That was almost a end of the season performance where the players could wait to get out of there. It’s very much feels like this. I think the injuries and intense schedule has taken its toll and they need to get the WC out of the way. We’ll hopefully have more players back and less of a distraction. 
 

On Potter, I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt for now. He did fantastic in the CL, let’s not forget the difficult position we were in and he got the group won. He’s had a ALOT of injuries to first team players and an intense schedule. 

However, after the WC, I’m expecting to see the results and performances to improve massively. No excuses. 

 

Potter compared us to Arsenal and said they’re more advanced than us. But they haven’t necessarily got better players and we shouldn’t have to put up with mediocre performances and mid table before it gets better. These players better than that. 
 

 

6 hours ago, Chelsc96 said:

 

There is a huge difference between a manager who has built his own squad, or had the opportunity to, and one who has not. Tuchel had two summer transfer windows and failed to improve us - in fact, it probably made us worse. The manager holds responsibility for the signings that the club makes during their watch, and it was not acceptable.

I never said the players did not carry any blame under Tuchel, but Tuchel had two major windows and one minor to correct a lot/some of these issues. But, other than Chilwell, we failed to correct any other major issue in the squad. Two summer windows were, essentially, wasted under him. He failed to improve the squad since the season he took over and, since then, it has actually regressed with the loss of Rudiger and Kante becoming a full-time patient. 

This is something fans seem to miss about his time here. 

 

Ermm you have to be kidding me. 2 finals last season (better team in both) and comfortable top 4. All that with the club being sanctioned and in turmoil. It wasn't a disastrous start to this season either, but obviously clashed with the new clueless owner. I don't blame Potter for taking this opportunity at all and I'll support him. My issue is with the owners handling of Tuchel. 

3 hours ago, The Rising Sun said:

I don't think Eddie Howe has won anything ?

He won't do well at Newcastle then 

Bound to fail. He's English.

6 minutes ago, just said:

Bound to fail. He's English.

I'm just waiting for this one to be a success....

"There’s an end goal for me and that’s managing Chelsea Football Club. My team will be winning — hopefully — very honest, very organised, very well drilled, very well prepared and with a back four".

 

Didn’t he say he gave up on managing and now he’s into board side of football?

Academy coaching!

2 hours ago, JM7 said:

That was almost a end of the season performance where the players could wait to get out of there. It’s very much feels like this. I think the injuries and intense schedule has taken its toll and they need to get the WC out of the way. We’ll hopefully have more players back and less of a distraction. 
 

On Potter, I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt for now. He did fantastic in the CL, let’s not forget the difficult position we were in and he got the group won. He’s had a ALOT of injuries to first team players and an intense schedule. 

However, after the WC, I’m expecting to see the results and performances to improve massively. No excuses. 

 

Potter compared us to Arsenal and said they’re more advanced than us. But they haven’t necessarily got better players and we shouldn’t have to put up with mediocre performances and mid table before it gets better. These players better than that. 
 

 

The problem is.. why are City & Arsenal (insert any top club) performing then?, those players are waiting for the World Cup/worried about injuries, those clubs have the same intense schedule. The point is, I think we’re just out of excuses now for the majority of these players not injured.

5 hours ago, just said:

Bound to fail. He's English.

Seems a lot more tactically astute than Potter though. It's not like Newcastle have really splashed the cash on world class players either, if he gets top 4 with them it would be an incredible achievement. 

We shouldn’t need to drop to mid table in order to rebuild. This is a squad that has made top 4 pretty much every season. 

In pretty much a calendar year, (Howe appointed 8th November 2021) Newcastle have transformed themselves from deep in the relegation places to Top-3 by signing this lot under Eddie Howe :

January 2022

Summer 2022

 

There's probably only a couple of players, maybe three, on that list that would be deemed "Chelsea quality" and yet Howe has them playing considerably better than us, and now comfortably into 3rd place.

That's the art of a good manager, the team playing better than the sum of the parts ... we are yet to see if Potter can emulate that, albeit Howe has signed several players he wanted, and Potter has not yet had that opportunity. 

 

 

 

 

11 hours ago, sonic90 said:

Potter is in a similar position as Arteta was a couple years ago. Just have to wait and see if he comes good.

He has a squad that won two trophies, made it to two cup finals and finished top 4 the season earlier, Arteta didn't have that when he took over Arsenal. 

I think people are being way too soft on him and are looking for excuses to give him more time. Nobody would have any of that if it was Tuchel in charge. The demand would be a top 4 finish, a decent Champions League campaign and aim to win one of the cups. Why should the same demands not be made of Potter?

I will be the first to say this squad isn't good enough and I think Tuchel made them look better than they really are, but lowering expectations for Potter is basically just saying he isn't good enough. 

If we had Haaland or Kane, do people think we'd be sitting where we are in the table? I don't. We desperately need a top goalscorer or two, which we've not had for years.

We never replaced Hazard, but instead we were just happy for the money got for him. We never replaced Costa, or even Drogba really. How are we expected to compete with no real goalscorer? 

As Chelsea fans we've been in this position countless times new manager lets look on the positive he's only been here a couple of months, injuries etc etc. We've also seen enough duds as well and Potter is one the atmosphere yesterday was as bad as I can remember for years he's a Liz Truss type appointment I can't see him being here for the season Tuchel is still very popular with the match going fans Potter will have the fans on his back at Newcastle if there's a repeat of yesterday.

Potter 100% got it all wrong yesterday. It was clear from minute one that we had set up far too passive, standing off Arsenal and quite frankly giving them too much respect. We are at our best (whatever that is these days) when we press teams aggressively from the front. There was none of that yesterday and we just allowed Arsenal to manage the game in their own way. It was clear that the plan yesterday was try and score on a break and win 1-0. 

If we had lost yesterday but actually put in a decent shift then I would be more accepting of it. But to set up the way we did in a home match is unacceptable. It’s something you can do when you’re managing Brighton against a good side like Arsenal, but it doesn’t fly at a “top” club anymore. Then Potter’s post match comments made things even worse, saying that the players gave everything and that we had to respect Arsenal because they’re in a better moment. Of course you respect the opposition, but you still have to impose yourself on the game and try and create chances. We were far too passive all over the pitch yesterday. It actually reminded me in a lot of ways the way that Conte set us up away at City a few years back. To say that the players gave everything is insulting to be honest because they were all awful yesterday, barring one or two exceptions. 

We should be imposing ourselves better on these types of games. The Arsenal and United games we had one shot on target across both games, and that was a 90th minute penalty. It’s not good enough. I thought Potter was supposed to be the next big thing and have us playing more attack minded football, but so far everything has been reactionary rather proactive. That approach will work on occasion, but nowhere near consistently enough for a top side to be successful. 

I actually like Potter and want him to succeed, and I think given the new owners and hopefully the new strategy coming into place then he will get the time. But he needs to be careful, he’s managing one of the biggest clubs in the country and arguably Europe and therefore needs to get out of the mentality that he’s managing a smaller club like Brighton. He also needs to be careful with what he says in the press. Every Chelsea fan could see we were poor yesterday so to say we gave everything is a dangerous line to take. That being said, at what point does this form become a serious concern for the owners? I know Tuchel wasn’t sacked purely for the results but Potter has now managed 1 more league game than Tuchel did this season and has a worse points per game record. 

We will lose against City in the week, not too fussed about that to be honest and looks like we will lose against Newcastle next week which will make it 6 league games without a win. Hopefully the World Cup will be a chance for Potter to re-assess things. We also have a few key injuries to our best players, hopefully when they come back things start to look better, but hopefully we also address the lack of quality in depth we have in certain areas. 

Things aren’t great at the mo but I do think we need to have a bit of patience. As a club we can’t continue to chop and change the manager at the first sign of things going south. He has obviously shown at Brighton that he is a talented manager, and it’s not fully translating to us yet. The constant changing of managers is why we have a mismatched squad of players going back to Conte’s time with us. City and Liverpool have both successfully implemented long term models and to an extent so have Arsenal (early days for them this season but looks as though backing the manager and signing the players he wants has paid off for them, when there has been a few times he could’ve been sacked over the last few years). But, for Potter to be here long time then the fans, and more importantly the board need to see that we are working towards something.

"Champions League qualification is regarded as a fundamental part of the business model [at Chelsea]."

- @liam_twomey
 

I suppose this where the rubber will hit the road for the owners and the fans. Will they accept missing out on top 4 given we’ve achieved every season?

2 hours ago, Scott Harris said:

He has a squad that won two trophies, made it to two cup finals and finished top 4 the season earlier, Arteta didn't have that when he took over Arsenal. 

I think people are being way too soft on him and are looking for excuses to give him more time. Nobody would have any of that if it was Tuchel in charge. The demand would be a top 4 finish, a decent Champions League campaign and aim to win one of the cups. Why should the same demands not be made of Potter?

I will be the first to say this squad isn't good enough and I think Tuchel made them look better than they really are, but lowering expectations for Potter is basically just saying he isn't good enough. 

All a bit premature though isn't it ?

Let's look at where we are today :

Top 4 Finish - behind track, in part due to injuries, but definitely recoverable

Champions League - has done all that could be reasonably asked at this stage to finish top of the group after the loss of the first fixture.

League Cup - not yet started

FA Cup - not yet started

 

For me it is very simple and the very harsh reality is that if you take ALL of the TOP 30 clubs in this world, Chelsea have, and it is not even debatable, THE WORST attacking players. And one of the most unbalanced squads because there is hardly any midfielder that can score. 

Tuchel built this three at the back system based solely on world class full backs. When they miss everything is over.

The club must bid for players like Nkunku, Rafael Leao, Joao Felix, Diaby (Leverkusen), Cody Gakpo and many others. I've only given examples of affordable ones. If you want to stay at the top you need speedsters, players that can take a man on and not affraid to dribble, explosive ones and know how to score a goal.

Armando Broja is the only one I would keep come next summer. Aubameyang, Pulisic, Ziyech, bin them and invest the money in something better.

And then we have to discuss the likes of Sterling, Havertz and Loftus-Cheek. Like really. If I was in charge I'd sell them while their value is still high. There is really no point and the most shocking one is Sterling. He is only 27 but looks like a 34 yo player that has just signed his last big money contract in the MLS and in his mind has already retired.

Plus there is question marks over Mount, too. He looks like a luxury system player. He is not a winger, not a central midfielder and not a number 10 either. He is more of a number 8 in a three man midfield and we don't play that way. He looks like he is at best when he has the system shifted to his capabilities. Do we afford to do this just to play to his strenghts? As much as I love Mase, I am affraid we don't. You do this for players like De Bruyne, Modric etc.

Lots of work to do for the new owners if they are willing to stay at the top and not just huff and puff around the TOP 4 which by the way I don't think we'll get this season. 

 

26 minutes ago, drjonesy1994 said:

Potter 100% got it all wrong yesterday. It was clear from minute one that we had set up far too passive, standing off Arsenal and quite frankly giving them too much respect. We are at our best (whatever that is these days) when we press teams aggressively from the front. There was none of that yesterday and we just allowed Arsenal to manage the game in their own way. It was clear that the plan yesterday was try and score on a break and win 1-0. 

If we had lost yesterday but actually put in a decent shift then I would be more accepting of it. But to set up the way we did in a home match is unacceptable. It’s something you can do when you’re managing Brighton against a good side like Arsenal, but it doesn’t fly at a “top” club anymore. Then Potter’s post match comments made things even worse, saying that the players gave everything and that we had to respect Arsenal because they’re in a better moment. Of course you respect the opposition, but you still have to impose yourself on the game and try and create chances. We were far too passive all over the pitch yesterday. It actually reminded me in a lot of ways the way that Conte set us up away at City a few years back. To say that the players gave everything is insulting to be honest because they were all awful yesterday, barring one or two exceptions. 

We should be imposing ourselves better on these types of games. The Arsenal and United games we had one shot on target across both games, and that was a 90th minute penalty. It’s not good enough. I thought Potter was supposed to be the next big thing and have us playing more attack minded football, but so far everything has been reactionary rather proactive. That approach will work on occasion, but nowhere near consistently enough for a top side to be successful. 

I actually like Potter and want him to succeed, and I think given the new owners and hopefully the new strategy coming into place then he will get the time. But he needs to be careful, he’s managing one of the biggest clubs in the country and arguably Europe and therefore needs to get out of the mentality that he’s managing a smaller club like Brighton. He also needs to be careful with what he says in the press. Every Chelsea fan could see we were poor yesterday so to say we gave everything is a dangerous line to take. That being said, at what point does this form become a serious concern for the owners? I know Tuchel wasn’t sacked purely for the results but Potter has now managed 1 more league game than Tuchel did this season and has a worse points per game record. 

We will lose against City in the week, not too fussed about that to be honest and looks like we will lose against Newcastle next week which will make it 6 league games without a win. Hopefully the World Cup will be a chance for Potter to re-assess things. We also have a few key injuries to our best players, hopefully when they come back things start to look better, but hopefully we also address the lack of quality in depth we have in certain areas. 

Things aren’t great at the mo but I do think we need to have a bit of patience. As a club we can’t continue to chop and change the manager at the first sign of things going south. He has obviously shown at Brighton that he is a talented manager, and it’s not fully translating to us yet. The constant changing of managers is why we have a mismatched squad of players going back to Conte’s time with us. City and Liverpool have both successfully implemented long term models and to an extent so have Arsenal (early days for them this season but looks as though backing the manager and signing the players he wants has paid off for them, when there has been a few times he could’ve been sacked over the last few years). But, for Potter to be here long time then the fans, and more importantly the board need to see that we are working towards something.

Good post, albeit it won't be 6 games without a win in the league if we lose to City and Barcodes, as the City game is a League Cup fixture. Pedantic I know ... 5 would hardly be a cause for celebration 🙂 

2 minutes ago, Sexyfootball said:

Good post, albeit it won't be 6 games without a win in the league if we lose to City and Barcodes, as the City game is a League Cup fixture. Pedantic I know ... 5 would hardly be a cause for celebration 🙂 

Sorry yeah 5 is right 👍🏻

3 minutes ago, petre ispirescu said:

For me it is very simple and the very harsh reality is that if you take ALL of the TOP 30 clubs in this world, Chelsea have, and it is not even debatable, THE WORST attacking players. And one of the most unbalanced squads because there is hardly any midfielder that can score. 

Tuchel built this three at the back system based solely on world class full backs. When they miss everything is over.

The club must bid for players like Nkunku, Rafael Leao, Joao Felix, Diaby (Leverkusen), Cody Gakpo and many others. I've only given examples of affordable ones. If you want to stay at the top you need speedsters, players that can take a man on and not affraid to dribble, explosive ones and know how to score a goal.

Armando Broja is the only one I would keep come next summer. Aubameyang, Pulisic, Ziyech, bin them and invest the money in something better.

And then we have to discuss the likes of Sterling, Havertz and Loftus-Cheek. Like really. If I was in charge I'd sell them while their value is still high. There is really no point and the most shocking one is Sterling. He is only 27 but looks like a 34 yo player that has just signed his last big money contract in the MLS and in his mind has already retired.

Plus there is question marks over Mount, too. He looks like a luxury system player. He is not a winger, not a central midfielder and not a number 10 either. He is more of a number 8 in a three man midfield and we don't play that way. He looks like he is at best when he has the system shifted to his capabilities. Do we afford to do this just to play to his strenghts? As much as I love Mase, I am affraid we don't. You do this for players like De Bruyne, Modric etc.

Lots of work to do for the new owners if they are willing to stay at the top and not just huff and puff around the TOP 4 which by the way I don't think we'll get this season. 

 

It's quite staggering the number of players we have where we don't really know what their best position is ... RLC has always been in that conversation, but now he seems to have been joined by Mount and Havertz.

Unless we change our transfer policy, we'll continue on our road  to become an average mid table team. The whole mindset of recent years needs to be totally shaken up.

All i can see this coming January window is us buying some ageing has been for a ridiculous fee and pay him ridiculous wages, or maybe three of them.

Another thing, i thought Todd was going into (analitics / performance / stats ) or what ever its called. Well so far that isn't working out very well. If the powers that be would have listened to the fans we could have saved them many millions, ie. lukaku, sterling, aubang abang, etc. Also how come every one can see the obvious mistakes but the manager can't? like playing RLC and Havertz every single week.

 

For those thinking Potter wasn't the right choice, do people think Mourinho would be a better choice as manager now with Boehly in charge? I was reading on Twitter a few people mentioning Jose should return as he would have a better chance at success now Boehly's in charge and would give him who he wanted. It was an interesting discussion, but the type of football Mourinho implements would soon piss off the fanbase again. It's always an interesting thing to think about if a year or so from now Boehly decided Potter wasn't the guy. 

5 hours ago, Scott Harris said:

He has a squad that won two trophies, made it to two cup finals and finished top 4 the season earlier, Arteta didn't have that when he took over Arsenal. 

I think people are being way too soft on him and are looking for excuses to give him more time. Nobody would have any of that if it was Tuchel in charge. The demand would be a top 4 finish, a decent Champions League campaign and aim to win one of the cups. Why should the same demands not be made of Potter?

I will be the first to say this squad isn't good enough and I think Tuchel made them look better than they really are, but lowering expectations for Potter is basically just saying he isn't good enough. 

We were just as bad under Tuchel, I didn't see us getting top 4 with him despite him being a top manager. The club is going through a big change in culture and it takes time to settle.

You're right in that our squad is superior to what Arsenal's was but the season hasn't finished yet, I don't think we'll do 8 place finishes back to back like the did.

If we suddenly start clicking in the 2nd half of the season and get top 4 then you'll be eating humble pie, it's all very short sighted. I won't be saying he's a failure until he's failed with enough time. Also see the start of Klopp and Pep's careers at their respective clubs. Wait and see.

This sums us up - we just have to give him time. We have to at some point still with a manger because if we don’t we will consistently have squads made up of 5 or 6 different managers players.

In the article it says the last manager to get 150 matches at Chelsea is 12 managers ago. Yesterday was Arteta 150 games in charge.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2022/nov/06/graham-potter-is-still-chelsea-solution-to-their-systemic-problems?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

7 hours ago, Sexyfootball said:

In pretty much a calendar year, (Howe appointed 8th November 2021) Newcastle have transformed themselves from deep in the relegation places to Top-3 by signing this lot under Eddie Howe :

January 2022

Summer 2022

 

There's probably only a couple of players, maybe three, on that list that would be deemed "Chelsea quality" and yet Howe has them playing considerably better than us, and now comfortably into 3rd place.

That's the art of a good manager, the team playing better than the sum of the parts ... we are yet to see if Potter can emulate that, albeit Howe has signed several players he wanted, and Potter has not yet had that opportunity. 

 

 

 

 

On that list, only Trippier and Bruno Guimares would be Chelsea signings, and Trippier would probably be on the bench for Reece normally. There's no excuse for Newcastle being so much better than us