On 08/03/2024 at 15:23, Amputechture said:

And yet he never had a falling out with Roman/Marina and actually looked like he was going to be our guy long term until the sale.

 

Get the Tuchel banner out.

To be fair he has a point and he's not wrong that this is going to be a long journey.

He accepted the job so its on him but our project sets up managers to fail in terms of short term success. We're a long away from the top when you look at that game on the weekend between City/Liverpool. We may see benefits in the long term but for now I think our fanbase needs to accept where we are, should we be closer to the top 4? Sure but I think 6th is the level of the squad playing at its maximum.

If you want to blame someone blame the owners who decided to drastically change the club in such a short period of time. While Pochettino is in the firing line and in terms of on the field stuff he should be but the owners are hiding and they have plenty to answer for with their decision making.

 

 

 

The guy is just digging an even bigger hole for himself, it's yet more "it's not me doing anything wrong, it's everyone else" and quite frankly I can't stand him. It's very weird to lead a team to 11th place and be confused about why the fans don't like him. 

I imagine Luton and Burnley supporters would be very happy if their managers led them to 11th place.

Poch is spot on here.

Any manager we hire will be the fall guy as long as people continue to operate under the Delusion we've actually assembled a talented squad capable of competing despite most the players proving otherwise every time they step onto the pitch.

1 minute ago, Whats_The_Mata? said:

I imagine Luton and Burnley supporters would be very happy if their managers led them to 11th place.

Poch is spot on here.

Any manager we hire will be the fall guy as long as people continue to operate under the Delusion we've actually assembled a talented squad capable of competing despite most the players proving otherwise every time they step onto the pitch.

If we had the same wage bill and transfer budget as Luton and Burnley, I'm sure the fanbase would be delighted with 11th. 

 

A lot of the players we signed (not all), were looking great at other clubs, yet now they look mediocre here.

 

The idea that Poch is getting the best out of this lot at 11th place is delusional

1 minute ago, Drogba1 said:

If we had the same wage bill and transfer budget as Luton and Burnley, I'm sure the fanbase would be delighted with 11th. 

 

A lot of the players we signed (not all), were looking great at other clubs, yet now they look mediocre here.

 

The idea that Poch is getting the best out of this lot at 11th place is delusional

Wage bill and transfer budget is irrelevant. 

The fact we decided to spend a small fortune on absolute crap is a massive failing and it's why we're 11th but It isn't a failing by the manager.

Our squad is laughably bad for the money wasted on it.

8 minutes ago, Drogba1 said:

If we had the same wage bill and transfer budget as Luton and Burnley, I'm sure the fanbase would be delighted with 11th. 

 

A lot of the players we signed (not all), were looking great at other clubs, yet now they look mediocre here.

 

The idea that Poch is getting the best out of this lot at 11th place is delusional

Best to ignore members who have the absolute gull to claim our squads are no better than Luton, Wolves, Brighton, or f**king Burnley. 

24 minutes ago, Drogba1 said:

If we had the same wage bill and transfer budget as Luton and Burnley, I'm sure the fanbase would be delighted with 11th. 

 

A lot of the players we signed (not all), were looking great at other clubs, yet now they look mediocre here.

 

The idea that Poch is getting the best out of this lot at 11th place is delusional

11th is not good enough right now and the manager is under performing.

Potential doesn't mean instant success though and especially when you add so many players at one time. The ownership had expectations of top 4 football by just buying a talented group of young players and mashing them all into a squad under a new manager. It's naive to even think that would work, has that ever worked?

They all look great at other clubs because they are in settled teams with experienced players. If they make mistakes its fine but if they make mistakes at this club they can't hide, they are the experienced heads now.

He's spot on when he says this is going to take time no matter who's in charge, if there was a manager that came in and turned things around for us I think we're hitting 7th at best . The league is tough and most squads have very good players now.

Poch should be sacked if we finish around 11th but in my opinion anything above 8th is a success for the squad we have and where the players are at.

 

 

6 hours ago, Sheva said:

We're a long away from the top when you look at that game on the weekend between City/Liverpool.

Personally I saw a lot of similarities between Man City's second-half performance and many of our own.

5 minutes ago, PloKoon13 said:

Personally I saw a lot of similarities between Man City's second-half performance and many of our own.

Difference is they drew the game whereas we got spanked. 

It’s already toxic so lose tonight and he’s gonna have a hell of a time getting anyone to believe he’s the right man.

39 minutes ago, El regreso said:

It’s already toxic so lose tonight and he’s gonna have a hell of a time getting anyone to believe he’s the right man.

Poch on 6 - 1 defeat ”It’s a new project, you have to understand, the players are fantastic, I am very happy with the performance”

9 hours ago, dansubrosa said:

 

Get the Tuchel banner out.

9 hours ago, Sheva said:

To be fair he has a point and he's not wrong that this is going to be a long journey.

He accepted the job so its on him but our project sets up managers to fail in terms of short term success. We're a long away from the top when you look at that game on the weekend between City/Liverpool. We may see benefits in the long term but for now I think our fanbase needs to accept where we are, should we be closer to the top 4? Sure but I think 6th is the level of the squad playing at its maximum.

If you want to blame someone blame the owners who decided to drastically change the club in such a short period of time. While Pochettino is in the firing line and in terms of on the field stuff he should be but the owners are hiding and they have plenty to answer for with their decision making.

 

 

 

I get the point that our set up and approach stifles managers in bringing short term success but i look at the Lampard to Tuchel transition and i don't see why something similar cannot be achieved now. For impact, have we ever really had anything better?

• Frank's last 10 games in that first stint, which included 2 FA cup wins, was Won 4 (2cups), Drew 1, Lost 5
• TT's first 10 games , Won 7, Drew 3, Lost 0.

To hit the same number of losses that we sustained under Frank in his last 10 games took a further 29 games under TT, with no transfer window involved. In those 29 games we conceded a total of 16 goals, 5 of which came against WBA  alone. We conceded 13 goals in the preceding 10 games under Frank alone.

Are we saying that Tuchel is the only manager around that can take a totally dysfunctional team and immediately transform them?

I know i am doing this on a semi serious note, to provoke responses, but it still remains a valid argument.

Edited March 11, 20242 yr by WhiteWall

43 minutes ago, WhiteWall said:

I get the point that our set up and approach stifles managers in bringing short term success but i look at the Lampard to Tuchel transition and i don't see why something similar cannot be achieved now. For impact, have we ever really had anything better?

• Frank's last 10 games in that first stint, which included 2 FA cup wins, was Won 4 (2cups), Drew 1, Lost 5
• TT's first 10 games , Won 7, Drew 3, Lost 0.

To hit the same number of losses that we sustained under Frank in his last 10 games took a further 29 games under TT, with no transfer window involved. In those 29 games we conceded a total of 16 goals, 5 of which came against WBA  alone. We conceded 13 goals in the preceding 10 games under Frank alone.

Are we saying that Tuchel is the only manager around that can take a totally dysfunctional team and immediately transform them?

I know i am doing this on a semi serious note, to provoke responses, but it still remains a valid argument.

That team still had alot of experienced winners compared to what we have now and they were already a settled bunch coming from Sarri/Conte.

What we have now is a completley new team with little experience and little knowledge of how they play together. Enzo has to learn how Caicedo plays and vice versa, that situation is all over the pitch. It's gonna take 2 seasons for this team to gel with a few additions and depatures, if we brought another manager in now we may get a bounce but I don't think we're getting anywhere near top 4 anytime soon. There's no way we should be 11th but I dont think a new manager takes us anywhere near to what we were when Roman was upstairs. He's right, this is a project and its going to take time and as a fan base its something we're gonna have to accept because we won't like any manager unless its someone who's been here before and won something.

I'd still sack him if we finished 11th though, cup final and 6-8th is pretty acceptable as a first season for this team.

An incoming manager has to accept the project, they won't be getting any big experienced heads in. It's likely going to be more of the same. That's what I mean by the ownership are at fault. The stocking of young players are there as an investment in hope their potential gets furfiled and then so their re-sale value grows. Toney would make perfect sense under Roman but for this group it doesn't make financial sense. They have literally stripped Strasbourg of all indentity and turned them into a feeder club in hope to turn profit on players in the long run.

 

Edited March 11, 20242 yr by Sheva

Must have been an excellent half time team talk by Poch today.

Good win today but he just can't convice me.

9 months in and we still rely on Palmer having a great game.

We are not functioning as team at all.

I still don't see any sign of an actual team that knows what it's doing. It goes through stages of ups and downs. If Newcastle were a bit better today, they would have punished us. We came out of that second half really poor, like we have done ever since Pochettino took over. Newcastle were hitting crosses to the back post and you felt like a goal for them was going to come eventually. It took a Palmer wordie to settle us.

The timing of the Mudryk sub was good, but I want to see some kind of team growing here. There is no real chemistry anywhere on the pitch, that's not good enough after 9 months. 

Also, what the f**k is going on with this goal kick routine? I haven't seen it work once yet, and we even conceded a goal from doing it against Leeds. Just stop it. If you want to play it out of defence from a goal kick, do it quickly.

Good performance but defence is still a worry every game. Concede way too many soft goals 

7 minutes ago, JM7 said:

Good performance but defence is still a worry every game. Concede way too many soft goals 

No settled CB partnership doesn’t help.

11 minutes ago, Jangz said:

No settled CB partnership doesn’t help.

Let alone missing the whole first choice defence ! 

James - Fofana - Colwill/Badiashile - Chilwell.

I'm sure some (or more like many LOL) will argue, but looking at the wages we are paying, it is pretty evident that this is what the club was intending as the back four ... plus Sanchez (£60K a week) in goal ahead of Petrovic (£25K).

It's really frustrating looking at that table right now.

If we hadn't thrown the opportunity away against Brentford, we would be sitting 9th right now, two points behind 7th placed West Ham, with a game in hand. 

I will leave the harsh criticism on a day when we don't win. Attacking wise we looked better, defence was never assured but that's what happen when you change every game. The game management after 3:1 was very poor, you could either control possession and ease the game out, stay positive and hit them for 4 or 5 ( Newcastle was there for the taking). I thought we did neither, and not good at parking the bus either ( why would we do that is another story). On another day, the referee plays 10 minutes OT, and we would have conceded the third.

We got the result and we did win H2 basically thanks to the Mudryck sub.

cant blame Poch for  the defence today. Chalobah not really a left sided player, cucu first game back. 
What I do think is  there is an over reliance on Gallagher who didn't seem fully fit, just like there was an over reliance on Silva.

The midfield 3 need a bit of rotation.