1 hour ago, abramovich said:

I don't think it's as easy as that though. I have my doubts about Jorginho but he may have been a good fit for this current City side. Pep basically bought a whole new team filled with quality players that fit his style of football, Sarri has to make do with whatever he inherited from the previous regime. At City they've got plenty of goalscoring and creative outlets, Jorginho would just keep doing the ball retention and no one would care that he contributes f**k all to the attack. 

But when he is pressed quickly he doesn't do the ball retention either. We saw that for 90 minutes yesterday. He really does seem to be an extremely limited footballer.

1 hour ago, icecoolguy22 said:

City must be laughing now on dodging the bullet on Jorginho. Much been said in match thread, he just doensn't offer anything to make himself as an outstanding and even good midfielder. If we make a highlight reel of his season now, it will be 5 minutes of repeated sideways passing and that penalty.

I don't know about dodged a bullet, but his game certainly appears very limited. 

Watched the Wolves v Leicester game and it's no wonder City are being linked with Neves. There is a player who can pass forward, shoot, score - bit of everything. And he's only 21. For the £50M we paid for Jorginho, you would expect him to have a bit more in his locker.

11 hours ago, just said:

No. He's another expensive dud. It's plain as day.

Not disputing what you say about teams figuring him out, but the glaring fact is he can do nothing about it when they close him down quickly. He has no pace, he has no power, he cannot dribble, he has no vision. If Robbie Savage were still playing he would eat Jorginho for breakfast.

To pile on the misery there is absolutely no chance whatsoever of him being dropped. Some players just do not suit the EPL. Jorginho is one of them.

 

Yeah your'e right mate, won't be dropped, even though he isn't doing what Sarri wants. What does Sarri want from him ? A player acting like a hub, kick the ball to him, guarantee it is retained and processed, and to be fair he does do this for the most part. But the problem is he's finding it very hard to do in this league, now the cat is out the bag,  he cannot take being pressed, must of had it easy in Italy, more time with zero pressure than he will ever get over here.

I think his form is slowly going down as well. At the beginning of the season we could feel his control, but now it seems like opponents learn how to attack him and they know if he loses the ball there are only two CBs.

If he will play before Kante, then he will have a backup after losing possession or any duel.

Disappointed with him so far.

If this guy wasn't vital to the way we play why do opposition teams now target him to man mark and not Eden anymore?

This says a lot of how important he is and if he's not man marked will competely dominant games, it's now up to him and Sarri to find a solution to being man marked

41 minutes ago, Brutos said:

If this guy wasn't vital to the way we play why do opposition teams now target him to man mark and not Eden anymore?

This says a lot of how important he is and if he's not man marked will competely dominant games, it's now up to him and Sarri to find a solution to being man marked

then this surely makes him a massive weak spot if he can be stopped so easily? 

54 minutes ago, Brutos said:

If this guy wasn't vital to the way we play why do opposition teams now target him to man mark and not Eden anymore?

This says a lot of how important he is and if he's not man marked will competely dominant games, it's now up to him and Sarri to find a solution to being man marked

Leaving him on the bench might work?

Looks out of form and lost confidence. Worrying thing is two footed top players should still be able to play between the thirds if Jorginho is marked and pass accurately 5-10 yards.

when he plays well he does pass and move in tight areas and get us moving up the pitch, the problem comes if that’s not happening then he’s ineffective. Our first choice midfield three don’t create or score enough goals

I think found out is too harsh, I thought he was very good early in the season and he's still a good player, but looks like we'll need a new option to rotate in that area... 

2 hours ago, Brutos said:

If this guy wasn't vital to the way we play why do opposition teams now target him to man mark and not Eden anymore?

This says a lot of how important he is and if he's not man marked will competely dominant games, it's now up to him and Sarri to find a solution to being man marked

No, the postiion is vital to how the team play, so it is simple tactics to sit on him. If he lacks pace and defensive nous then pressing and robbing him of teh ball in that posiiton puts the oposition straight into our defence.

We would be having the same issues if we were playing Alonso in that position. We were making these same comments about Fabregas during Conte's tenure when Kante wasn't there as protection.

7 hours ago, icecoolguy22 said:

City must be laughing now on dodging the bullet on Jorginho. Much been said in match thread, he just doensn't offer anything to make himself as an outstanding and even good midfielder. If we make a highlight reel of his season now, it will be 5 minutes of repeated sideways passing and that penalty.

No, they will not. He would look like a star in their team and we would be praising his qualities. They have much better ball retention and are a much better team. That is why most their players excel. That squad/team is on another level.

Only two teams this season have beaten us by more than two goals, Spurs and Arsenal and both away.

The key it seems to doing this is not only closing down Jorginho yet also closing down David Luiz.

It's why I sometimes think the Plan B needs to be a backward pass to the keeper with a hopeful punt upfield to a recognised striker to chase down.

Puts them on the backfoot and a moment for us to defensively get our breath back,

I also think we miss RLC with his strength and dribbling he can break through the lines and change defense to attack.

The problem Jorginho has its not only man marking but the wingers not being wide enough to receive the ball. Willian likes to cut in, play close to centre for instance and that area becomes very congested with players which makes it difficult to find a pinpoint cross or pass. 

If you have a look at juventus games with pirlo in the same position he has a number of options because players stay out wide and they have/had attacking full backs. Unfortunately, our players all like to play through the middle!

39 minutes ago, Gentian said:

The problem Jorginho has its not only man marking but the wingers not being wide enough to receive the ball. Willian likes to cut in, play close to centre for instance and that area becomes very congested with players which makes it difficult to find a pinpoint cross or pass. 

If you have a look at juventus games with pirlo in the same position he has a number of options because players stay out wide and they have/had attacking full backs. Unfortunately, our players all like to play through the middle!

Surely our wide backs can move for him to get it into Kante or Kovacic for finding the font three too.

He needs a break, Playing too many games in a more demanding league. It's no wonder he's fatigued.

4 hours ago, Gentian said:

The problem Jorginho has its not only man marking but the wingers not being wide enough to receive the ball. Willian likes to cut in, play close to centre for instance and that area becomes very congested with players which makes it difficult to find a pinpoint cross or pass. 

If you have a look at juventus games with pirlo in the same position he has a number of options because players stay out wide and they have/had attacking full backs. Unfortunately, our players all like to play through the middle!

This is what I hoped we would be getting with Jorginho. Our very own Pirlo. But he does not have a fraction of Pirlo's vision or range of passing. Nor Fabregas either.

Christ on a bike have people not seen what usually happens on the rare occasions when Jorginho attempts to play a pass over 20+ yards? We would see better from Stevie Wonder on a very windy day!!!

 

1 hour ago, just said:

This is what I hoped we would be getting with Jorginho. Our very own Pirlo. But he does not have a fraction of Pirlo's vision or range of passing. Nor Fabregas either.

Christ on a bike have people not seen what usually happens on the rare occasions when Jorginho attempts to play a pass over 20+ yards? We would see better from Stevie Wonder on a very windy day!!!

 

So basically Sarri is doomed to failure and we may as well sack him now as, such is his belief in jorginho who is showing himself to be not up to the standard  needed, he wont change him out?

This is what I hoped we would be getting with Jorginho. Our very own Pirlo. But he does not have a fraction of Pirlo's vision or range of passing. Nor Fabregas either.
Christ on a bike have people not seen what usually happens on the rare occasions when Jorginho attempts to play a pass over 20+ yards? We would see better from Stevie Wonder on a very windy day!!!
 

He certainly is no Pirlo but is not as bad as he's looked recently. He is under big pressure and adapting to a new league. I've noted some very good through balls he's played since day 1, only to find Morata, Giroud or Willian who did buggerall with it.

Gundogan ain't in the first eleven at City but he has more work rate than Jorginho, he can pass the ball better, can get you more goals than Jorginho.
So what's your point?

Mikel is supposedly available ... strikes me as the sort of player who'd be a natural for Sarriball ... nice bit of physical presence to add to our team of midgets as well, not to mention someone who knows what winning and Chelsea is all about.
 

I think if Sarri had studied the league here before coming, he won't have signed Jorginho. He would have gone for a player that can pass the all well but also have strength and can also defend. Someone like Verratti would have been perfect.

Time to go back to a back 3...

Have you ever seen Sarri change his formation?

23 hours ago, abramovich said:

I don't think it's as easy as that though. I have my doubts about Jorginho but he may have been a good fit for this current City side. Pep basically bought a whole new team filled with quality players that fit his style of football, Sarri has to make do with whatever he inherited from the previous regime. At City they've got plenty of goalscoring and creative outlets, Jorginho would just keep doing the ball retention and no one would care that he contributes f**k all to the attack. 

Playing for City is not that easy either, first of all it's not about short side ways passing all day, Fernadinho actually has a pretty good long passing game I don't see in Jorginho yet. For the 30% of the time they don't have the ball, Fernadinho or whoever plays that role need to defend, which is something Jorginho couldn't do. For now, we have a dud player that plays the most important role in this system, the system won't change, either he gets better immediately or we will keep getting stuffed. We lost 2 away games against the other big 5, not even in the game, and 3 more against better teams in that group, can't see us winning any of these with him running the team.

I don't think it's as easy as that though. I have my doubts about Jorginho but he may have been a good fit for this current City side. Pep basically bought a whole new team filled with quality players that fit his style of football, Sarri has to make do with whatever he inherited from the previous regime. At City they've got plenty of goalscoring and creative outlets, Jorginho would just keep doing the ball retention and no one would care that he contributes f**k all to the attack. 

Ball retention? You are making a big mistake. Pep knows this league well, in other leagues where he has managed he never sees the need to have a strong defence because his game is all about attacking and outscoring the opponents. But when he came here, he quickly adapt to this league, he knew a team needs physically strong defenders and and even a good defensive midfielder to compete in this league. If you think Pep would have played Jorginho over Fernandinho, then it shows you are not really following the game. It means when you see Pep, you still see the Pep that managed Barcelona in those days.

I know Sarri won't ever try this but I believe Ampadu can be the Jorginho that fits the EPL better.

Surprised to see people turning on him and calling him a dud already.

He's a very good player. Not only is he new to the league, he's joined a new team and is expected to pretty much carry us as the team is built around him. Be patient.