7 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

You don't? The reason why we have VAR at all is because of how bad things were before.

The reason why it's not working is because the refs are looking for any reason to disallow a goal, give a red card or give a penalty. Everything is overanalysed, and the constant changes to the rules aren't helping things. Nobody knows what a handball is anymore because it changes every season. They slow the replays down so much to the point where it is played frame by frame, and they do this when deciding to give a red card or disallow a goal too. None of this needs to happen. Unless it's clear and obvious, then stick with the refs decision. It's very simple, but the refs are making it so much harder than it needs to be.

Everybody is sick of VAR, but it's not the tech that is the issue, it's the refs themselves. If it was turned off, there would be relief early on, but soon enough, the poor decisions will start piling up again and the fans will react as they see their team on the end of multiple bizarre decisions against the likes of United and Liverpool.

I find it laughable that Jonathan Pearce commentates and effectively mocks VAR. One word, Joyless, he said. Yep the same Jonathan Pearce, one of the biggest voices calling for VAR when the travesties used to occur.

That's what we wanted it for. We never wanted it taking 5 minutes to check if an elbow is playing someone onside, we wanted it to clear up the hand of god, the Roy Carroll scrambling the ball back from way over the line. We wanted it to rectify the horrendous decisions. The onfield standard wasn't bad before they kept changing the rules constantly. 

Wonderful performance from a wonderful team 

1 minute ago, WhiteWall said:

I find it laughable that Jonathan Pearce commentates and effectively mocks VAR. One word, Joyless, he said. Yep the same Jonathan Pearce, one of the biggest voices calling for VAR when the travesties used to occur.

That's what we wanted it for. We never wanted it taking 5 minutes to check if an elbow is playing someone onside, we wanted it to clear up the hand of god, the Roy Carroll scrambling the ball back from way over the line. We wanted it to rectify the horrendous decisions. The onfield standard wasn't bad before they kept changing the rules constantly. 

Exactly. I never asked VAR to be brought in to cancel out goals that were offside by a centimetre. I never asked VAR to give out red cards on replays slowed down to the point where we are looking at it frame by frame. This stuff is stupid. Just deal with the really bad ones that refs used to miss. Like those nasty tackles that Ashley Barnes put in on Matic. If VAR was available that day, he would have been sent off for sure. That is what I want it used for.

1 minute ago, Scott Harris said:

Exactly. I never asked VAR to be brought in to cancel out goals that were offside by a centimetre. I never asked VAR to give out red cards on replays slowed down to the point where we are looking at it frame by frame. This stuff is stupid. Just deal with the really bad ones that refs used to miss. Like those nasty tackles that Ashley Barnes put in on Matic. If VAR was available that day, he would have been sent off for sure. That is what I want it used for.

But once it is there it is always going to be used for an offside check whether its 2m or 0.2cm.

If it is to be kept, and we all know it is, then I'd change it to give the VAR ref 20 seconds to make their mind up. If they can't be sure in that time then we stay with the ruling on the field.

I'd still get rid though.

34 minutes ago, The Brit said:

Didn’t understood all the doom and gloom at half time that I was seeing on social media. It’s like people haven’t seen an fa cup tie before. Preston were always going to give it a go and we still should have been at least 2-0 up with clear-cut chances for palmer and enzo. In the end we could have easily won by eight. Just feels like people watch chelsea games now ready to moan from the very first minute.

This exactly.

 

Let’s distinguish between VAR as a technology and VAR as the refs. The technology is as good as the humans operating it if you have incompetent people in any situation they will make bad decisions. I love VAR, it’s the operators that’s the problem.

3 minutes ago, El regreso said:

Let’s distinguish between VAR as a technology and VAR as the refs. The technology is as good as the humans operating it if you have incompetent people in any situation they will make bad decisions. I love VAR, it’s the operators that’s the problem.

I remember the first major tournament it was used for, the Confederations Cup. It was terrible, but international tournaments got better and better at using it. It's the domestic game that is struggling the most, they seem to be making it worse.

16 minutes ago, Scott Harris said:

That red card for Everton was as bad as the one we got for Gusto. This is what I mean by them not being qualified for the job, they don't even understand how much of a difference it makes when you slow down the footage. It's not a true representation of what actually happened.

Spot on!

It was obvious to me DCL was just trying to win the ball back by scooping his foot around the ball, anyone who understands the game should see this.

Don't get me started on the Jota penalty against Newcastle...

Dismissing VAR as a failure without looking at the people who are using it in this country is the wrong way of looking at it IMO.

It's like blaming car manufacturers for all the accidents on the road.

8 minutes ago, loz said:

But once it is there it is always going to be used for an offside check whether its 2m or 0.2cm.

If it is to be kept, and we all know it is, then I'd change it to give the VAR ref 20 seconds to make their mind up. If they can't be sure in that time then we stay with the ruling on the field.

I'd still get rid though.

I would do it like the NFL. Let the ref and linesman run the game, allow each manager 2 challenges and used automated systems as much as possible.

We moan about the standard of refereeing in this country but actually the game is now being reffed by people in computer booths

9 minutes ago, WhiteWall said:

I would do it like the NFL. Let the ref and linesman run the game, allow each manager 2 challenges and used automated systems as much as possible.

We moan about the standard of refereeing in this country but actually the game is now being reffed by people in computer booths

That isn't what happens in the NFL though.  Yes there are challenge flags but, in addition, all scoring plays are subject to an automatic review.

Comfortable win nothing to moan about for once, UTC

Just now, loz said:

That isn't what happens in the NFL though.  Yes there are challenge flags but, in addition, all scoring plays are subject to an automatic review.

Yes but I wouldn't go that far, because of the length of the stoppages. If we had a stated maximum number of challenges. I'm not saying it would be the answer but I think it's better than what we have currently 

 

 

 

 

 

13 minutes ago, dan_cfc said:

Comfortable win nothing to moan about for once, UTC

The first half was bad, if we had played in the first half like we played in the second half, maybe the scoreline would have been 8-0.

2 hours ago, Scott Harris said:

I don't know much about the details, I didn't follow it that closely, but wasn't he acquitted?

I don't know the details, all seemed a bit fishy though.

Pity that rebound didn't fall better for GOlding, could have got himself a debut goal.

1 hour ago, WhiteWall said:

I find it laughable that Jonathan Pearce commentates and effectively mocks VAR. One word, Joyless, he said. Yep the same Jonathan Pearce, one of the biggest voices calling for VAR when the travesties used to occur.

That's what we wanted it for. We never wanted it taking 5 minutes to check if an elbow is playing someone onside, we wanted it to clear up the hand of god, the Roy Carroll scrambling the ball back from way over the line. We wanted it to rectify the horrendous decisions. The onfield standard wasn't bad before they kept changing the rules constantly. 

The amusing thing about Pearce’s performance on COMMS tonight  - one of many - is that he instantly said enzo was way offside, only to be proved wrong. He also amusingly said earlier Broja should go off and sterling play down the middle. Don’t think sterling would have scored with that header if that had happened.

Just now, The Brit said:

The amusing thing about Pearce’s performance on COMMS tonight  - one of many - is that he instantly said enzo was way offside, only to be proved wrong. He also amusingly said earlier Broja should go off and sterling play down the middle. Don’t think sterling would have scored with that header if that had happened.

In fairness I'm also guilty of both those things. Well almost.  I wanted Broja hooked too. Not to put Sterling down the middle but did want him hooked.

I also thought Enzo was offside when I saw it at normal speed.

Awful first half today, bit of same old, same old but the second half was like a breath of fresh air. We seemed more willing to attack and commit players forward. 
I don’t know if Broja is the answer but after his goal everything improved. His movement into spaces and his touch and his battling. Shortly after his goal he went in on a challenge and put the defender on his arse. It was a foul but at least he made his presence felt which has not been happening. He should get a wee run of games now and can maybe build some confidence. 
I would like to see a proper RB playing RB and a proper LB playing LB. It would add more width in attack. This isn’t having a go at young Gilchrist who done very well but apparently is more used to CB. He could develop into a very useful RB. 
I like Gusto at FB but he adds a lot more as RB.

Poch just play Madueke and alternate the left wing if he needs too between Sterling and Mudryk.

 

7 minutes ago, goose said:

Awful first half today, bit of same old, same old but the second half was like a breath of fresh air. We seemed more willing to attack and commit players forward. 
I don’t know if Broja is the answer but after his goal everything improved. His movement into spaces and his touch and his battling. Shortly after his goal he went in on a challenge and put the defender on his arse. It was a foul but at least he made his presence felt which has not been happening. He should get a wee run of games now and can maybe build some confidence. 
I would like to see a proper RB playing RB and a proper LB playing LB. It would add more width in attack. This isn’t having a go at young Gilchrist who done very well but apparently is more used to CB. He could develop into a very useful RB. 
I like Gusto at FB but he adds a lot more as RB.

Poch just play Madueke and alternate the left wing if he needs too between Sterling and Mudryk.

 

I wouldn't underestimate the difference a goal could make for the confidence of Broja. It will be interesting to see how he does in the upcoming run of games.

3 hours ago, Scott Harris said:

You don't? The reason why we have VAR at all is because of how bad things were before.

The reason why it's not working is because the refs are looking for any reason to disallow a goal, give a red card or give a penalty. Everything is overanalysed, and the constant changes to the rules aren't helping things. Nobody knows what a handball is anymore because it changes every season. They slow the replays down so much to the point where it is played frame by frame, and they do this when deciding to give a red card or disallow a goal too. None of this needs to happen. Unless it's clear and obvious, then stick with the refs decision. It's very simple, but the refs are making it so much harder than it needs to be.

Everybody is sick of VAR, but it's not the tech that is the issue, it's the refs themselves. If it was turned off, there would be relief early on, but soon enough, the poor decisions will start piling up again and the fans will react as they see their team on the end of multiple bizarre decisions against the likes of United and Liverpool.

There were some poor decisions of course but people moved on pretty quickly, I'll take a bit of human error in exchange for the excitement of scoring goals once again. Has VAR made football better? I think 9/10 people would say no.

The problem with the technology is once it's used for something there will be an argument for using it for something else but where does it end? Clear and obvious is subjective, what we might deem as clear and obvious might not be to someone else. For example, Liverpool draw a game because they don't get a borderline red card decision going their way, Klopp comes out like the grumpy entitled chode he is and complains about it post match and says how if the officials took more time they'd have said it was a red, this is then a discussion for the rest of the week. This will happen all of the time and we're discussing what VAR should and shouldn't be used for. 
 

Im waffling on a bit but you get my point. You can't tell me that watching that Chelsea vs Newcastle game a few weeks back it wasn't great to see that last minute equaliser and knowing there's no chance it's getting ruled out. Watching Sunderland vs Newcastle today was a breath of fresh air too, a feisty local derby where some big challenges went in that would have been looked at for 2 minutes during the game to make a decision.

Before the game the presenter reminded everyone there was no VAR, the pundits said how great it was, the commentators then did the same during that game and celebrated it wasn't going to f**k up the flow of the game. Almost everyone in the game hates it, yet it's being pushed by people at the top who have no interest in what the fans want.

Until every decision is immediate like goal line technology is I just can't get behind the involvement of VAR in our game and because it's mostly around subjective opinions we'll always have unnecessary disruption.

7 minutes ago, timetowaste said:

There were some poor decisions of course but people moved on pretty quickly, I'll take a bit of human error in exchange for the excitement of scoring goals once again. Has VAR made football better? I think 9/10 people would say no.

The problem with the technology is once it's used for something there will be an argument for using it for something else but where does it end? Clear and obvious is subjective, what we might deem as clear and obvious might not be to someone else. For example, Liverpool draw a game because they don't get a borderline red card decision going their way, Klopp comes out like the grumpy entitled chode he is and complains about it post match and says how if the officials took more time they'd have said it was a red, this is then a discussion for the rest of the week. This will happen all of the time and we're discussing what VAR should and shouldn't be used for. 
 

Im waffling on a bit but you get my point. You can't tell me that watching that Chelsea vs Newcastle game a few weeks back it wasn't great to see that last minute equaliser and knowing there's no chance it's getting ruled out. Watching Sunderland vs Newcastle today was a breath of fresh air too, a feisty local derby where some big challenges went in that would have been looked at for 2 minutes during the game to make a decision.

Before the game the presenter reminded everyone there was no VAR, the pundits said how great it was, the commentators then did the same during that game and celebrated it wasn't going to f**k up the flow of the game. Almost everyone in the game hates it, yet it's being pushed by people at the top who have no interest in what the fans want.

Until every decision is immediate like goal line technology is I just can't get behind the involvement of VAR in our game and because it's mostly around subjective opinions we'll always have unnecessary disruption.

I’ll simplify your post

 

Its killed the game we all love

2 minutes ago, charierre said:

I’ll simplify your post

 

Its killed the game we all love

Yeah I could have saved myself 5 minutes by just putting this really 😂

I like VAR. England probably would have won another World Cup if they’d had Var but I still like it. 
‘Sterling was pretty good. He is direct and prepared to have a go. And it was a quality free kick. Not too many can knock over the wall and into the corner with enough pace.