Conte didn't want to be our manager. We sacked him because we had to. We'd be in a worse position now if we had kept him. 

You are so deluded!

6 minutes ago, 2211 said:

Out for me now.

I was willing to give him a chance but his stubbornness and lack of rotation is bringing his own downfall.

If he was given money for a new midfielder who do think would be most likely to get dropped first for the big games, Jorginho or Kante?

I fear if we keep him we could eventually lose Hazard, CHO and Kante.

I'd prefer to keep these players more than I'd prefer to keep Sarri.

That looks a given either way.

Discussion on Talksport currently. 

Abramovich hasn't been in London since last April and hasn't been at a single game this season.  Is that right? 

 

There is obviously a lot more wrong at the Club now we have no effective leadership in Roman's absence,  but steadying the ship and making sure that things don't get any worse on the pitch (I fear they will under Sarri) which could affect us both financially and in player recruitment for seasons to come, must be the main aim.

Look at United 3 months ago, they got rid of Mourinho and look at them now, same squad (not as good as CFC) and just that one change has had a hugely positive outcome. I regret that I do not fancy Zola as the Interim Coach, but feel certain that will happen if we lose against City and/or Spurs

 

Not to go all Claude or anything but...

It's time to go! 

39 minutes ago, wallosh said:

1 hour ago, bisright1 said:

Conte didn't want to be our manager. We sacked him because we had to. We'd be in a worse position now if we had kept him. 

You are so deluded!

its his opinion, you are opinionated, why cant he be ?

Very bleak situation at the moment.

Still very disappointed with last night.

If this result had been in isolation, you could argue that we were a bit unlucky; I did actually think we played well in the first half for the most part, and United were pretty much limited to their two chances which they took. Deserved winners, but I wouldn't say we were dominated. We were punished for defensive frailty's, but I don't think we were outplayed throughout. I am not saying it was a good performance, I am just saying under different circumstances there would be a few positives to take.

But this result isn't in isolation, we are getting beaten left right and centre at the moment. Last night we just kept the deficit to two goals as opposed to four or six. And we never actually looked like winning, that is the real worry.

I am conflicted with what to do with Sarri. I want to say he should be given more time, but the writing seems to be on the wall now. He has presumably lost sections of the dressing room; perhaps not in a rebellion sense, but it's hard to believe the players are still buying into his philosophy. In addition to this, he has undeniably lost the backing of the match going fan base.

I have never seen a Manager recover from the former, let alone the latter. Sarri would have to be the first, and there is zero evidence to suggest he can do it.

If we were willing to give him another two seasons and a squad overhaul then perhaps, but we have to be realistic here, and that is a risk I can't see the club taking whilst he is getting jeered by his own support every week. Unfortunately Sarri does not have a decorated CV to fall back on; he was a risk when we appointed him, and one which unfortunately looks not to have paid off.

I am not against Sarri and what he is trying to do. My posts over the last few months are testament to that, but he is not helping himself at the moment. I would be inclined to support an argument of giving him more time if he was doing any of the following:

1. Showing flexibility. There is no plan B. We do the same thing every game now, and are getting pummelled. He looks like he doesn't know what to do.

2. Demonstrate that 'Sarriball' is possible to implement with this group of players. If we were playing attractive football but getting beat, then patience would be easy to call for. We are not, and it just doesn't look like it can work at the moment.

3. Playing youth. If we had the likes of RLC, CHO and Ampadu in the starting line up, and you could see something growing, it would be easier to get on board and be patient. He is wheeling our the same underperforming players week in/week out, despite results.

4. Demonstrate the ability to change the game. His in game management is probably the worst I have ever seen. It's got to farcical levels now. Last night was the most absurd set of substitutions I have ever seen, and he looked like a village idiot on the touchline as a result.

Sadly, he is doing none of the above, and as a result, it's hard to buy into what he is trying to do.

I am conflicted though. Sacking him just puts us back to square one. And who would we actually bring in to replace him? Presumably an interim Manager until the end  of the season, which will see us coast through till May with no identity, no long term plan, and no reason for any key personnel to want to stay.

And in the summer, who would we land for the permanent position? Who would come? And what happens when the going gets tough again?

There isn't a quick fix or a positive answer to these questions, but what I would say is that we are fast approaching the territory for Sarri where anyone/nobody would be better than having him in charge, which is a sad but (in my opinion) accurate reflection of how bad the situation has become...

Edited February 19, 20197 yr by mclovin83

3 hours ago, EdinburghBlue said:

Would you trust a managers opinion that swaps a RB for a worse RB at 2-0 down at home in a cup game with less than 10 minutes to go? 

 

I would love to sit down with Sarri and hear an explanation behind that change because there is absolutely no logical reason to make that sub.

 

Of course fans don’t know everything but once the fans turn, particularly match going fans - it usually only goes one way.

Swapping a more defensive full back for a more attacking fullback is a fairly box standard thing done by all managers.

1 hour ago, Nibs said:

We really wouldn't.

All these rumours about "Conte didn't want to be here - we had to sack him". All bollocks. Look at Conte in that first season. He was loving life at CFC and we loved him. Something went wrong, no doubt, but if the Club had put themselves out and backed him, he would have stayed and we would 100% NOT be in a worst position to we are now with Sarri-ball.

 

 

I just remember he didn't sign an extension. Why? 

Maybe we should have backed him, but we didn't. Something didn't happen. 

I can't see how we'd be definitely better. We are 1 point off 4th and the players are in a better mood than may last year. 

9 minutes ago, mclovin83 said:

10 minutes ago, mclovin83 said:

And in the summer, who would we land for the permanent position? Who would come? And what happens when the going gets tough again??

 

Great post overall but this bit stands out to me. I do not think Sarri is the right man due to his lack of flexibility. But if Zidane (for argument sake) comes in and shows the same lack of flexibility with his approach, what do we do then? 

Like most people are saying - if Sarri was showing even the slightest bit of tactical flexibility and we were getting beaten, but playing well or showing signs of promise then I think he would have a bit more patience and support from the fans. However right now i think it is Sarri's stubborness and tactical naivety that will cost him his job. 

If we was to implement a "plan B" it would be beneficial in at least two fold: 1) It would freshen us up and give us another dimension rather than looking so stale and ordinary as we are at the moment. and 2) It would make us harder for other teams to prepare for and so should make us less predictable and easy to suss out. 

Having a solid plan B, could make Plan A more effective in the long run.

2 minutes ago, Remodez said:

Swapping a more defensive full back for a more attacking fullback is a fairly box standard thing done by all managers.

Not in the context of that game though, surely sticking either giroud or CHO on for a defender would've been a more standard last throw of the dice. 

Zappacosta for Azpilicueta might have made more sense if he did it at half time, but how many times has a right back came on with 19 mins left and changed the game? 

2 minutes ago, Remodez said:

Swapping a more defensive full back for a more attacking fullback is a fairly box standard thing done by all managers.

Probably not when said attacking fullback has barely played a minute for the first team all season, for a good reason.

I think it would also be behind bringing on another striker (Giroud), or an attacker likely to unlock a defence (CHO or RLC).

It was a bafflingly bad choice of substitute and did nothing to change the game.

There are still lots to be salvaged from the rest of the season, the top 4 fight and Europa league, not withstanding the cup final this weekend. There's no way we are going to get into the top 4 or win Europa leauge with Sarri in charge. He won't change, players aren't trying for him, and as he said he couldn't motivate them. Do it now, rather than April when everything is done and dusted. I thought we should have sacked Conte earlier last season, the patience was paid off with the FA cup. Someone like Jose or Conte always get that one big game left him them even when things are sh1t, I dare to say Sarri doesn't have it. He will just play the same game and hope for the better, it's been like that for a few months, how much more do we need? Give Zola the temp job, the least I expect is Kante plays his usual role, players get back to basics and do what they know best, and no more of this throw everyone under the bus press talk.

6 minutes ago, big blue said:

Not in the context of that game though, surely sticking either giroud or CHO on for a defender would've been a more standard last throw of the dice. 

Zappacosta for Azpilicueta might have made more sense if he did it at half time, but how many times has a right back came on with 19 mins left and changed the game? 

Depends on what the manager thinks the issue is. If it's actually creating chances then they are more likely to switch fullbacks to change up the build up play, if it's just finishing then the additional striker comes on. 

I don't know how many times but Poch was praised by the media for bringing on Rose for Lamela v Newcastle and winning the game.

8 minutes ago, icecoolguy22 said:

There are still lots to be salvaged from the rest of the season, the top 4 fight and Europa league, not withstanding the cup final this weekend. There's no way we are going to get into the top 4 or win Europa leauge with Sarri in charge. He won't change, players aren't trying for him, and as he said he couldn't motivate them. Do it now, rather than April when everything is done and dusted. I thought we should have sacked Conte earlier last season, the patience was paid off with the FA cup. Someone like Jose or Conte always get that one big game left him them even when things are sh1t, I dare to say Sarri doesn't have it. He will just play the same game and hope for the better, it's been like that for a few months, how much more do we need? Give Zola the temp job, the least I expect is Kante plays his usual role, players get back to basics and do what they know best, and no more of this throw everyone under the bus press talk.

Agree with everything except for the highlighted bit. Franco is a nice guy and the club legend but I don't trust his management skills. If we were to cut our losses with Sarri, his whole personnel would leave with him and we'll need to get someone with a bit of experience to take care of things till summer. Too bad, Steve Holland is tied up to the England job, he'd be an ideal candidate for this.

Edited February 19, 20197 yr by abramovich

1 minute ago, abramovich said:

his whole personnel would leave with him

Whilst this is the usual, it is not necessarily a given. RDM was AVB's number 2.

14 minutes ago, mclovin83 said:

Probably not when said attacking fullback has barely played a minute for the first team all season, for a good reason.

I think it would also be behind bringing on another striker (Giroud), or an attacker likely to unlock a defence (CHO or RLC).

It was a bafflingly bad choice of substitute and did nothing to change the game.

Oh, I agree. The sub itself was fine but the player being Zappacosta is probably what makes it baffling. I think even Emerson at RB would have been a better choice. Unfortunately Sarri sort of backed himself into a corner there (slightly understandable, Zappacosta is a bit sh*t) and decided to gamble and hope for the best.

Edited February 19, 20197 yr by Remodez

2 minutes ago, Remodez said:

Depends on what the manager thinks the issue is. If it's actually creating chances then they are more likely to switch fullbacks to change up the build up play, if it's just finishing then the additional striker comes on. 

I don't know how many times but Poch was praised by the media for bringing on Rose for Lamela v Newcastle and winning the game.

Spurs won that game because of a mistake by the Newcastle keeper from sons pot shot from outside the box. I'm sure poch got credit in the media, because they think he is the 2nd coming of christ, but I think it is a stretch to say rose coming on win them the game. 

If sarri believed zappacosta was more likely to change game at that death than giroud or CHO then he has lost the plot. 

 

Problem is, I just don't see who there is out there realistically who could take over. We've been through most managers already.

Sarri himself said that it would take two to three months to turn us into a great team.
That was back in August.

Now here we are almost 7 months later, and we are on a steady downwards curve and looking worse and worse.
The ugly truth is that Sarri’s ideas and influence has only made us worse since when we were supposed to be firing on all cylinders according to the man himself.

Sacking Sarri means making yet another change in system, which I don't think is going to help whatsoever. These players have now not performed longer term under multiple systems, which I think tells us something. The club have, rather than give youth more chances, rewarded the older players with longer contracts which keeps them at the club for a few seasons more. The preparation from the club to help managers over the years has finally come back to bite us in the ass. I don't expect much to change, if anything, even if a new coach came in.

Sarri may not have helped himself at times this season, but a lot of decisions are coming from the club and without any direction I don't expect us to be close to winning any trophies for a good while. If the club guaranteed stability and job safety, as well as more youth playing time then it would make the situation easier, but right now there's no sign there is. Roman is nowhere to be seen, Marina, for all her business savvy, has recruited poorly for a while. We don't have a DOF. We have a scout who thinks Drinkwater, Bakayoko and Zappacosta, Giroud (among others) are good enough to play for us. 

I genuinely don't think there's much ambition any longer at this club. The match going fans can boo the coach all they want, but how about vent that frustration towards the board and Roman? Stop playing every coach. They may pay for their tickets, but how about taking a stand and protesting like Arsenal did when they wanted a change. I suppose it's easier to blame everyone but the board though. 

16 minutes ago, Zeta said:

Problem is, I just don't see who there is out there realistically who could take over. We've been through most managers already.

This!, but then we could go for a younger manager like Lampard for example but would they want to ruin there career as manager before its even begun?.

Edited February 19, 20197 yr by jack_super_class

31 minutes ago, drjonesy1994 said:

Whilst this is the usual, it is not necessarily a given. RDM was AVB's number 2.

I'm sure Carlo and Franco would stay if asked, but I believe we'd need a more experienced manager to steady the ship.

39 minutes ago, icecoolguy22 said:

There are still lots to be salvaged from the rest of the season, the top 4 fight and Europa league, not withstanding the cup final this weekend. There's no way we are going to get into the top 4 or win Europa leauge with Sarri in charge. He won't change, players aren't trying for him, and as he said he couldn't motivate them. Do it now, rather than April when everything is done and dusted. I thought we should have sacked Conte earlier last season, the patience was paid off with the FA cup. Someone like Jose or Conte always get that one big game left him them even when things are sh1t, I dare to say Sarri doesn't have it. He will just play the same game and hope for the better, it's been like that for a few months, how much more do we need? Give Zola the temp job, the least I expect is Kante plays his usual role, players get back to basics and do what they know best, and no more of this throw everyone under the bus press talk.

The one thing I completely understand about Sarri is where Kante plays in this formation. If we played Kante there and changed nothing else, we would be even worse. Kante has only ever played an anchor role in a 3 once in his career and he was rubbish at it. 

I am frustrated Sarri hasn't contemplated this formation

Azpi - Rudiger - Luiz - Emerson

Kante - Kovacic/Jorginho

Barkley/Willian/RLC

CHO - Higuain - Hazard

It can still be his team, still passing heavy, but something a bit more stronger at the back. 

 

For me Sarri's system is crumbling because Alonso is awful and we don't have 2 midfielders who can regularly create and move ahead of Jorginho. It's not that difficult to fix for the rest of the season before we work again on it next year. But as Sarri shows absolutely no willingness to even think about a change, I think we have to move him on. Or at least have a word with him and work out what he's thinking!

4 minutes ago, enigma said:

Sacking Sarri means making yet another change in system, which I don't think is going to help whatsoever. These players have now not performed longer term under multiple systems, which I think tells us something. The club have, rather than give youth more chances, rewarded the older players with longer contracts which keeps them at the club for a few seasons more. The preparation from the club to help managers over the years has finally come back to bite us in the ass. I don't expect much to change, if anything, even if a new coach came in.

Sarri may not have helped himself at times this season, but a lot of decisions are coming from the club and without any direction I don't expect us to be close to winning any trophies for a good while. If the club guaranteed stability and job safety, as well as more youth playing time then it would make the situation easier, but right now there's no sign there is. Roman is nowhere to be seen, Marina, for all her business savvy, has recruited poorly for a while. We don't have a DOF. We have a scout who thinks Drinkwater, Bakayoko and Zappacosta, Giroud (among others) are good enough to play for us. 

I genuinely don't think there's much ambition any longer at this club. The match going fans can boo the coach all they want, but how about vent that frustration towards the board and Roman? Stop playing every coach. They may pay for their tickets, but how about taking a stand and protesting like Arsenal did when they wanted a change. I suppose it's easier to blame everyone but the board though. 

There is a thread about who is to be blamed and the majority here actually do blame the board.

Most fans see that the club suffered from selling De Bruyne and Salah that later turned out to be world class players because after that period the board decided to not trust the manager anymore and handle the transfers instead of the manager mostly, but that also backfired. Putting all the trust in 1 new striker that never had a key role in any teams during his career (Morata) after losing Costa, also backfired. 

A lot of things went horribly wrong, the club should have taken much more seriously that season when we finished 10th. Instead of putting in question everyone involved, only Jose had the privilege to take the blame, in comes Conte that over-performs his first season and the board thinks that the squad doesn't need any new key signings but only backups and if needed, a replacement here and there.
And while other teams continue to stack their squads, Chelsea is only replacing 1 proven striker with a new one, so the depth isn't there and there is no plan B, nobody to rely on if things go bad. All while the academy is shining but not used properly. It all resulted in a broken relationship between Conte and the board and his sacking.

If sacking Ancelotti and Conte was harsh, we can be sure that so far Sarri can only fetch those guys water in terms of his shown ability as our coach/manager. We should have kept trusting in Ancelotti and Conte, but now there is no reason to trust in Sarri, since the other two mentioned managers got sacked for much less.