10 hours ago, Remodez said:

it's just the only combination that actually compliment each other well for the system Frank wants is Rudiger and Tomori.

Amusingly, that is a centre back pairing that he hasn't tried yet 🙂

They've only ever played together in a 3-4-3 with three centre backs ...

7 hours ago, Elliott said:

Have to agree with the likes of @Davey Baby, @Brutos, @JM7.... We know there are shortcomings in the squad (large ones at that) however, he should be getting better results with the players at his disposal. This isn't a wobble... It's been going on since November. His performance should be viewed objectively just like any other manager that's been here (as he would expect) and recent results have been terrible. The same basic errors being made time and time again. The facts speak for themselves. 

Yeah I think the worrying thing is that we’re not inconsistent - we are actually consistent and we have been since November. Just very poor. 
 

What is it now? Only 1 win in 5? Lampard HAS to find a way of stopping the decline before the season fizzles out. 

2 hours ago, dkw said:

I wonder if he's made a decision to take tomori out of the firing line, we don't know how he has reacted to his mistakes and it could be he's being protected,. He's our future centre back for many years to come if brought through right, he's still a kid. 

I was thinking this initially but now I don't know. He seems to be firmly 4th choice at the minute.

Potentially Lampard could think him and Rudi aren't compatible as a pair.

14 hours ago, JM7 said:

Yeah I think the worrying thing is that we’re not inconsistent - we are actually consistent and we have been since November. Just very poor. 
 

What is it now? Only 1 win in 5? Lampard HAS to find a way of stopping the decline before the season fizzles out. 

Worth mentioning that Lampard had an idea to turn it around. Which was bringing in at least one goalscorer in January. That didn’t work out for multiple reasons but it would quite obviously have made a world of difference.

I would argue we haven’t really been that poor. Some games we have been obviously as any team but the biggest issue is but the two biggest issues (1) are that we are incapable of putting the ball in the net and (2) that we have two very poor goalkeepers that can’t keep anything out which usually leads to our opponents scoring on their first chance or half-chance.

On 19/02/2020 at 19:30, Frankie8Lampard said:

I dont blame Lampard's philosophy for our defensive frailties. I think the truth of the matter is that our defenders just aren't good enough. Among our senior centre-backs for example, Rudiger and azpi on his good days are the only ones that might have a chance to start for any of our rivals and that's even still uncertain. Obviously Reece and Tomori aren't lumped in this category since they are still young and developing but the rest of our defenders just aren't good enough imo. And then there is our world's most expensive keeper who has question marks written all over him.

I think we are making do with a less than fantastic squad. But he is responsible for how open we are without the ball. Leipzig last night played night with two wing backs and a loanee who had barely played in central defence. Yet they put away the high press and were compact.

The answer to weak defenders is not a poorly executed high press that leaves those defenders exposed. Sarri learned that the hard way last season and Frank is learning it too.

There are also little things we can do better to avoid counters. Note this comparison of Atleti and our attacking corners.

 

7 minutes ago, Spiller86 said:

I think we are making do with a less than fantastic squad. But he is responsible for how open we are without the ball. Leipzig last night played night with two wing backs and a loanee who had barely played in central defence. Yet they put away the high press and were compact.

The answer to weak defenders is not a poorly executed high press that leaves those defenders exposed. Sarri learned that the hard way last season and Frank is learning it too.

There are also little things we can do better to avoid counters. Note this comparison of Atleti and our attacking corners.

 

Leipzig worked very hard last night not sure we currently have that intensity from enough players and considering we have 8 on the injury list, Spurs have 4 on the injury list.

What's the twitter point about AM' scorner routine, is it that by having four runners near the edge of the box you are better prepared against the counter attack if the corner is cleared?

Edited February 20, 20206 yr by strider6004

12 minutes ago, Strider6003 said:

Leipzig worked very hard last night not sure we currently have that intensity from enough players and considering we have 8 on the injury list, Spurs have 4 on the injury list.

What's the twitter point about AM' scorner routine, is it that by having four runners near the edge of the box you are better prepared against the counter attack if the corner is cleared?

Leipzig played without their 3 best centre backs last night. It's about organisation is my point not always just effort.

The broad point is a comparison of our setup from attacking corners while 1-0 up Atleti have four outside the box placed evenly to win the second ball. We have two standing closely together. One pass and a slip and we concede. It's little things that make a difference at the elite level. We are open and vulnerable all the time. 

We have issues with the squad but the setup isn't helping. We need more from Frank and Jody same as we do from the players. Not enough to say if only we could finish.

Edited February 20, 20206 yr by Spiller86

29 minutes ago, Spiller86 said:

I think we are making do with a less than fantastic squad. But he is responsible for how open we are without the ball. Leipzig last night played night with two wing backs and a loanee who had barely played in central defence. Yet they put away the high press and were compact.

The answer to weak defenders is not a poorly executed high press that leaves those defenders exposed. Sarri learned that the hard way last season and Frank is learning it too.

There are also little things we can do better to avoid counters. Note this comparison of Atleti and our attacking corners.

 

I agree but lets be honest, Arsenal had a player less while Atletico doesn't actually care to score from their corner. Maybe that further points to our weakness during these kind of setups but the situation may not be comparable.

2 hours ago, Spiller86 said:

Leipzig played without their 3 best centre backs last night. It's about organisation is my point not always just effort.

The broad point is a comparison of our setup from attacking corners while 1-0 up Atleti have four outside the box placed evenly to win the second ball. We have two standing closely together. One pass and a slip and we concede. It's little things that make a difference at the elite level. We are open and vulnerable all the time. 

We have issues with the squad but the setup isn't helping. We need more from Frank and Jody same as we do from the players. Not enough to say if only we could finish.

On that photo that you show, we have two players way too close to each other and, at the bottom there is another one (can't see who it is as is covered by the legend, maybe CHO ?) at a walking pace that could have stopped Matinelli if he'd run to cover that space rather than just walk. Maybe it is not Frank's fault but the players are not as focused as they are expected to be?

Leipzig played without their 3 best centre backs last night. It's about organisation is my point not always just effort.
The broad point is a comparison of our setup from attacking corners while 1-0 up Atleti have four outside the box placed evenly to win the second ball. We have two standing closely together. One pass and a slip and we concede. It's little things that make a difference at the elite level. We are open and vulnerable all the time. 
We have issues with the squad but the setup isn't helping. We need more from Frank and Jody same as we do from the players. Not enough to say if only we could finish.

Been saying it for a while now that better players won't fix tactical disorganisation

1 hour ago, RMH said:

On that photo that you show, we have two players way too close to each other and, at the bottom there is another one (can't see who it is as is covered by the legend, maybe CHO ?) at a walking pace that could have stopped Matinelli if he'd run to cover that space rather than just walk. Maybe it is not Frank's fault but the players are not as focused as they are expected to be?

The thing is we had Kante sitting as cover from a corner and that worked perfectly, he would have got the ball with ease. Only he slipped and no amount of tactics can accommodate that.

8 minutes ago, dkw said:

The thing is we had Kante sitting as cover from a corner and that worked perfectly, he would have got the ball with ease. Only he slipped and no amount of tactics can accommodate that.

Yes, that also, but the point he was trying to make with the comparative photos is that we leave too many spaces uncovered, and what I argue is that it may not be Frank's fault in the first place that players do not place themselves properly in the field. You can teach them, yes, but at the end of the day, if two players in the outside of the box are too close together, it is their responsibility to realise that and change their position to cover up better the space.

11 minutes ago, RMH said:

Yes, that also, but the point he was trying to make with the comparative photos is that we leave too many spaces uncovered, and what I argue is that it may not be Frank's fault in the first place that players do not place themselves properly in the field. You can teach them, yes, but at the end of the day, if two players in the outside of the box are too close together, it is their responsibility to realise that and change their position to cover up better the space.

But that picture doesnt give the hole story, for example the reason Martinelli is out there is because he has gone to cover our player who`s going towards the corner taker. This doesnt look to have happened in the Madrid game, if a Liverpool player had ran the Madrid player in then they may also have been caught out. taking one photo in isolation of a different situation is not really very indicative.

5 hours ago, Spiller86 said:

I think we are making do with a less than fantastic squad. But he is responsible for how open we are without the ball. Leipzig last night played night with two wing backs and a loanee who had barely played in central defence. Yet they put away the high press and were compact.

The answer to weak defenders is not a poorly executed high press that leaves those defenders exposed. Sarri learned that the hard way last season and Frank is learning it too.

There are also little things we can do better to avoid counters. Note this comparison of Atleti and our attacking corners.

 

If Kante hadn’t slipped Martinili wouldn’t have scored.. that was nothing to do with tactics like the pic u post.

It wasn't Kante's fault at all anyway tbh, it was just a slip, could happen to anyone. The fault for me was Emerson, he couldn't make a foul because he was already on a yellow, he shouldn't have been on the pitch. 

8 hours ago, Spiller86 said:

I think we are making do with a less than fantastic squad. But he is responsible for how open we are without the ball. Leipzig last night played night with two wing backs and a loanee who had barely played in central defence. Yet they put away the high press and were compact.

The answer to weak defenders is not a poorly executed high press that leaves those defenders exposed. Sarri learned that the hard way last season and Frank is learning it too.

There are also little things we can do better to avoid counters. Note this comparison of Atleti and our attacking corners.

 

I don't know whether I fully agree. Frank has tried playing more conservative in a few games this season (when we had the lead) and yet we still managed to concede goals. 

I'll admit that Lamps has made some tactical blunders when it comes to defending set-pieces this season, but a lot of those goals conceded are also down to individual errors. One individual at the wrong place at the wrong time has been a common pattern on how we concede goals this season and its quite possible that could be due to tactics, but I also think the players play a huge role in that.

I don't think it is down to Frank's tactics because if we had a player like Prime JT in the defensive line or modern day van Dijk, we wouldn't be defending the same way. The manager can only do so much off the pitch when it comes to keeping the defensive line compact.

Edited February 20, 20206 yr by Frankie8Lampard

On 19/02/2020 at 04:58, driller97 said:

Its a bit harsh to put a lot of blame on Kepa when the defence dont help out whatsoever. If we improve our defence, then i am confident Kepa will be better as well

I've been one of Kepa's defenders I actually don't want him to leave but there are definetley a lot of question marks on him. I agree that if we have a better defence that it would help him, but I think we should at least look for someone to challenge him. At the moment it just seems to easy for him to start since Caballero isnt any better. Cech in his prime at least had Cudicini to compete with who could have started for several premier league teams

1 hour ago, Frankie8Lampard said:

I don't know whether I fully agree. Frank has tried playing more conservative in a few games this season (when we had the lead) and yet we still managed to concede goals. 

I'll admit that Lamps has made some tactical blunders when it comes to defending set-pieces this season, but a lot of those goals conceded are also down to individual errors. One individual at the wrong place at the wrong time has been a common pattern on how we concede goals this season and its quite possible that could be due to tactics, but I also think the players play a huge role in that.

I don't think it is down to Frank's tactics because if we had a player like Prime JT in the defensive line or modern day van Dijk, we wouldn't be defending the same way. The manager can only do so much off the pitch when it comes to keeping the defensive line compact.

No doubt we have some challenges re: our squad. However, the way you compensate is through strong organisation and structure.

The reason Simeone's team are in the right spot is because they will have been relentlessly drilled to be there and he'd be yelling at them from the sideline if they weren't in the right spot. 

I've said for a while that Frank has a bit too much of his Uncle Harry in his approach. He gives his players an awful lot of freedom and decision making rights. With a young team with others of questionable ability who don't make great decisions that's a risky approach.

Just quickly on those corners @dkw @RMH@Jangz  again the role of a system is to mitigate from individual errors. Kante's slip was unfortunate but it happens. The way we were set up Emerson got sucked exactly into the space where Atleti have a player already and then we saw what came next. As a quick note that Atleti also have a similar covering player behind outside of shot. 

It's the little things that make a difference. Part of what made Jose such a good manager with us. Nothing down to the smallest detail was ever left to chance. f**k ups happen but you mitigate the best you can.

I think what Frank is trying to do is very demanding to the players. When it doesn't convert into wins if gets frustrating. It is exactly the same what Klopp is doing with Liverpool. 4 seasons back they'll were in the same position. They got caught and lost games. Gradually the players learned it and most importantly they've got players who are suited to it, World class talents.

Frank will always keep the levels of demand very high which is the key to future success. We just need couple some Rolls Royces instead of some of the Kia's we have today.

14 hours ago, Frankie8Lampard said:

I've been one of Kepa's defenders I actually don't want him to leave but there are definetley a lot of question marks on him. I agree that if we have a better defence that it would help him, but I think we should at least look for someone to challenge him. At the moment it just seems to easy for him to start since Caballero isnt any better. Cech in his prime at least had Cudicini to compete with who could have started for several premier league teams

Yeah Kepa really needs to work on his wrist strength or something because there have been countless occassions where he actually gets to the ball and makes a good save, and then the ball flaps past his wrist and rolls across the line..

We definitely do need another good keeper for some competition, but just not sure what keeper would want to be on the bench for most the time. I really feel we should have kept Bulka in the summer instead of selling him to PSG, he definitely would have been good enough as a 2nd keeper.

3 hours ago, driller97 said:

Yeah Kepa really needs to work on his wrist strength

I am sure someone said he split with his girlfriend recently so that should help 🙂

3 hours ago, Bonzodog29 said:

I am sure someone said he split with his girlfriend recently so that should help 🙂

🙈

7 hours ago, Bonzodog29 said:

I am sure someone said he split with his girlfriend recently so that should help 🙂

He couldnt handle her either 😉

12 hours ago, Juan Nil said:

He couldnt handle her either 😉

🤣 🤣 🤣

Frank must be purring at that committed performance, well played lads

 

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