.

Not content with having one go and his apology, Arteta is going in on Lee Mason again, saying he does not know how to do his job:

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/12810919/arsenal-boss-mikel-arteta-accuses-var-lee-mason-of-not-understanding-his-job-after-brentfords-equaliser-at-emirates

Will the FA act on this? Quite the contrast to Potters reaction to the handball that led to no apology.

I love Tuchel and I'm not necessarily a Potter die hard fan, but if you look at Tuchel's last post match interview after Zagreb you'd be hard pressed to find any difference with what he is describing and what we're seeing now. Sounds to me like we were heading in this direction regardless of who's in charge.

 

12 minutes ago, yaz said:

I love Tuchel and I'm not necessarily a Potter die hard fan, but if you look at Tuchel's last post match interview after Zagreb you'd be hard pressed to find any difference with what he is describing and what we're seeing now. Sounds to me like we were heading in this direction regardless of who's in charge.

 

At least he looks like someone who's deeply frustrated with the performance and wants to win. Potter just seems to carry a small club mentality in comparison.

7 minutes ago, Drogba1 said:

At least he looks like someone who's deeply frustrated with the performance and wants to win. Potter just seems to carry a small club mentality in comparison.

So you basically want the manager to express what you as a fan feel. 

Potter just said it perfectly when asked why he wasn't angry when we didn't get a penalty for the handball..I really liked his take on that. Just watch his presser from 15 minutes ago.

2 hours ago, RIP Mourinho said:

2-1 win against Leicester who at the time were relegation fodder.

1-0 win against Everton who are relegation fodder.

Also left out a 1-0 loss to Salzburg.

Left out a loss to Charlotte pre season.

Am i missing anything else? Not exactly anything here proving your point.

RIP Mourinho, it's really not hard to look up our results on the internet, and you can even do a simple cut/paste to save you typing them all out and making mistakes and omissions.

The 1-0 loss was to Zagreb, not Salzburg.

The 5 wins you originally missed out were 1-0 Everton away (they weren't "relegation fodder" in the first match of the season, and that is typical a tricky fixture for us), 2-1 at home to Leicester (again I'm not sure anyone is "relegation fodder" in the fourth match of the season?), and then in the stretch of games you were quoting from last season there was a 3-0 away at Leeds, a 2-1 at home to Watford, and a 2-0 vs Palace in the FA Cup SF. 

Now you're mentioning a minor pre-season game against Charlotte ? If for some reason you want to include that, then you'll also have to include the pre-season wins ... the 3-1 against Udinese and the 2-1 vs Americas, as if you don't, then you'll again be cherry-picking ... but none of these are competitive fixtures, so personally I'd ignore all of them.

The big picture is not about Tuchel anyway; it is that Potter should be doing a lot better than he is. It's pointless trying to counter-argue (like you have been) that Tuchel was just as bad, or worse, as it simply isn't true by any accepted metric of football performance ! And that's before you even look at any external factors like the club being on the brink, players out of contract and thinking only of their next club, manager's concurrent divorce process etc etc.

Was Tuchel perfect ? of course not. Was there lot's going wrong ? Absolutely. Was it all Tuchel's fault ? No. Was some of it his fault ? Yes. Did he deserve to be sacked ? Possibly.

All now irrelevant ... he's gone for good 5 months ago, but his record with us is set in stone.

Potter is the man accountable now, and as of yet he hasn't shown at all why Boehly has put so much faith in him. I don't see anything wrong with me and others wanting to discuss that in a thread about Potter, Let's hope he can turn it around soon, starting with a positive result tomorrow ... 

 

25 minutes ago, yaz said:

I love Tuchel and I'm not necessarily a Potter die hard fan, but if you look at Tuchel's last post match interview after Zagreb you'd be hard pressed to find any difference with what he is describing and what we're seeing now. Sounds to me like we were heading in this direction regardless of who's in charge.

 

He's not wrong 

1 hour ago, axman2526 said:

Not content with having one go and his apology, Arteta is going in on Lee Mason again, saying he does not know how to do his job:

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/12810919/arsenal-boss-mikel-arteta-accuses-var-lee-mason-of-not-understanding-his-job-after-brentfords-equaliser-at-emirates

Will the FA act on this? Quite the contrast to Potters reaction to the handball that led to no apology.

I'll save you the trouble of waiting to find out....

No, no they won't act on it all.

2 hours ago, axman2526 said:

Mudryk like a week or so before.

So he basically hasn't had any experience of dealing with high level signings. 

30 minutes ago, Gol15 said:

So he basically hasn't had any experience of dealing with high level signings. 

Not to mention he sold a double European champion in Jorginho...

1 minute ago, axman2526 said:

Not to mention he sold a double European champion in Jorginho...

Despite the fact that nobody wanted him right?

The script:
Potter sells Jorginho a few months before his contract runs out, signs the best young DM player that just won the World Cup and finishes top 8 and goes all the way to the CL final. Tommy Tactics who? Potter is the high wizard, how did you say, living in Potter wonderland. Jorginho doesn't win the league but finishes one more time in top 4, Potter doesn't win the league either obviously but gets a life long contract after playing the CL final.

1 minute ago, Gol15 said:

Despite the fact that nobody wanted him right?

The script:
Potter sells Jorginho a few months before his contract runs out, signs the best young DM player that just won the World Cup and finishes top 8 and goes all the way to the CL final. Tommy Tactics who? Potter is the high wizard, how did you say, living in Potter wonderland. Jorginho doesn't win the league but finishes one more time in top 4, Potter doesn't win the league either obviously but gets a life long contract after playing the CL final.

Steady on there Gol. For one, I was not Jorgi critic, for two we need to beat Dortmund first.

And for three aye,

Walking in a Potter wonderland. One of the best coaches in the world don't you know 

12 hours ago, dkw said:

I think it was pretty much the exact opposite of what Boehyl wanted, he wants a manger who is involved in the clubs running from top to bottom, transfers, youth teams, all aspects of training, structure and decisions. it seems Tuchel didnt want to any of that, just wanted to concentrate on coaching the first team. Thats why he was sacked, well that and 6 months of abysmal football with no signs of it getting any better soon, and also hus shockingly bad transfer dealings. 

You pretty much described the Potter's journey so far at Chelsea, and that's after being knocked out in 2 domestic cups in record time, and involved in singing 300M worth of players. If Tuchel was not involved in transfers as you said, how could he been involved in shockingly bad transfer dealings?

It's typical of Potter fans, pointing finger at everyone and everything else, but forget to acknowledge he hasn't been good enough, even compare to the 'bad' managers we had in the last 20 years.

 

 

 

5 hours ago, axman2526 said:

Not content with having one go and his apology, Arteta is going in on Lee Mason again, saying he does not know how to do his job:

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/12810919/arsenal-boss-mikel-arteta-accuses-var-lee-mason-of-not-understanding-his-job-after-brentfords-equaliser-at-emirates

Will the FA act on this? Quite the contrast to Potters reaction to the handball that led to no apology.

I'm getting Kevin Keegan vibes from Arteta at the moment. 

25 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

I'm getting Kevin Keegan vibes from Arteta at the moment. 

I would love it.

25 minutes ago, bisright1 said:

I'm getting Kevin Keegan vibes from Arteta at the moment. 

One thing I've noticed is that playmakers tend to make pretty good managers. Guardiola, Zidane, Cruyff, Xavi, Arteta. Too bad we haven't had any players like that in recent years, apart from Juan Mata

8 hours ago, RMH said:

I remember when we sacked Lampard and some of us were annoyed at it that some posters were telling us that we should forget about him and stop complaining. And that was like 1 month after the sacking. Some in here are still hanging on to Tuchel (whom I loved, by the way) after 5 months of his sacking.

Do me a favour

There were people on here saying they can't watch football anymore after Lampard got the sack when he was clearly out of his depth. Tuchel had to win every game or he wasn't deemed fit. Many of the posters on here who defend everything Potter does didn't give Tuchel a chance even after he won the biggest trophy a club can win in football, it still wasn't good enough.

Hardly a good f**king comparison that is it. 

2 hours ago, icecoolguy22 said:

You pretty much described the Potter's journey so far at Chelsea, and that's after being knocked out in 2 domestic cups in record time, and involved in singing 300M worth of players. If Tuchel was not involved in transfers as you said, how could he been involved in shockingly bad transfer dealings?

It's typical of Potter fans, pointing finger at everyone and everything else, but forget to acknowledge he hasn't been good enough, even compare to the 'bad' managers we had in the last 20 years.

 

 

 

Doesn't make sense does it? Some severe mental gymnastics going on lately

1. Tuchel didn't want to do anything but coach the first team, yet he's somehow responsible for all the poor signings. 

2. We had great attackers but Tuchel was making the attack poor, however, they were all sh*t when Potter came and Potter needed new players immediately.

3. Let's stop bringing up Tuchel to bash Potter, but keep bringing up Tuchel to blame him for everything that's going wrong now.

I've probably missed a lot more than that, but those three are the key contradictions I keep seeing resurfacing in this thread. 

I hope he is brad pitt and we do money ball revival!

4 hours ago, Drogba1 said:

One thing I've noticed is that playmakers tend to make pretty good managers. Guardiola, Zidane, Cruyff, Xavi, Arteta. Too bad we haven't had any players like that in recent years, apart from Juan Mata

Give me a break, Arteta has won 1 FA cup and is having a fluke year. They had 1 good transfer window that pushed their momentum early and fair play, has somewhat maintained it well but good manager?