4 hours ago, JM7 said:

Tuchel will happily listen to offers for Ziyech and does not trust Christian Pulisic, he is prepared to start again with his Chelsea attack and rip the current attack up. (@JacobSteinberg) #CFC

If that is true what does it say about what he thinks of CHO that he would rather put those 2 on the bench rather than him?

I am not a big fan of those news. When Tuchel came in he was more than welcome to use every player. As the pressure is clearly mounting he is ready to clean out players with a big brush. So instead of trusting players/work with players he is brushing them off to get new ones. 

Albeit this being somewhat normal in big teams Tuchels approach seems to be changing here. 

9 hours ago, Adamrb said:

It’s all very well selling all the underperforming forwards but can’t imagine there are many proper replacements on the market 

Tuchel is already missing a CB for this season, another 2-3 wingers as replacements for Werner and Ziyech would be great but it looks pretty much unrealistic to expect us to end this transfer window with so many signings.

My hope is that CHO has a breakthrough season now, if he doesn't show up this time he never will.

30 minutes ago, evissy said:

I am not a big fan of those news. When Tuchel came in he was more than welcome to use every player. As the pressure is clearly mounting he is ready to clean out players with a big brush. So instead of trusting players/work with players he is brushing them off to get new ones. 

Albeit this being somewhat normal in big teams Tuchels approach seems to be changing here. 

The risk might just be that even if he does get a new set of players by the end of the summer that he will be too scared to change the way we play because we once again wouldn't get enough time in order to be good enough in a new system and then things would look largly the same... It's insane to think that at some point I was very excited in the prospects of having both Werner and Ziyech, on paper it looked like they are already developed and ready for this new step, hopefully whoever comes next doesn't end up as underwhelming so fast.

To be fair to Tuchel, the signings of Werner, Ziyech, Pulisic, Lukaku and Havertz (unconvincing) have been a disaster. We’ve spent over £300m on these forwards and they have been shocking. We should have one of the most potent strike forces but we’re so weak. Havertz has shown some promise but he’s inconsistent. 
 

No wonder he wants new forwards. 

I mean we've targeted some average attacking players since Conte was here. Morata, Higuain, Batshuayi, Pulisic, Remy, Kenedy. Who thought those players were a good idea? 

23 minutes ago, JM7 said:

To be fair to Tuchel, the signings of Werner, Ziyech, Pulisic, Lukaku and Havertz (unconvincing) have been a disaster. We’ve spent over £300m on these forwards and they have been shocking. We should have one of the most potent strike forces but we’re so weak. Havertz has shown some promise but he’s inconsistent. 
 

No wonder he wants new forwards. 

It must be quite soul destroying being stood on the touchline and watching every forward in your squad squander a succession of decent scoring opportunities for 18 months.

Probably not quite as bad as watching from the stands or at home in front of the TV though 🙂 

And still I think Tuchel could have done better with our attackers. I also think Frank is to blame here a bit and not because he bought these players but because his team was so bad at defending. TT decided to fix that first and foremost and boy did he do that. At one point we were easily the best working unit in the world. 

I think he is part to blame on the misfirings of our attackers. The talent with our squad is immense. 

1 hour ago, evissy said:

I am not a big fan of those news. When Tuchel came in he was more than welcome to use every player. As the pressure is clearly mounting he is ready to clean out players with a big brush. So instead of trusting players/work with players he is brushing them off to get new ones. 

Albeit this being somewhat normal in big teams Tuchels approach seems to be changing here. 

Is the pressure mounting though? I doubt Boehly has told him he needs to win the PL. What I can’t wrap my head around is if he has concerns about an ageing team, why has he gone out to buy Koulibaly, offered Azpi a new 2yr contract, and if the media is to be believed after Aubameyang? I am not certain Silva & Koulibaly will hold up through out the season, and when the inevitable happens we are screwed. In the modern game you need legs to press, having Kante, Jorginho, Azpi, Silva, & Koulibaly is not sound planning despite the years of experience they bring to the table.

I mean, you never know, with the new additions in defence, we could return to having one of the strongest defences. Our CL form was because even though we scored low numbers, we didn’t concede. Obviously you can’t rely on that and sometimes you do need 2/3 goals to win a game but it could bring us closer to the top 2. 

https://www.reddit.com/r/chelseafc/comments/wkrr56/tuchel_is_holding_back_these_elite_attackers/

Bit late to re-do the front line a week into the season, isn't it? 🥲 I think it's just media speculation. Another striker will come in soon to fill the void, and should we lose this weekend, expect a knee jerk reaction in the transfer market. We could win another cup by focusing on defence and grind out tight wins, but to challenge title or even get into the top 4 we need to be more adventurous, e.g. sacrifice a CD for a attack minded or attacker. It's not possible to grind out 80-90 points, players will wear out long before the season ends.

So with Ampadu set to go out the door as well that leaves TT with those following CB options, not including the under 21s or lower.

 

Silva, Koulibaly, Dave, Trev, James, Cucurella, Emerson. 

15 hours ago, axman2526 said:

If that is true what does it say about what he thinks of CHO that he would rather put those 2 on the bench rather than him?

Ziyech has supposedly been keen to move all summer so no real surprise there. I had assumed he would probably leave if the right offer came along, although I was hoping he would stay. I cannot see CHO and Pulisic being allowed to leave too, unless we have replacements lined up. if Pulisic leaves then CHO's opportunities should immediately increase.

28 minutes ago, forbzy said:

Ziyech has supposedly been keen to move all summer so no real surprise there. I had assumed he would probably leave if the right offer came along, although I was hoping he would stay. I cannot see CHO and Pulisic being allowed to leave too, unless we have replacements lined up. if Pulisic leaves then CHO's opportunities should immediately increase.

Apart from the rumour Hazardous made up no club has been seriously linked to CP, and only Milan on loan have been linked to Ziyech. CHO has a list of admirers for loan or buy. He is much easier to shift.

1 hour ago, axman2526 said:

Apart from the rumour Hazardous made up no club has been seriously linked to CP, and only Milan on loan have been linked to Ziyech. CHO has a list of admirers for loan or buy. He is much easier to shift.

True. Ziyech loan might happen, but we also have to be wary of the number we can loan out based on new rules. So perhaps that is why we have not agreed to it so far.

1 hour ago, forbzy said:

True. Ziyech loan might happen, but we also have to be wary of the number we can loan out based on new rules. So perhaps that is why we have not agreed to it so far.

Yeah the loan did not happen as we are trying to sell him instead. Apparently offered him to Milan for just 8mill and they said no.

Everytime you hear him speak - it is so refreshing. For a while you forget about the drab football and our struggles - but seeing him smile makes me want him to be manager at chelsea for life and then the weekend comes and we start passing sideways.

Common TT - find the solutions, surely these players arent that bad.. Looking forward to Spurs - if we smash them this could be a start for us.

 

I'd like to move back to a 4-5-1, especially if we get FDJ. He's perfect for the old Lampard role, it'll allow us to play Havertz or Mount as the CAM (both are much better suited there). Kova-FDJ in front of the back 4 would completely control everything.

 

None of these attackers were firing under Lampard either, if Sterling has a massive decline this season then the system is the problem but as far as I can tell none of our attackers would get near the starting line up for City/Liverpool or even Tottenham

Son and Kane even scored under Mourinho a lot of goals. So the system has some impact but the players have the biggest influence if you score a lot of goals or not.

12 minutes ago, TheGermanOne said:

Son and Kane even scored under Mourinho a lot of goals. So the system has some impact but the players have the biggest influence if you score a lot of goals or not.

Strikers often do well under Mourinho.

How many coaches do we need to go through before we all agree that it's a club issue rather than a coaching issue?

It's happened under all 5 of our most recent managers. Do people seriously believe that Tuchel is happy seeing the players dominate the ball and then pass back to the halfway line instead of taking a chance to create something? Do you really think he is happy that after dominating one half of football, the next half we come out like somebody has handed the players sleeping pills? Obvisously not, which is why there is a video going around of him shouting at the players and accusing them of sleeping.

I don't know how we break this cycle, but I am convinced that it's an identity issue at this point. Attacking players join this club and they look full of belief and energy, just look at Sterling in the first half and then Cucurella when he came on, but as time goes on, the club seems to suck the life out of them and they get used to playing sleepy football and passing on the responsibilty to somebody else. What makes me believe it's a club issue even more is how often I see it in our youth players that have broken into the team over years. It happened to Tomori, Abraham and Christensen, it happens to Chalobah and it even happens to James and Mount. I see James putting in some absolutely worldy crosses in his early days at the club, and he still pulls them off now and again, but I have noticed of late that he shies away from putting a cross into the box and just plays it backwards. Coaches don't just tell the players to stop doing the things they are best at, they get into the team because of those attributes.

1 hour ago, Scott Harris said:

How many coaches do we need to go through before we all agree that it's a club issue rather than a coaching issue?

It's happened under all 5 of our most recent managers. Do people seriously believe that Tuchel is happy seeing the players dominate the ball and then pass back to the halfway line instead of taking a chance to create something? Do you really think he is happy that after dominating one half of football, the next half we come out like somebody has handed the players sleeping pills? Obvisously not, which is why there is a video going around of him shouting at the players and accusing them of sleeping.

I don't know how we break this cycle, but I am convinced that it's an identity issue at this point. Attacking players join this club and they look full of belief and energy, just look at Sterling in the first half and then Cucurella when he came on, but as time goes on, the club seems to suck the life out of them and they get used to playing sleepy football and passing on the responsibilty to somebody else. What makes me believe it's a club issue even more is how often I see it in our youth players that have broken into the team over years. It happened to Tomori, Abraham and Christensen, it happens to Chalobah and it even happens to James and Mount. I see James putting in some absolutely worldy crosses in his early days at the club, and he still pulls them off now and again, but I have noticed of late that he shies away from putting a cross into the box and just plays it backwards. Coaches don't just tell the players to stop doing the things they are best at, they get into the team because of those attributes.

What is it ? some kind of jinx or witches spell?

51 minutes ago, Kev56 said:

What is it ? some kind of jinx or witches spell?

Both 😆

But seriously though, all clubs have their own identity and it takes a long time to change it. We went so many years looking at Hazard and waiting for him to do something, and I think we are still like that today. We are waiting for that player to pull off something special. It's like a disease, every new player that joins the club ends up the same way.