45 minutes ago, Nibs said:

VAR should be simple but has become too over complicated. Things are being looked at when there is no need and then you have other instances where refs aren't even going to the screen when they should. As always it's the inconsistencies that pisses off supporters, players & coaches alike.

The offside one could easily be rectified tomorrow. Just change the rule so that there has to be daylight between attacker and defender. Lets stop all these elbows, hand, big toe offside nonsense. We don't want to see stupid lines on screens. If there is daylight he is off, otherwise he's on - simple as that.

With you on that. f**kers will be marketing VAR branded set squares next.

If it has to stay, which I think wevall accept it will, then get rid of the lines sh*t. VAR gets to watch it three times in slow motion and no lines.  If they are still not sure they stay with the decision on the pitch. Should be clear and obvious evidence to overturn it.

Why is it this weekend that everyone is kicking off about VAR in particular ?

Maybe something to do with the lead TV pundit on MOTD ?

As soon as his team gets on the wrong end of a VAR decision...... "things have to change".

 

 

34 minutes ago, loz said:

With you on that. f**kers will be marketing VAR branded set squares next.

If it has to stay, which I think wevall accept it will, then get rid of the lines sh*t. VAR gets to watch it three times in slow motion and no lines.  If they are still not sure they stay with the decision on the pitch. Should be clear and obvious evidence to overturn it.

that's a good idea. 

48 minutes ago, loz said:

With you on that. f**kers will be marketing VAR branded set squares next.

If it has to stay, which I think wevall accept it will, then get rid of the lines sh*t. VAR gets to watch it three times in slow motion and no lines.  If they are still not sure they stay with the decision on the pitch. Should be clear and obvious evidence to overturn it.

Yes but which incidents does VAR check ? Who decides that bit ?

We need to take away the power to intervene by VAR and give that responsibility to the team captains, the captains can ask for a referral like in cricket, then with the ref at the monitor and VAR in conversation with the ref, they discuss the incident briefly on open mic like in rugby with the TMO, it's transparent.

 

So after a few years of VAR issues, and only recently having 2 points stolen off us vs Spurs and getting an "I guess I was wrong, nevermind" from Mike Dean, because we benefited from a bad VAR call all heck breaks loose?

It is like people think some robot is making these calls, when it is the same idiot refs who call the matches making a mess of using this technology. Uefa seem to use it just fine, fifa too.

There is no problem with the technology at all. The goal line tech works amazingly because it is all machine operated, bar the one huge issue between Villa and Sheff United. 1 issue in how many uses?

There are more than that with VAR because most of our refs and assistant refs are so incompetent and corrupt you could not trust them on a potato sorting line.

Stop blaming the technology and start looking at the real problem, the human element that is corrupt and/or just unfit for the job.

17 minutes ago, coco said:

Yes but which incidents does VAR check ? Who decides that bit ?

We need to take away the power to intervene by VAR and give that responsibility to the team captains, the captains can ask for a referral like in cricket, then with the ref at the monitor and VAR in conversation with the ref, they discuss the incident briefly on open mic like in rugby with the TMO, it's transparent.

 

I would say VAR looks at all goals and penalties. And that's it. Nothing else. Not red cards, or yellows that maybe should have been reds. Just goals and penalties. Natural break in play so easy to check. No lines on the park. No 63 replays and 4 minute delays. Three viewings then make your decision.

For anything else managers, players and fans need to stop being such pussies and get on with it.

11 minutes ago, axman2526 said:

 

Stop blaming the technology and start looking at the real problem, the human element that is corrupt and/or just unfit for the job.

Is it really unfit or just human interpretation and error? Fans argue over just about every decision. Very rare that there is universal agreement on anything. 

Refs make mistakes. So do managers and players. Is Tuchel unfit because he plays Jorginho? Is Jorginho unfit because he plays keep ball in his own penalty box? f**k, I just ruined my point.

I am not sure if I'm in a minority with this opinion, but imo the ref made the right decision, i think it was a clear foul from Bowen on Mendy, because the contact was diliberately initiated by Bowen and if you don't judge the situation as if Mendy acted hurt after the contact was made, which one can basically just assume, the ref has to judge it as that Mendy got kicked and taken out of play and it happened before Cornet had the shooting opportunity, which makes it a foul. I would say the only reason there is any controversy is because pundits acting like it was a horrendous call.

If you then see the match today between United and Arsenal with the 'foul' on Eriksen being enough to disallow a goal over VAR review in favor of United, there really is no argument to act as if the call to give the foul on Mendy is an outrageous decision.

I would judge the controversial ref decisions this matchday like this, van Dijk red card foul(wrong), Coutinho goal disallowed(wrong), Newcastle goal disallowed(wrong), Leeds penalty appeal(should be a freekick), Arsenal goal disallowed(50:50), West Ham goal disallowed(right).

2 minutes ago, Blue2 said:

I am not sure if I'm in a minority with this opinion, but imo the ref made the right decision, i think it was a clear foul from Bowen on Mendy, because the contact was diliberately initiated by Bowen and if you don't judge the situation as if Mendy acted hurt after the contact was made, which one can basically just assume, the ref has to judge it as that Mendy got kicked and taken out of play and it happened before Cornet had the shooting opportunity, which makes it a foul. I would say the only reason there is any controversy is because pundits acting like it was a horrendous call.

If you then see the match today between United and Arsenal with the 'foul' on Eriksen being enough to disallow a goal over VAR review in favor of United, there really is no argument to act as if the call to give the foul on Mendy is an outrageous decision.

I would judge the controversial ref decisions this matchday like this, van Dijk red card foul(wrong), Coutinho goal disallowed(wrong), Newcastle goal disallowed(wrong), Leeds penalty appeal(should be a freekick), Arsenal goal disallowed(50:50), West Ham goal disallowed(right).

PGMOL have already said the calls by VAR ar The Bridge and Newcastles game were wrong.

25 minutes ago, loz said:

Is it really unfit or just human interpretation and error? Fans argue over just about every decision. Very rare that there is universal agreement on anything. 

Refs make mistakes. So do managers and players. Is Tuchel unfit because he plays Jorginho? Is Jorginho unfit because he plays keep ball in his own penalty box? f**k, I just ruined my point.

Unfit or corrupt, either or. I don't have faith in our refs, they are all showman looking for their own publicity and VAR is a tool to help them achieve that notoriety.

Nah, I find it really hard to believe Mendy could get hurt by that. He pretended to be hurt because he knew he f*cked up big time.

It is really annoying how they decided to look into it when we get a decision go our way, I mean wasn’t the hair pull more obvious?

I don’t think there is an agenda against us, not with the VAR and referees (apart from that sh*t stain of a human being). I think the media / pundits has more influence, you’ve seen how referees treated Drogba, Bruno Fernandes etc, as soon as the pundits kicked up a fuss, it has an effect. I guess you can use ‘fergie time’ as an example as well, how the referees are influenced subconsciously.

I don't want buy the theory there's an agenda against us, apart from Anthony Taylor, who's on a mission to destroy us, and he's probably going to get another big Chelsea game soon 🤔 and WTF the Mike Dean and PL going to do about that? Yes, one could argue Mendy 'dived' yesterday, but there was contact. It's the same as an attacker fall down due to a contact, some would argue attacker should NOT be honest, and go down for the contact, and  a foul is a foul. If West Ham conceded a goal like that, they'd be filthy too. Again, pundits and past referees kept going at it because we got the benefit of the call. Where was the outrage for the hair pull last month? Sourness reckoned it was a men's game and should be applauded. What about McDominy got 3 touches on the ball with hand last weekend? There was no referee or VAR call, and everyone happily let it go because United deserve some love.

My issues with VAR are the inconsistencies of it all. What's a goal one week will be disallowed the next week, what's a pen one week won't be next week etc.

I think the refs should immediately be made to look at the monitor. For me there is absolutely no point the VAR  refs looking at something for 2 minutes, to tell the match referee to look at the monitor. I think as soon as the referee is aware VAR are looking at something then the referee should be straight over to look at the monitor. Obviously this only works in breaks of play, but would make red card, penalty, goal decisions a hell of a lot quicker.

My biggest issue is with offsides. Anyone here who has played football at any level would've been told the attackers always get the benefit of the doubt for a really close offside call. That just does not exist anymore with the lines that are being drawn, and footballers being offside because their stud is in an offside position. The goal that Lukaku had disallowed in the carabao cup final and the goal that Chilwell had disallowed in the FA cup final against Leicester are both goals that would've stood pre VAR, and in my opinion there wouldn't have been much discussion afterwards as to whether or not those goals should've stood. You can also add Coady's goal for Everton at the weekend here. 

I think this has been the worst weekend yet for VAR:

- 'Foul' on Mendy to disallow West Ham an equaliser
- Palace keeper being fouled despite Palace defender initiating contact
- VVD not getting sent off for a high challenge

There's probably more that I'm missing but those 3 alone are 3 high profile incidents, and the wrong decisions have led to teams wrongfully dropping points.

VAR is good when it helps identify where a referee has made a glaring error. The best example I can think of here is when Alonso nearly had his head taken off by the spurs keeper, and Anthony Taylor (shock) gave it as a free kick to Spurs. That being said, even with the technology we still have had major decisions go against us. Kovacic getting sent off in the FA cup final for being stamped on, again Taylor (shock). There was a game against United under Lamps where we had 2-3 goals wrongfully disallowed, in the same game Maguire deliberately kicks Batshuayi in the nuts, right in front of the bench, no red card and he then goes on to score later in the game. Again refereed by Taylor. Bit of a theme emerging there. There was another game against Spurs right before the initial covid lockdown. Lo Celso goes in with a potential leg breaker against Azpi, no action, no red card. He later scores or helps set up score their goal in that game. 

Point being is even with technology in place, they are still making glaring errors that are costing teams points, and even potentially trophies. The margin for error should be significantly less with VAR, but it still feels as though they are making monumental errors week in week out.

I like VAR as a principle, and it works around Europe and in international tournaments. Why can't it work here? I think a lot of it comes down to the refs not wanting to admit that they are getting major decisions wrong. Until the refs are made to be accountable for their actions, these crap decisions from on-field referees, and VAR will continue. If a player had a run of bad games, they would be dropped. Why can't the same happen to referees. 

It should never have been brought in absolutely no need for it and it's ruining football especially as a spectacle. The twats who kept saying it should be brought in the Slimfast version of Right Said Fred Shearer and Murphy and Jenas are the ones who complain about it every week. The Brighton one yesterday was the worst one of all over the weekend and if there was no VAR no one on MOTD would have even thought for a second about saying that goal should have been disallowed.

Until VAR is an instant process I will never support it in football. When Havertz scored the winner on Saturday I didn't fully celebrate through concerns that him or Chilwell may have been offside in the lead up to it and that isn't football, it's sh*t. 

VAR and referees didn't get any worse over the weekend, just pundits got really upset because Chelsea got a favorite call for once, and none of the "fan favorite" did.  I totally expect a call against us next weekend, as the PGMOL will try to do the 2 wrongs to make it a right thing. Mendy's incident was marginal, hardly the worst one this season. The hair pull by Romero in front of Anthony 'I hate CHelsea' Taylor., the 3 touches with hand in one go by McTominay, and the VVD's stamp that's not high enough to be a red card all overtake that.

There's no issue with VAR, the issue is with the morons that operate it. Its worked perfectly at the Euro's with instant decisions. 

the referees are inconsistent and unprofessional.. there is no accountability and the association goes out of its way to protect them.. Yes you can have a howler or two.. but the same refs keep making the same mistakes with no repercussions.. The fact is football is becoming a very fast game and maybe we are asking too much from this lot..

A lot of sports have two refs.. is it time we have two of them on the pitch? or maybe that will just make it even more controversial and difficult.

I have completely lost trust in them. Mark Clattenburg reveal some years back didn't help at all. 

Pay them half of what players get so they enter in the same realm as players are and make them accountable. Massive paycuts after mistakes. Train them properly.

The problem isnt really with VAR, its with the f**king idiots trying to use it. They often seemed to be using it to find a reason not to give a goal, thats not what it was brought in to do.

 

Alternative view from a surprising source

 

2 hours ago, dkw said:

The problem isnt really with VAR, its with the f**king idiots trying to use it. They often seemed to be using it to find a reason not to give a goal, thats not what it was brought in to do.

And that's it. It actively looks for ways to rule out goals.

a hairline offside gives no material advantage to the forward at all. Clear and obvious should apply to offsides then we won't get these slide rule millimetre offside decisions.

use it for cheating and simulation,  nothing else,

5 hours ago, timetowaste said:

Until VAR is an instant process I will never support it in football. When Havertz scored the winner on Saturday I didn't fully celebrate through concerns that him or Chilwell may have been offside in the lead up to it and that isn't football, it's sh*t. 

Same, I never even moved. That is what VAR has done to me. An 88th minute winner in a London derby should have me jumping off my seat.

9 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

Same, I never even moved. That is what VAR has done to me. An 88th minute winner in a London derby should have me jumping off my seat.

That's true. But it's not for real fans, it adds a level of jeopardy to every goal to add excitement for millions of worldwide tv audiences. 

Tv deals demand it 

45 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

Same, I never even moved. That is what VAR has done to me. An 88th minute winner in a London derby should have me jumping off my seat.

I celebrated, however when the commentator said "Havertz has won the game for Chelsea" with 2 minutes and extra time to go I thought, ah sh*t, and baring a very bad call, I would have been right, and @Munkworth and @Valerie would have got 5 points 😉